To think mumsnet needs a separate 'Gender' section?

[Jargoyle]

I've been lurking here for years prior to signing up, but have now all but abandoned the women's rights section due to the overwhelming proliferation of trans threads.

I get that self ID is a big issue but I was saddened, for example, during the whole Irish abortion debacle that the first thread on it was barely two pages long whilst people were happily discussing Caitlyn Genner's style comments until the cows came home.

I think a separate section would be beneficial where the same old posters can have the same old discussions about it all.

Not really Wotcha - it's pointing out misogyny.

Answer posters' questions, or don't answer them. But your chasing me around this thread is very, very tedious.

Ok . You've banged on at me at some length about how imperative you think it is that I respond to posters and have tagged me in about half a dozen posts this evening, so I assumed you wanted me to respond to you. I'm delighted to hear you've changed your mind and I'm more than happy not to interact with you further.

Well no, JulyKit, I've been known to shout the odd 'dickhead', usually at boy racers who've just cut me up.

So, you know, for balance and fairness

Also, yes Similarly, anyone who reads this thread can see your posts about bullying.

WotchaTalkinBoutWillis you said "Oh gawd. Yet another spewed out "rule" from the roolz book when someone disagrees.
Seriously, what?"

I can't see where you've been disagreed with. Can you point it out?

Bewilderness's rules of misogyny rock!

How many rules are there now? 15 I think?

Feminists simply observed and documented the rules of misogyny. We did not invent them. Misogynists enculturated them.

Is there a link to the full rule book bewilderness? I’d be interested in a read.

*I've been on the FWR boards for a while now and never seen anyone "screaming abuse" confused

Lucky you - you missed the MRA at the weekend then*

Not forgetting the infamous "All hail the penis!" poster.

And this gem of course

The post began like this...

It continued....
Before climaxing with 'long live the penis'.

Ooh sorry, forgot the best bit...that precedes the others

Long Live the Penis, did, at the very least, have the virtue of being completely honest.

Oh gawd I’d forgotten that dickwit! Classic! He did at least make some kind of attempt to post semi-normally earlier. That kind of poster is why seemingly “innocent” posters get a wary glare sometimes. It’s not personal, getting snarked. don’t know why it bothers people.

TheBewilderness and JulyKit your posts last night clarifying why the racism comparison isn't one is so concise and clear. This will be so easy to remember and explain when some numpty/orSIL body throws this argument at me IRL.

Yes, I agree there is too much transphobia on the feminism pages. A separate section would be better.

Yes, I agree there is too much transphobia on the feminism pages.

Brilliant analysis!

Can you quantity 'too much'?

Is some ok?

I'm still trying to figure my way around and don't want to prove the 'shit in tea' analogy.

Good point Humpty but shouldn't we first clarify what is trans phobic and what's not?

See I struggle with this so will give examples.

1. I hate you cos you are a trannie and that makes you evil I hope you rot. That to me is clearly transphobic and not something I believe or would say and I would call the person out if I ever heard it.

However I have being called transphobic for the following.
2) Humans cannot change sex. If you were born male you will always be male.

So I struggle to see what's transphobic and what's not.

How about the GCs keep the current section, since they have possession, and just start a new feminism transfree chat section? The rules would be no mention of the trans debate allowed.

I agree with the OP original post. I no longer s is it the feminism board because it's predominantly about gender not feminism. Totally highjacked by extremist opinions ( both ways) in my view. Clearly it's a discussion pp want to continue to have ( like all the aren't Meghan and Harry bastards for dumping HMQ threads) but should be separate from discussing feminism which is not exclusively about gender

Wouldn't that make it a trans exclusive space Socalm?
Is that allowed?

You could be trans without talking about the trans debate?

feminism which is not exclusively about gender

Indeed. Feminism is about women's experiences and rights as a sex based class - nothing to do with gender (or, at least, not necessarily, and arguably very rarely to with 'gender').
If women are no longer a sex based class, but a 'gender', then feminism necessarily becomes 'about gender', because that's the definition of women.

So how do you square avoiding debate around GRA with retaining women's sex based rights, @Sooverthemill?