To feel vindicated by the D of H report, which confirms midwives are withholding epidurals?

[RevolutionofourTime]

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2020/mar/03/women-in-labour-being-refused-epidurals-official-inquiry-finds

I was denied pain relief during my first labour for no reason whatsoever. When I complained to the head of midwifery, she encouraged me to try a home birth next time. 🤨 I have also witnessed other women in maternity ward being denied pain relief.

Despite this, I have seen it argued here time and again that midwives are not acting as gatekeepers or withholding proper pain relief in labour.

This report confirms what many of us know.

I will be curious to see if this will lead to changes- more specifically, to adherence to the Nice guidelines that it’s never too early and never too late for an epidural in labour.

Fuck sake this is so infuriating. Why are women being treated like cattle. I found my first birth excruciatingly painful beyond anything I had imagined. I couldn't cope, couldn't get on top of it, could barely catch my breath, couldn't stand up or move. My contractions were constant with seemingly no break in between. I was utterly exhausted and so shocked at the pain, terrified by it. When I got the epidural it was the most incredible rush of relief. I can't bear to think what would have happened if I had been denied one. I did go on to have a placental abruption and lose 2 litres of blood so I wonder now if the pain level was anything to do with that, perhaps the placenta had already abrupted and the bleeding was adding to the pain. I wish I knew.

I had induction and epidural with my first. Yes it removed the pain but I could not push properly and had forceps as consequence. Not very nice. Took me ages to recover. Sex was painful for about a year.

Next 2 births were without any pain relief but I can tell you that having a brilliant midwife for my second birth made all the difference. Yes it was painful but she talked me through the pain. She made sense of it for me. The midwife I had for my 3rd was not so good but the advice I had previously been given stuck with me. No pain relief meant way faster recovery.

Not sure if that helps anybody but thought I would share.

@RedRum27, this thread is ASKING for bad experiences. There are some positive ones in there if you read every post but of course this thread is going to be on the negative side.

Yes, there are positive experiences out there. I was induced for both my babies. DS1 was born with gas & air only, didn't feel the need for anything more. DS2 was a bit tougher - he was being induced a bit earlier and was back to back for some of the labour. I started of just gas & air but was getting tired and was apprehensive about starting the synto drip so I said to the midwife "I'd like an epidural first please," and that's what happened. Both vaginal births with no instruments, 2nd degree tears which have healed fine.

That's not to dismiss those women for whom it hasn't worked out so well, they're the ones I'm thinking of whenever I'm at work on labour ward, but it is perfectly possible to have good NHS experiences.

I've only read to the end of the first page and it's too close to what i suffered.

I tell all pregnant women i know, if they all my opinion, go for the elcs. It's safer.

The NCT has a lot to answer for too. All the rubbish about a “cascade of interventions” is just that. At my NCT meeting I was the only one who put I wanted an epidural as pain relief. The “teacher” immediately tried to discourage me. I was lucky enough to be having a private birth and to choose what I wanted and what was best for me. However, the NHS should really be offering at least adequate medical care and often it is not.

@redrum, I just wrote a long post on my positive epidural but it got deleted on my phone, they gave it as soon as I asked, dispite my verbal birth plan saying if use it as a last resort, the midwifes.even said how quick the anethatist was so I must have cought her at a good time.

No pain relief meant way faster recovery.

I had no pain relief with my first and ended up with an EMCS after she got into a difficult position (had been in the pushing stage for over an hour by then). I had no pain relief for my second and ended up with an instrumental delivery and 3rd degree year. Not having pain relief does not mean you will end up with an easier birth and recovery.

3rd degree tear

If you want an epidural, my advice is to put it very clearly on your birth plan, ask as soon as you get to hospital and keep asking. Make sure your birthing partner knows to advocate for you. In my first labour, DH and I were very clear from the outset that I wanted an epidural and to be fair to the midwife in my first labour, she did seek out the anaesthetist when I first asked but they were busy. He did come an hour or so later but I was already at the pushing stage by then so they said it was too late. He did have to come and give me later one so I could have the EMCS.

With my second labour, I had written on my birth plan that I would try to do without an epidural as I was expecting the baby to be large and had been advised to stay mobile (although as I posted upthread, I ended up lying on the bed anyway!). When I changed my mind during labour, they totally discouraged me from having one so I think it's better to have it on your plan from the outset.

I had three epidurals for my three births. My birth plan was just the word epidural written in large capitals. I was politely assertive as soon as I got to the hospital and just kept on. I had them early on and had no pain though I could still feel pressure. Epidurals are bloody marvellous. I thought the NCT was bollcks and stopped going after two meetings. It was a lot of brainwashing nonsense.

I'm with Sheila Hammond - great birthplan .

My birthplan was Elective Caesarean Section - all went well .

