To think that the world would not be a better place without Heidi *Content Warning - abortion/disability edited by MNHQ*

[bridgetreilly]

Heidi is 24 and has Downs syndrome. She is beautiful and brilliant and very articulate in explaining why the UK abortion law is discriminatory in allowing abortion up to full term where the child has Downs syndrome (and other non-fatal disabilities including cleft palate or club foot), when the standard limit is 24 weeks.

She's not the only one to think that. The United Nations’ Committee on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities’ concluding observations on the initial report of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland made a key recommendation that the UK change its abortion law on disability so that it does not single out babies with disabilities. However, the Government has decided to ignore this recommendation.

Heidi, along with the mother of a young boy with Downs syndrome, is planning to sue the government for discrimination. She is amazing and I hope she wins.

There are so few abortions after 24 weeks and those that happen are because of test results that can only be decided after that time.

How dare you try to take away a woman’s right to choose what happens to her body and her life as a cater after that child is born. Because it will be the mother who must be responsible for the child for the rest of their life.

If she chooses that then it is more powerful than it being forced upon her. Would you rather children were abandoned at birth or mothers commit suicide because of the ptsd and trauma of being forced to carry a child and then care for a gold that they might not be fit to look after?

Get away with your emotive straw man arguments. Women are adults and mothers need to have their choices respected, what ever they choose.

@Newtonpass there are other grounds for late abortion.

@GothamProtector

I’m not saying that the mother shouldn’t have the right to choose to have an abortion if she wishes, that is her right the same with any pregnancy.

My point is that my nephews life his worth no less than yours or mine and the same 24 week restriction for abortions should apply.

I can only ethically support abortions post 24 weeks if the baby would be so disabled it would have no quality of life, the baby is unfortunately incompatible with life, or the risk to the mothers life is too great to continue.

Most children with Down’s syndrome have a good quality of life, so I cannot ethically agree with it.

Maybe personal experience clouds my opinion, but I’d like to think I’d feel the same whatever.

And also having worked with children with DS I opted out of any tests for it at all with ds and dd. The midwives seemed incredulous but I told them the results wouldn't make me terminate anyway, so there was no point to them.

@Catapillarsruletheworld why should women be forced to have babies they don’t want?

Who looks after the mothers who have to give birth to potentially a severely disabled child?
Who picks up that trauma?

I think abortion should have no upper limit. Its irrelevant if there's a disability.

The alternative to abortion is forced birth.

I can never support forcing a woman to give birth against her wishes.

Your title is rather disingenuous but I think it is a very valid point they are making.
Why is disability discrimination acceptable inutero when it is challenged in all other cases?
Perhaps a compromise would be to decrease the amount to 30 weeks or similar giving enough time to carry out further tests and to confirm diagnoses. (Though obviously this would still be discriminatory)

I genuinely cannot comprehend the mentality of people who believe that viable babies (without medical issues) should be allowed to be terminated until the moment of birth. I know these cases are incredibly rare in reality but the idea that some people think it ok to kill a baby who is full term as the mother’s rights are more important than the life of a baby is abhorrent.

People with DS are being discriminated agains as the abortion laws are different. Lord Shanklin. (Think thats his name.) Did a very good talk on this (with fcts and firgures) in the house of Lords. Also mums going in for checks are being offered abortions when they have already made up there minds and counted as term. That is not right and puts pressure on parents. Gives the message that people with DS are worth less.

Most children with Down’s syndrome have a good quality of life, so I cannot ethically agree with it.

Only if they have good quality care I would imagine.

I don't see hoards of people queuing up to adopt babies with DS and sadly, there are many children's homes I wouldn't even place my dog in.

Who is going to care for them for the rest of their lives?

Discrimination how? On what basis? And against whom?

Well we can certainly settle the discrimination suit by removing the 24 week limit entirely. Presumably the complainants would be satisfied with that.

51zsazsajuju there shouldn't be.

My DN has experience of late term abortions and poured her heart out to us after one such shift. Thankfully they are uncommon but I would certainly hope something that horrific would never happen unless absolutely necessary (i.e the child was going to die anyway/ the mothers life was in danger)

It is not disability discrimination as all rights and choices rest with the mother, it is her body and her decision.

I’m opposed to any further restrictions on abortion rights. Her body, her choice.

You know what, the thread title and OP are manipulative bullshit. To equate women making the choice to terminate a pregnancy with people saying Heidi shouldn't exist is fucking stupid and offensive.

People with DS are being discriminated agains as the abortion laws are different

In what way are they being “discriminated against”? Do you know what “discrimination” means?

Disability is no reason to extend the planned termination date beyond the 24 weeks cut off. Better screening prior to the cut off is essential. And as is always needed actual resources and support for parents where the pregnancy is unwanted or the parent isn't up to it. Because not everyone is and that is ok. Women need to stop being expected to be automatically the mother their child needs.

Most children with Down’s syndrome have a good quality of life

And the children that don't? What about them? And why should women be forced into taking the gamble as to how disabled the child will be?

Many children with DS can have and do have a good quality of life...but what about the ones that don't.
Many mothers are unwilling to take that risk. I wouldn't.

apologies the word ‘healthy/neurotypical’ should have been included there.

Heidi's mother had a choice in her pregnancy.

She had the choice to end it or to continue it.

She chose to continue.

It is ironic that she and her daughter now want to remove that same choice for other women.

My biggest thought is that if they are want to further restrict abortions beyond 24 weeks. They then MUST ensure that women get the 20 week scan. Bang on 20 weeks, without any delay, likewise follow up tests need to be prompt.

I can easily see how things end up beyond 24 weeks, scan being late, further tests, follow up appointment, time to think, book appointment. Pushing over 24 weeks.

I might be wrong but I think a cleft palate can be a life threatening condition.