to say if you work, please join a union

[frankie80]

I have been off work for a year due to bullying, discrimination etc that caused me to have a breakdown and feel suicidal.

I went to my workplace rep who was nice and sympathetic but quickly realised she was out of her depth who passed me to the regional equality rep who has been absolutely amazing.

Thanks to my union, I have had:

1. my grievance and appeal letters written for me and damn, they are good. my work have struggled to wriggle out of what they have done

2, representation at all formal meetings from senior union officials 3, full pay for 12 months negotiated by my union 4, no annual leave taken off me even when I took (pre booked) holidays so I have had 40 days carried over into this year on top of this years entitlement 5, no bullshit. My union have been 100% honest about my case, whats strong, what's not strong 6, downgrading a disciplinary to a first written warning when it was looking like dismissal and pointing out to my employer that I am now adding victimisation to my case 7, introducing me to people who have had similar experiences for support network 8, got my employer to pay for specialised counselling (not the employee assistance programme) 9, got policy changes agreed in my workplace 10, got reasonable adjustments in place for me, including ones I hadn't considered 11, put an employment tribunal claim in for me 12, negotiated a positive reference for when I ever decide to leave 13, negotiated additional responsibilities etc for me at work in light of not being promoted due to my protected characteristics 14, putting me through union representative training so I can help colleagues 15, pushed for my line managers to be disciplined, if not fired, ensured their behaviour was not swept under the carpet 16, just sat and listened to me, let me cry and cry 17, answered emails and text messages at weekends and evenings. 18, sent me a very nice email saying how qualified, experienced and capable I am, not to mention strong and resilient and that they weren't just saying that because it was their job but that they were genuinely impressed with me.

I know so many people who are not in unions who got shafted by my employer. I was in a union since the age of 16 when I worked part time in a shop, now I'm full time in the public sector. My parents always insisted I join one and I thank them for that. I've only needed my union twice in my career but this occasion has been the biggie.

So although I've been a member for 17 years, I knew that didn't mean I was paying for nothing. You never know when union membership might be needed.

My union is Unison and I am so grateful to them because I really do not know how I would have coped this year without them. I do not have legal cover or anything like that I could have used instead. I did try going to HR at first but they were utterly incompetent and downright nasty - another thing that will feature in the tribunal claim. I am HR qualified btw so I'm not the typical HR hating employee.

So if you are in employment, please join a union, you don't know when you might need one. Yes there are workplace reps who are not very good (I've had some myself!) but always push for the regional rep if you aren't happy. I'd always rather be in a union than out of one.

Also don't make the assumption that if you are in a union then everything will go your way. If you steal something they are not going to pat you on the head, give you false hope and stop you from getting fired. They will, however, advise you of your options.

Anyway, if you join a union, make it Unison. They aren't just for the public sector.

I think you miss out that the union had to be recognised by the employer

@SunsetView

I paid into a union for twenty years It didn’t stop me being made redundant They done nothing

Did they fight for you to get increased redundancy?

Probably not as they are useless.

I’ve been in a union most of my life - varies depending on job (currently unison) I have found them very helpful with advice re employment law they also have a benevolent fund for those struggling financially and often offer discounts on things like insurance
My employers also have an employee insurance scheme that gives free legal advice and things like counselling HR support etc

No @Holiday124 , they done nothing regarding redundancy payments.

I genuinely feel I wasted thousands of pounds over the years paying into the union.

Most union reps were poorly trained , incompetent and bitter.

I never had need of a rep for any meetings , but if I had been going into a meeting I’d rather just go in and take a respectful reliable colleague than some of the reps the union provided.

To be honest it was a direct debit set up from my pay every month and just let it carry on when I shouldn’t.

I think nowadays with employment laws and rules being so tight that most companies have to do the right thing. And that union’s in my opinion are not worth it.

The only time I hear unions being used is for ridiculous pay rise disputes or strikes and in the modern day I don’t think this is right.

Mostly jobs that already pay well above average national pay that are seeking to disrupt transport etc to get above inflation pay rises.

I don’t see unions as fighting the cause for the little man , I see them as large money grabbing entities nowadays.

Totally agree

Trade unions are amazing. Everyone should join one.

Trade unions are amazing. Everyone should join one.

Not for all the tea in China

Which unions represent the freelance/gig economy and how easy is it to raise a grievance or claim your rights when you are not even recognised as an employee?

@humadum

Which unions represent the freelance/gig economy and how easy is it to raise a grievance or claim your rights when you are not even recognised as an employee?

Exactly , there is no money to be made by the unions supporting the little guys like this.

This would be where they could really help as they were initially set up to do.

@Mantlemoose

You clearly know very little about unions and I'm guessing your DH wasn't a member and the others who were kept on were? If that is the case, then you can't blame the union - he should have joined.

Every union has paid full time officials and unpaid volunteer reps/stewards in the workplace. I was helped by the (paid) official who also passed me to a lawyer as every union has a law firm connected to them.

