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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to be heartbroken

524 replies

MonnaLIza · 01/02/2020 12:35

It's a beautiful, sunny day. I am healthy. I have a new job, which I love. I also love my DH and kids and I am loved by them. We own a good home, a 'machine for living in', with room for everyone, and we can afford food and occasional treats such as days out and holidays. We bake bread, make muffins (which sometimes turn out to be edible) and go support our local football team. We are all reasonably educated and articulate, fully tax solvent and in socially meaningful professions (that's me and DH, our kids are in education).

And yet, there is a definitely low mood in the house today, and this is not just because I am recovering from clinical depression. Today, even if nothing seems different, is the first day of my life as an 'outsider'. I am no longer a EU citizen in my own country but officially an 'other'. An immigrant.

I am now somebody who needs to prove their right to be here, in their own home. Another layer of bureaucracy, more practical struggles. But it's the change in my 'status' that breaks my heart. I am no longer part of this country which I have made my home for the last twenty years.

Yes, I have 'settled status', an invisible document, which I have obtained in a much less easy way that the government would like you to think (for instance I could not use my iPhone to register as it only worked on android phones). An invisible document which proclaims to be valid until it's valid. No doubt in the future there will be more hoops to jumps, more papers to fill and i just hope these hoops and jumps will come when I am fit, young and tech-savy enough to be able to jump them.

I will, of course, snap out of this, but at the moment I am, I think not unreasonably, heartbroken.

And my biggest heartbreak is not for me - Katie Hopkins compared immigrants to cockroaches for our resilience and, ultimately, I am resilient. When I realised the industry I was in was getting destroyed by Brexit and austerity I got another job. I have qualifications and skills. I will survive in my immigrant-coackrochy ways.

No, my biggest heartbreak is for Britain itself, for the people who have been interviewed on TV who are celebrating Brexit without being able to articulate one single benefit of it to their life. I have lived in this country long enough to have seen another Britain, a multicultural, vibrant, accepting country, where having an accent and coming from somewhere else was considered an exciting, interesting thing. I can still see that in some enlightened places, which are increasingly engulfed by the darkness of 'patriotism'.

I guess I am heartbroken because I had not only imagined a brighter future, I had seen how great things can be, and now the lights are going off.

We are discussing moving to Scotland or Ireland. It would be easy for me and my DH but harder on their kids. They are born in England, they are English. What to do - stay and resists? Move?

I do not know yet. I will know soon, we will talk and make plans.

But today I am heartbroken.

OP posts:
Funkycats · 02/02/2020 09:56

Plenty of businesses have had operations moved abroad. Some have lost jobs, some have had to relocate.
But back to OP, she is understandable sad. As is my mother in law, who has been living here very happily and has now been made to feel like an oudsider. That feeling will probably pass, but it's not entirely unreasonable to be feeling it this week.
Have dom empathy ffs!

BurneyFanny · 02/02/2020 10:04

Noone’s livelihood has been destroyed overnight

I haven't lost my job overnight. But I have lost my right to a democratic vote overnight. And people have lost the entitlement to apply for jobs in Europe overnight.

Sickandtired1 · 02/02/2020 10:05

Well, look at it this way. Just because the OP feels like an outsider doesn’t make it so.

She is entitled to seek employment here. Yes, it may be difficult, but gaining employment is difficult even for many people who are born and educated here; never mind those who aren’t. Competition for jobs is high.

The OP again is entitled to keep her home, and raise her family.

There are plenty of people from the EU who will continue to live here. Absolutely no need to feel like an outsider.

Just get on with your day to day life.

I guarantee if you turned off the news, and stopped reading the newspaper you would notice virtually zero change in your own life now that Brexit has happened.

There are no major food shortages either which was predicted.

Very little, to nothing, has actually changed.

aroundtheworldyet · 02/02/2020 10:06

We’ve all lost the right to vote in the EU elections. That’s what happens when you leave the EU

QuietCrotchgoblins · 02/02/2020 10:07

Haven't rtft but I'm sorry you have been made to feel this way op.

I feel sad too, as a born and bred British citizen. Brexit has been described as 'an act of self harm' and I couldn't agree more.

It makes me want to emigrate far away from here!

