To say it’s us or the dog

[Totallyfedupnow]

My mother is visiting for a few days and has brought her dog, which is an 8 year old rescue dog. While I was out, the dog jumped up and attacked my TV, knocking it off the low table it sits on. In the process the screen was badly fractured, the TV no longer works and is most likely unrepairable. The TV is almost new (only about eight months old) and no, not insured, and yes, it’s the only TV we’ve got. Apparently there was a penguin on TV that the dog didn’t like and he just went for it.
This is bad enough. But as it’s got older the dog has started getting spooked more and more often, and every so often it will take exception to something inoffensive my son (aged 6) does (like standing up or coming into a room) and go for him too. Last time it bit him on the shoulder (lightly) and frightened him badly. At Christmas it got spooked by my niece (aged 7) when she and my son were playing with toys on the carpet and went for her. It has also bitten the back of my calf as I left a room. So far no blood has been drawn but it is frightening and who knows if or when the bites will become more serious. And now I’ve just lost our TV.

The trouble is my mother is devoted to her dog, and always finds an excuse for why he was “provoked” (at Christmas my sister was blamed for letting the children play with their Christmas presents on the floor....). She now has a crate at her house which she puts the dog in when visitors come, but I don’t have room to store a crate in my home. I think we are now at the stage where I am
going to have to say, if you visit us you have to leave the dog with a sitter. My mother is not going to like that AT ALL as she is devoted to both my son and the dog, sitters are expensive, and she is a pensioner. Aibu?

Better that you lose your job through lack of childcare, than your child (or anyone else’s child) is seriously injured by a dog bite.

Yabu to allow your child near s dog that has bitten in the past and is jumpy and scared.

she is devoted to both my son and the dog

Is she though?

I don't see it. A GM who is devoted to her GS doesn't allow dogs to bite him, & would take immediate action in the event that one did.
Not ignore you & carry on as if it hadn't happened

People who are devoted to their dogs take responsibility for them, for their training, & for making damn sure nothing happens in 'the human world' that the dog is going to get blamed for.

I don't see any devotion going on here.
Just a silly woman who wants everything her own way.
Has she offered to save up & replace your broken telly?
No. Thought not.
"She's a pensioner" means she gets a free pass, does it? Because obviously "a pensioner" cannot possibly go & do a little work somewhere to pay a debt, or afford a dog-sitter.

"Last time it bit him on the shoulder (lightly) and frightened him badly. At Christmas it got spooked by my niece (aged 7) when she and my son were playing with toys on the carpet and went for her. It has also bitten the back of my calf as I left a room."

So the dog injured your child and you continued to allow the dog to be around your child, even after it continued to be aggressive to others.

NOW you want to ban the dog, because it's broken your precious TV?

What the fuck is wrong with you?!

YABVU

You should have stood up to your mother a long time ago. If you are struggling to do that perhaps some counselling and reading would be helpful to you.

My mum has Doberman’s and she is also devoted to them so we only ever go to her as she can’t leave them for too long but if one of them went for one of my children she wouldn’t hesitate to either rehome the dog or even get it put to sleep .

she takes the view that in her house she makes the rules

So presumably she'll be okay with you saying the same in yours - which will mean her dog never visits you again?

I'll probably get flamed for this, but I'm not sure why folk keep saying it needs "training" either. The thing's attacked 3 times now - isn't that about the point where most would consider it time to say goodbye?

My dogs are nice natured and well trained and I still don't allow them around my GC except in very specific circumstances i.e. quiet, calm times and only when there's at least 2 adults present. It's your DM's responsibility to ensure people's safety from her dog and if she refuses to do that, especially around DC then you will have to.

Don't allow yourself to feel guilty, it's hard I know but this is a problem of DM's own making and you can't protect her from the consequences, except to ensure the dog doesn't hurt anyone in your home. Have a stock phrase ready to counter any arguments/guilt tripping/persuasion from DM, maybe 'the DC's safety has to come first' or similar and refuse to be drawn any further on the subject.

