Are you still pro-Brexit?

[Fatasfooook]

Brexit will have soon cost the UK more than all its payments to the EU over the past 47 years put together

www.businessinsider.com/brexit-will-cost-uk-more-than-total-payments-to-eu-2020-1?fbclid=IwAR3E3Xc8p0bgNF06hCJZzr61Ak-6VetNbFv5vrfsV041nPvDZeFSCnjHcdg&r=US&IR=T

Where is the personal insult?

You think comparing an adult to a tired and emotional three year old isn’t insulting? Seriously?

If only it were done! Just a few decades of uncertainty to go! Whoop whoop!

Imagine how it feels to, 4 years later be hearing that people voted leave to avoid an EU Army (among other reasons). Awesome.

This issue will divide a generation. People will want to talk about it for decades. 4 years is nothing.

Well Sunshine so far you lot have dismissed, disparaged and ignored every other reason you’ve been given so why should an EU army not be added to the list of things you’ll sneer at?

More than one generation.

I haven't sneered at any reasons thus far unless I'm missing something somewhere. My issue, as I've repeatedly set out, is the gamble taken on my behalf.

Do you accept it's possible that this won't go well? What do you think will happen if it ends badly?

The EU Army point is particularly frustrating because it's very clear that we could have used our veto on the issue and that there was no way we could have been forced into an EU Army. That information is readily available.

Oh, and I make the point again that I will be angry about this even if it goes well. There is no outcome that will make me think taking such a huge gamble on behalf of others was ever worth it.

Maybe it’s because those that voted “because I didn’t want to be part of an EU army” didn’t realise that it wasn’t even remotely likely to happen and was Leave’s own pet Project Fear?

FieldOfFlameAndHeather, you have so eloquently expressed my thoughts, thankyou.
May use your words if I get stuck in a conversation...I have a very bitter cousin

Sunshine, how could you be unhappy even if it goes well? That's really twisted.

@Emsey

If Brexit doesn't go well I'm sure your cousin will remember your conversations. Might be worth keeping that in mind.

It really isn't. If someone came up to me and told me they'd bet my house on a horse and in 2/5/10/20 years it might mean I'd end up with two houses or it might mean that I would lose my house altogether I would be very angry with them.

I would be very relieved if the bet paid off and I ended up with two houses but I would still be angry that they placed the bet in the first place.

Brexit is a massive bet. Could go any number of ways, some good, some ok, some disastrous. Whatever the outcome, I'm not ok with it.

Oh, and I make the point again that I will be angry about this even if it goes well.

Bizarre logic. oh well, either way you’re dedicating the rest of your life to living it in anger. Enjoy.

Sunshine, she's volatile and not particularly kind to others in general. It's no loss.

Anger is an excellent motivator when it comes to campaigning for change. Where would we be if everyone just accepted things they thought were wrong?

Who did those jobs before freedom of movement within the EU?

Actually, who did that? Was it possibly the windrush generation and the Irish, e.g. immigrants....?

Given that the world has massively changed in the last 30 years, what do you suggest?

Actually, who did that? Was it possibly the windrush generation and the Irish, e.g. immigrants....?

Quite possibly. And?

The amazing nature writer Roger Deakin writes about this in one of his extraordinary books - Waterlog I think - or ‘Wildwood - a journey through trees’. He writes about the fields and fields of gypsy travellers who arrived and set up caravan encampments every season to pick fruit and vegetables across the uk.

It’s just the old Kelly Osbourne argument isn’t it? I cringe whenever people use it thinking they are being so right-on when it’s actually a rather offensive and demeaning argument to put forward.

Don’t be depending on the Irish to pick your fruit and wipe arses this time btw. They’ve much better opportunities within their own thriving country and the EU.

Slightly tangential, but I’ve never seen a good argument for not having some kind of strong mutual military cooperation in Europe that does not rely on the US too. Call me names, but it’s in our interests to protect Europe, it’s our buffer territory. Much stronger argument for that than getting involved in Middle Eastern politics we don’t fully understand.

Years ago - hundreds - kids helped with harvesting. It’s why the school year is the way it is. They’re also the only people who don’t have to worry about not getting a wage for the rest of the year.

I agree. I’ve never really understood why people got so worked up about the spectre of an ‘EU army.’

With regard Leave voters not knowing what they voted for, I (now) realise that leave voters did know exactly what they voted for. They are willing (for us) to pay any price for Brexit, no cost is too great.

Peace in NI
Brexit is more important
Car manufacturing
Brexit is more important
Food standards
Brexit is more important
Workers rights
Brexit is more important
Galileo
Brexit is more important
Euratom
Brexit is more important
Farming
Brexit is more important
EU pandemic early warning system (EWRS)
Brexit is more important
European medicines agency
Brexit is more important

Nothing (even the birth of the New IRA) will turn you away from Brexit, I realise that now, and as each new cost becomes clear, instead of reassessing, it just makes you hate the EU even more.

I’ve never seen a good argument for not having some kind of strong mutual military cooperation in Europe that does not rely on the US too.

Totally agree. I’d far prefer to have support from France/Germany when squaring up against Russia or China.

The brexiteers have this bizarre narrative about standing alone which makes absolutely no sense to me in the modern world.