Sickandtired1 · 02/02/2020 10:07

And so what?

If I move to america for a job, get accepted for a visa and work in employment. That doesn’t qualify me to vote; I’m not a citizen.

AllergicToAMop · 02/02/2020 10:10

@BurneyFanny that document you put was not only year old, but also for no deal scenario.
I just checked the withdrawal agreement and they really didn't specify electoral registers during transitional period🙄 Would be too much work I guess. So yeah. France is right, i guess

aroundtheworldyet · 02/02/2020 10:10

It’s much worse for me as a British person.
I’m not welcome in Europe anymore. I can’t just go over and get a job. Have freedom of movement. That’s not what I voted for. But I have to live with it.

At least the op has an Italian passport too. So not only is she welcome anywhere in all of Europe, she’s also welcome in a country outside of Europe easily. She’s got total freedom to roam and settle anywhere she likes including where she’s already settled!

You can look at it in a positive light too.

Sickandtired1 · 02/02/2020 10:14

People can dislike it as much as they want; but it was put to a vote.

The majority of the U.K wanted to leave and that’s what we have done. A victory for democracy.

Im sorry, but complaining or feeling sorry for yourself is not going to change what has happened.

As I said, people I work with were employed as recently as last month and they were from the EU. I wish all people who are already here the best of luck with employment and their family life.

I do however think it was the right decision to leave. I hope free movement is stopped and an Australian style points system implemented.

BurneyFanny · 02/02/2020 10:17

Can you understand that there's an emotional difference between never having a right in the first place and having one and losing it?

BurneyFanny · 02/02/2020 10:19

France doesn't allow TCNs to vote in European elections. We are TCNs. Not sure what's so complicated here. I mean, of a randomer on the internet or the French government, I know who i'd put my money on to be right.

KenDodd · 02/02/2020 10:20

Yadnbu

On the positive side OP, you have you're burgundy ticket out of here, me and my children are now (well, from 2021) locked in with the stupid fucks who voted for this.

HairyFloppins · 02/02/2020 10:22

dememtedma 100% agree Scotland is not the utopia that is being described on here.

BurneyFanny · 02/02/2020 10:25

The majority of the U.K wanted to leave and that’s what we have done

No, a majority of those who voted wanted to leave. Millions of people who could have been included in the mandate were deliberately excluded. And the campaign was conducted with considerable dishonesty, quite possibly with illicit foreign interference. That's not really a triumph for democracy n my book. Does the suppressed Russia report not give you at least pause for thought?

onthem25 · 02/02/2020 10:27

@aroundtheworldyet that's what I can't wor out about this post. It seems to come from a point of hysteria rather than fact. OP you have a right passport. You therefore have opportunities to work across Europe not just the U.K. so why is it so sad we are leaving somewhere you have the right to work anyway. I didn't vote to leave but I do understand what's happening now and think fair enough. That democracy rules and in any democracy there will be one side who thinks one thing and another that thinks that. But throwing your toys out the pram won't help anything. And I'm in a family who can see lots of jobs we can do across Europe but not sure if to even bother applying now. One in Paris I saw last week said must have the right to work in the Eu. I'll bet I don't get it on being British with a British passport alone.
But if that's what the U.K. have decided is a good thing then I will have to go with it.

You OP can still choose to be in the U.K. or another Eu country. If you want to whine about a Democratic choice then leave and find somewhere more in line with how you want to live.

KenDodd · 02/02/2020 10:34

@Sickandtired1

Noone’s livelihood has been destroyed overnight. What utter nonsense

We had redundancies last summer as a direct result of Brexit, no other factors at play. I survived the cut but it now looks like the whole firm might collapse because of Brexit. So, people have lost their livelihoods thanks to the fuckers who voted for this ("we knew what we voted for"). Of course I don't expect a leave voter to care about people's jobs though. I have only in ever heard of one Leave voter who gave a single shit about peace in NI so the idea they would care about people losing their jobs is laughable.

FishCanFly · 02/02/2020 10:35

I know i can leave anytime and go pretty much anywhere with my burgundy passport. But tell that to my British husband who might be not able to follow.

WhereShallWeMoveTo · 02/02/2020 10:46

No, a majority of those who voted wanted to leave.