Pain relief doesn't necessarily mean you will have a longer recovery. I didn't have an epidural but I only used diamorphine, I had this at 8cm dilation and it had completely worn off by the time I was pushing anyway which was hours and hours later. So it didn't affect my recovery at all. DD was a bit sleepy the first 24-48hrs or so which I'm assuming was related to the drug but she didn't need any extra monitoring and was fine and we were discharged 24hrs after moving to the ward. I had a long recovery in the end but it had nothing to do with my pain relief choices.

Redrum for all the mistreatment I've posted about here, I did have a 'good' birth. Second baby. It just felt 'right' and even though I'd been denied pain relief and admission to the ward, it was quick and the pain was manageable. I felt fine straightaway afterwards as well and went straight home.
Nothing I'd have said or done would've got me those epidurals but my advice in hindsight is: ring them and say you're going in as early in labour as you can. Tell them you're having regular contractions and that you're on your way. If they tell you to hold off, say it's not possible due to travel time, you are on your way you're ringing to let them know. When you get there, tell them you want an epidural. When they disappear, get your birth partner to keep going to the desk to tell them you want an epidural. If they try to send you home, refuse. You're in labour, you're choosing to labour in hospital. The end. You'll be staying put.
Most importantly, your birth partner isn't there with a front row ticket to a show, they have been chosen by you because they will need to advocate for you when you can't voice what you need yourself. If they are meek or tiptoe around authority then you need to pick someone else. They are there to be your voice and support.

I worded it badly. For me the epidural led to an inability to push and so led to forceps. Subsequent births without pain relief meant I was able to push and move into a really good position leading to a more straightforward delivery.

Of course you are right not having pain relief does not mean delivery will be straightforward but for me the epidural led to a difficult delivery. It is only one person's experience. If I were pregnant again I would still want the option of an epidural even knowing the risks.

Well if women in 3rd world countries don’t have epidurals then clearly we shouldn’t either - what an absolute crock of shit!

Well if women in 3rd world countries don’t have epidurals then clearly we shouldn’t either - what an absolute crock of shit!

Quite. Some of them don't have clean water or toilets, so presumably the rest of us can do without those too.

Well if women in 3rd world countries don’t have epidurals then clearly we shouldn’t either - what an absolute crock of shit!

'Developing countries have poor education, infrastructure, improper sanitation and/or poor access to healthcare.' The people in these countries often don't have their BASIC needs met. Sadly, t
there is no comparison.

Redrum please don’t worry. By its very nature this thread is

I had a very positive birth. I had to press harder than I would have liked to get an epidural but I had one, it was wonderful, and I credit it for the ease of the final stage of labour for me. With no pain I felt in control and could listen and do exactly as instructed by the midwife, DD was pushed out in less than 10 mins with no problems whatsoever. I was back on my feet walking a couple of hours later and had a very speedy physical recovery.

@RedRum27 there are positive birth threads on MN if you look for them!

I already know I don't cope with pain. I've gone into shock with pain, become delirious with pain and I already know what it's like to be unable to sleep due to constant pain. I want to be believed when I ask for what I know I need.

Wasnt given epidural despite several requests during birth but then needed one afterwards because I was hemorrhaging so badly they needed to sow me up in theatre. Still miffed.

@MamaFlintstone

At this stage given all the reports that keep coming out, time and time again, about avoidable deaths and women’s experiences, I think there does need to be an examination of the attitudes and practices of the profession as a whole.

I agree completely. Morecambe. Shropshire. East Kent. We don’t know that the latter two of these terrible scandals were due to the attitudes and practices of midwives, but we do know that Morecambe was. Nonetheless, early indications suggest that all three scandals have something in common.

There are some serious questions to be asked and answered.

I was denied and ended up with a spinal block after things went completely tits up after a 4 day labour and emergency c section. That was 10 years ago and I was very very much of the opinion that I was put thru hell to save money as ceasareans and epidural so expensive as they require an anethistist and slow down slow down labour. My neighbour who is a midwife very much confirmed my suspicions

I was told at 8cm it was too late and I couldn't have one. I told them if I didnt have one I wouldn't push and I'd doe. Got my epidural. No way would I have managed without.

Dippy my birth plan was basically ‘give me drugs’ and both me and DH assertively asked from the moment I was admitted. The response was to tell us both we were over-reacting and that “there’s no way this baby’s arriving today”. They completely discounted every single thing we said even though it wasn’t our first and we both knew damn well I was progressing quickly. I gave birth about an hour after being told the baby wouldn’t arrive till the following day. They just didn’t listen to anything we said. It’s like they got it in their heads we were hypochondriacs which we really aren’t! Still pisses me off and it was years ago.

First baby: I was refused an epidural- told by midwife that I didn't need one. Had to have one after the birth though as bleed so heavily due to massive haematoma (which midwife missed). Second baby was told: 'well you didn't have an epidural for your first, so you won't need one for this one.'
Awful attitude. I feel we are all owed a huge apology.