Good luck with telling her, she probably won't take it well but it has to be done

@puzzledandpissedoff

I'll probably get flamed for this, but I'm not sure why folk keep saying it needs "training" either. The thing's attacked 3 times now - isn't that about the point where most would consider it time to say goodbye?

I’m not going to flame you, but...

When you take on a Rescue Dog, you’re making a commitment to that dog, it’s not just getting a cheap dog. You owe it to them to help them settle in and,more often than not, learn new behaviours as many of them have been neglected and abused.

The dog hasn’t ‘attacked’, if the dog had attacked he would have actually bitten - breaking the skin etc - he hasn’t, he’s just let them know he’s scared/upset. Obviously that can’t continue but they need to work out why the dog feels like that and train the dog to understand whatever it is, isn’t a threat.

A scared dog needs help, not rehoming or PTS.

1. stop allowing your mother’s discomfort and love for her dog override the safety of your child

2. stop allowing your mother to run roughshod over your decision-making

You are being unreasonable by continuing to allow that dog around your child. Like it or not, the bald truth is that that is what is happening here: you are allowing that dog around your child. You are. Stop it. Before he gets seriously injured.

Stop taking him to your mother’s house until she gets rid of the dog or puts it outside the house in its crate for the entirety of your visit.

Stop allowing her to visit your home with that dog in tow.

It will require hard conversations (in person, not by text - don’t be one of those cowardly people), and it might end up with her being incredibly angry or hurt, but in this circumstance, well, I’m sorry, but tough shit.

That dog has bitten 3 people and smashed a telly. She is not taking responsibility for her dog or its serious behaviour issues. She is showing no signs whatsoever of trying to deal with it and, frankly, should not be allowed to have a dog. It is a dangerous dog because she is a dangerous dog owner. It’s a matter of time before someone is seriously hurt. Tell her all of that. And then tell her that until the dog is gone she will not see you or your son while the dog is around because the dog can not be trusted and the safety of her grandchild must come first.

Stop putting her hurt feelings ahead of your son’s physical safety.

A scared dog needs help

Very true. But OP’s mother is clearly not the person to do that or she already would have it in and would have recognised the seriousness of the dog’s behaviour after the first incident.

I am forever baffled by posters coming here and outing themselves as negligent parents.

^This

Seriously OP I don’t get it. Whilst you are still your mom’s daughter, you are an adult and shouldn’t kowtow to her as if you guys were still in that mother-child role. You are lucky that the dog hasn’t drawn blood, he is scared and showing it, and your mother doesn’t have the dogs best interests at heart because if she did, she wouldn’t repeatedly put it in situations where he has time and time again shown that he is stressed and scared.

You need to look at alternative childcare if your reliance on your mother coming over means that you willingly put your child at risk. What if the dog nips at his face and catches his eye? Or gets proper scared and really goes for it?

@BiscuitBarrels

I didn’t say she was (& I agree with you, she’s not!!), I was replying to @Puzzledandpissedoff asking why training keeps being suggested rather than just getting rid of a dog (in general)

It annoys (& upsets) me that people, like the OP’s mother, and many on MN think that ‘getting a Rescue’ means they’ve ‘done their bit’ and don’t make a commitment to the dog - in terms of getting it the help & training it needs.

So the dog has bitten OP and two children? How the hell is it still alive?

@BestOption I agree. A rescue is a big commitment. A puppy is more of a blank canvas, still a big commitment in terms of training and time etc, but in many ways a blank canvas nonetheless. Whereas with a rescue, especially one where the history isn’t known, you’ve committed to have the dog, and help deal with the issues that come with its past. That means potentially finding and paying for expert behavioural help, and people should be open to the idea that that may be necessary before they adopt a rescue.

I disagree on the rehoming front though. Sometimes with a rescue the kindest thing can be to rehome once the full extent of its problems become apparent when it gets into a home environment and out of the rehoming centre. Over time it may become obvious that the problems the dog has are caused by, for example, children or separation anxiety and so forth. Whilst those can be tackled successfully, sometimes for an older dog who’s never truly settled I think it’s kinder to find a new home in an environment that’s more suited to its needs, rather than trying to teach the dog to cope in an environment it simply finds too stressful.