Oh God, I'm so, so tired of hearing this. For the hundredth time THOSE WHO VOTED ARE THE ONLY PEOPLE THAT MATTER. THE OTHERS MAY AS WELL NOT EXIST FOR THE PURPOSES OF A DEMOCRATIC RESULT.

If you had a vote and didn't use it then we can't presume to know your thoughts on the matter either way. If you knew how you felt, or cared enough to have an opinion, you'd have voted. If you didn't have a vote for whatever reason, then your opinions have no bearing on anything. That is how it works. Confused

It's utterly pointless for Remainers (or indeed Labour voters in the case of the GE) to keep trying to find new ways to twist, misrepresent or reinterpret the simple fact that they lost. More people voted for Leave than Remain and more people voted for a Tory government promising to get Brexit done than voted for any other one party.

To continue to torture yourself and bore everyone else with daft notions that it somehow wasn't what it was, by viewing it through some whackily distorted and meaningless prism and insisting everyone else should do the same is utter madness and will do nothing to help you move on and make the best of where you find yourself now.

Leighhalfpennysthigh · 02/02/2020 10:52

Threads like this always brings out arseholes

Yep. This. @MonnaLIza I understand how you feel and you are allowed to be heartbroken. Playing heartbreak top trumps is disgusting. We all know that there are people worse off than us, but that doesn't help the way we feel about something here and now. I was heartbroken when I left my country at 5 years old. I was heartbroken when my husband died and guess what? I'm heartbroken we have left the EU.

My father was born a German Jew in the 1

MumW · 02/02/2020 11:00

@KenDodd, I think the tone of your post is every bit as vile and decisive as the anti-immigrant rhetoric of the extreme 'leavers'.

Whether they voted leave or remain, I believe that the average person made a decision based on what they believed was in the best interests of the country. The majority of people do care about job losses, peace in NI etc. The majority of people also value democracy. What's done is done and we all need to put our differences together and pull to make being out work in the best interests of every aspect of life in the UK.

Leighhalfpennysthigh · 02/02/2020 11:00

Pressed too soon!

My father was a German Jew born in the 1930's. He was 8 when his entire family was rounded up and sent to the gas chamber. His parents arranged for him to be smuggled out of Germany to family in Czechoslovakia. For the duration of the war he was hidden for his own safety.
He met my mother, a Czech National amd they both studied medicine.
Then came communism and he was driven out of Czechoslovakia because of his political beliefs.

We came to England. He worked as a GP until retiring 20 years ago and my mother was a gynaecologist. They thought they had finally found home and a country that accepted them, my dad's religion (mum was an atheist) and their political beliefs. They were loved in the community and when my mother died there was a massive turnout at her funeral of friends, neighbours, expatients and people whose lives she had touched in so many ways.

After Brexit my father, now in his 80's no longer feels like this is his home. He has been accused of being a Nazi (oh the irony) and told to get back to his own country - which one? The one that murdered his family or the one that wanted to murder him and his wife and children for daring to believe in different politics?

He said on Friday that it feels like it did in Germany in the 1930's. He's heartbroken too.

BurneyFanny · 02/02/2020 11:04

THOSE WHO VOTED ARE THE ONLY PEOPLE THAT MATTER. THE OTHERS MAY AS WELL NOT EXIST FOR THE PURPOSES OF A DEMOCRATIC RESULT.

By that logic, rotten boroughs were perfectly democratic Hmm.

KenDodd · 02/02/2020 11:08

I believe that the average person made a decision based on what they believed was in the best interests of the country.
I don't.

Most people I know in real life who voted Leave didn't so for one reason only, because they are racist and don't like foreigners. Honestly, I could scream, the number of times I've heard people say they voted Leave because they don't want any more muslims coming here you wouldn't believe. My racist family had a party with all their racist friends and celebrated 'immigrant fuck off day' (seem on FB, I didn't go).

KenDodd · 02/02/2020 11:12

@Leighhalfpennysthigh

That is so sad. I'm so sorry. I'm ashamed of my country, I'm ashamed of my family and the community I'm from..

Mummyoflittledragon · 02/02/2020 11:12

@Leighhalfpennysthigh
Big hugs to your dad. Please know he is wanted here.