Most of the negativity comes from people who didn't join the union, or only joined when there was a problem (and acted surprised and annoyed when the union said they couldn't help with something that started before they joined).

Unions are not something you jump in and out of whenever it suits you. They couldn't operate that way.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, I'm not an employee of the union nor have they asked me to write these posts. I am a genuine grateful member and I think others could genuinely benefit from membership.

@humadum

Which unions represent the freelance/gig economy and how easy is it to raise a grievance or claim your rights when you are not even recognised as an employee?

try iwgb - I've heard they are helping gig workers

We weren’t allowed to join one

@Holiday124

I think you miss out that the union had to be recognised by the employer

actually, you can be a union member even if your employer doesn't recognise one.

www.gov.uk/join-trade-union/trade-union-membership-your-employment-rights

MNHQ can check - I'm a long term member, not an advertiser

I found Unison totally clueless and actually acting against policies supporting the employer. I decided to go without them, did my own letter of grievance, pointed out where they, and the Union were acting wrongly. My letter was initially turned down, so I took it higher up and sure enough, they agreed that the whole process had been a farce and Unison had provided the employer incorrect information. Not only did I benefited from it by them taking back the decision, but all my colleagues.

I certainly ditch them there, but a colleague of mine also found them totally useless and came to me, and sure enough I managed to help her get what she was legally entitled to, where the Union were advising her that her requests were not reasonable.

In the end, it just comes down to the individuals. There are a few who are very good, but plenty who are just totally clueless and you find yourself educating. It's frustrating.

Although I am pleased for you that you had a good outcome, your dismissal of other people's experiences as being because they either weren't in a union or had joined too late to get advice, does not come across well. Sadly, there are some poor union reps out there. And the non-advice I had from my union came from their central office. I have also been in the unfortunate position of sitting on disciplinary panels relating to a position I hold at work. Without exception, the union reps from one particular union have been useless, actually advising the client badly.
So, whilst some unions and union reps may be helpful, it is not fair of you to dismiss those of us who have had a poor experience in the way you have.

I'm glad they worked well for you OP, but in my case Unison were less than useless, the rep (who was very abrupt and spoke over me) just wanted a quick resolution that made it look like she was solving everything, her main solution was for me to change workplaces so I didn't need to be near my bully, the new base was 20odd miles further away.
She was definitely working for the management and not for me.
The people who were brilliant in all of it, were the Human Resources team and my GP.

I think you miss out that the union had to be recognised by the employer

No it doesn't. We don't have a recognised union (not enough members,) but I had Union representation when HR put me through a disciplinary (which my union rep pointed out could have been avoided, if they had done a proper preliminary investigation, which would have found me not guilty at that point.

A union does need to be recognised if you want joint pay negotiations and that sort of thing. 30% of the employees need to be members for it to have to be recognised, but they can opt to recognise before then.

Union experiences are usually only as good as the rep you deal with, in the same way that HR and other services can be dependent on who you get. Not all reps are great, but if you get one that is, they are worth their weight in gold.

I think it depends on your industry - I work in financial services and I don’t know anyone in a union at my level unless you count professional bodies. However, I could see where they would benefit people who may not have the resources to fight their own case. Having said that I know people who haven’t had good service from their union when they needed it - but on balance a union may be the right choice.

I was union member.
I want to be pro-Union...
Problem is I don't agree with barely any high-profile stance my union has taken in last ... 8 years? Especially when they decide to strike based on these positions. About our pensions, covid-management, opposing job cuts or contract terms security.

I'm not opposing them, but I can't support them, either.

Nope, never again. HUGE waste of my money.

I remember your thread and pleased to hear a positive update for you

In fairness, if I was joining another union, I wouldn't join Unite as they are far too left leaning. I'mm told Unison has a mixture of members from all political parties. You can also opt out of paying towards Labour. They have some equality member groups and some good campaigns that I believe in too. Some of the smaller unions look good - community and prospect have been good for charities although Unison also helps charity workers.

The IWGB looks great. However, I am not sure how it will work in my situation. I am one of a large number of freelancers who work for a company on what is supposed to be a 'self employed' basis. Freelancers rarely get together, but we must face the same issues. Without unity, unions cannot work, and the working patterns, perhaps deliberately, keep individuals separate.

There are complex 'working' patterns and situations emerging as remote working has become more prevalent, and although the IWGB is a positive step forward, it does not really represent this 'invisible' but growing sector of the workforce.

I think that Unions need to sever the link with the Labour party.

Most people in the UK do not vote Labour, the unions are limiting their appeal by being so close to labour.

Unfortunately I can’t say the same. I faced redundancy at 19 and all my colleagues reassured me the union would help us - they didn’t. Never heard from them, didn’t really bother to help us and we all lost our job. My colleague who has been part of the union since he was 16 (he was 71 at the time of his redundancy and worked for the railway - a very heavily unionized industry) was very disappointed and cancelled his membership after this. I’m glad it helped you so much though, OP. Good luck to you.