Why doesn't she muzzle the dog if it's having behavioural issues?

Dog needs help.

That help is going to require a professional and that professional should explain that putting the dog into situations like, being taken to your house, is not appropriate - risk to people, and making the dog worse.

The 'reasons' for the behaviour may well be genuine, the dog is provoked/startled/fearful of things like, someone suddenly entering a room, the way a child plays etc - these are not 'excuses' though.. they are real causes for reaction...

The point is, your Mother is aware the dog has issues and is clearly fearful and unhappy and has done nothing about either keeping everyone else safe OR keeping her dog safe OR addressing his issues.

So she should not bring him to yours, and she should address the problems with the help of a professional.

If she is not willing to do that she should not have a dog.

When you take on a Rescue Dog, you’re making a commitment to that dog, it’s not just getting a cheap dog. You owe it to them to help them settle in and, more often than not, learn new behaviours as many of them have been neglected and abused

I'm totally with you on that, @BestOption, but the sad fact is that OP's mum clearly isn't open to sense. Unfortunately she seems to be of the "baby didn't mean it" persuasion and IME such owners aren't easily persuaded into better ways

It doesn't sound as if she'd be open to rehoming so that someone more responsible could train it either, so it comes down to who's the priority where safety's concerned - and for me that always has to be the humans, even if it means a sad end for the dog

fizzygreenwater
Thanks for your comments - you are right. I tried having the conversation last night.
I said, there’s a reason Battersea Dogs Home won’t allow rescues to be homed with young children... they aren’t safe with children because they get spooked too easily. I said her dog is getting worse (in terms of getting more spooked as it gets older) and is clearly distressed in confined spaces (eg my small flat) with people it doesn’t trust. I said the TV was one issue but the safety thing was a bigger concern. She just sort of made noises and didn’t say much except to try to argue that Battersea dogs home only has a blanket ban all rescues going to families with young children because they don’t have time to evaluate the dogs properly....
Before she goes home I’m going to say that I will pay to replace my own TV but I expect her to use the money she hasn’t had to pay for the TV to a) fund a dog sitter next time she comes here and b) pay for a dog behaviourist so that children are safe when they visit her (because there’s clearly no way she will crate her dog round the clock when my son stays with her). Until a) and b) happen then there’s no more visiting.

YANBU.

That’s all.

I'm shocked you let your son stay there.

You are still missing the point completely.
You should stop taking your son to her house, for his own safety, but since you want to continue using her for childcare you are going to continue taking him.
She should also pay for a replacement TV.

I would add "get a Baskerville muzzle" to the list. If introduced correctly the dog won't have an issue with wearing it when around children. The first thing that any decent behaviour counsellor will do is suggest ways to manage the situation so that people (especially children) are not at risk while the issues are addressed. Even when they have been, it would be a brave person who would suggest the dog was now completely safe. Once a dog has a history of biting you can never be really sure it won't revert so a muzzle should probably be part of a longer-term solution. I mean ideally, the dog would just be kept physically apart from children at all times but it doesn't seem likely she will comply with that.

From the title I was going to take the dogs side but no, just no. The dog can't be trusted around children (or adults) - dog and children in the same building is just a no go.

Before she goes home I’m going to say that I will pay to replace my own TV but I expect her to use the money she hasn’t had to pay for the TV to a) fund a dog sitter next time she comes here and b) pay for a dog behaviourist so that children are safe when they visit her (because there’s clearly no way she will crate her dog round the clock when my son stays with her). Until a) and b) happen then there’s no more visiting.

Wtf?

Don't send your kids to stay with grandma and the dog. I'm a dog fan, but even after behaviourist attention the risk is too great. No, just no ffs.

She definitely needs to fund a dog sitter every time she stays with you, thats non negotiable too.

All visits stop right now until the dog has been helped.

I don’t even have a dog and I know this

Your kid could be killed, you do know this right?

Wake up and stop being so polite. TELL your mum how it’s going to be.