To feel frustrated with the UK secondary system?

[flyingfoxes]

I'm from the US, and we moved here when DD was in preschool. Since she started school I've struggled with understanding how she's performing in school (one year we got a yearly report with "2a" or "2b" type grades to show how she was doing, which was helpful, but it was scrapped right after). The teachers always just said she was doing fine. She did well enough in the SATs but it was the first time we had hard evidence of how she was performing, and it was too late after the fact to help her with any specific areas, like maths, to give her a boost.

She's now in year 10. Since she started secondary, I've been given a number of progress reports that are essentially "work ethic" reports and an annual progress report that says whether or not she's meeting her own personalised targets. When I've asked to know what those targets are, the school got cagey and said they weren't allowed to tell me. What? Why? But I was assured that she's doing fine and once she started GCSEs that we'd finally find out her predicted grades.

So... we've finally gotten those, yay. Except... they're not nearly as high as they could be. And her predicted grades will determine what A levels she can take, which determine what university courses she can take, and I'm overwhelmed at the idea that at 14 her life choices are already being narrowed down so significantly... based on predicted grades for an exam she hasn't even sat yet.

I posted about this in the education section and was told not to even try a chemistry A level with a predicted grade of 5+ on the GCSEs. But... that's what she wants to do, is study chemistry. How can it already be decided so soon?!

When I was 14 in the US, I had no flipping clue what I wanted to do in life. I did okay (not as well as I could have done), but then excelled at university, came to the UK and got a masters with distinction from a Russell group university. If I had closed off that possibility at 14, my life would be very, very different than it is now.

Anyway, I'm just frustrated -- that I never knew how DD was performing, didn't help her sooner (I was told she was doing fine!), and now she's going to have to work extra hard to get to where she should be. I just wish we had better signposts here (a letter grade here and there would be nice!) or more flexible options for university age kids. Am I being massively unreasonable?

"Also", I hit send too soon, but had changed my mind about carrying on anyway so just disregard that

We get a report at the end of each half term with the results of their learning for that block. Does nobody else have anything like this?

We got regular reports from school with what DD's target was and what she was currently working at. If the OP's school wasn't doing that then it is a shit school IMO.

We get two reports a year. The first is effort only and the second is effort plus attainment. We've had this since Y7. I know what you mean though, National Curriculum levels was so much better than the current "meeting expectations" crap in primary school.

I completely agree, School reports are really not worth the paper they are written printed on.

All you get told is whether they are working above/at/below expectation, with no clue of what they actually mean by 'expectation' - it tells you nothing. They don't explain whether expectation is the expected level is the level they think your child personally should be at based on where they were before, or a benchmark level applied to everyone, or heaven knows what else. All that guff might mean something to teachers, but it sure as hell doesn't to parents.

I ripped up at least one of the things in disgust.

There's a comma missing in there - feel free to insert

Thanks everyone for your responses. I'm not sure I can remember all the questions, but briefly:

SATS: I can't remember what she got (I know I took a pic of the results for her father but for the life of me I can't find it). I know she more than passed.

CATs: she got a 138 non-verbal reasoning score and 127 average. Very high but that clearly isn't reflected in her performance! She tends to do the bare minimum which I've mistakenly allowed since she was "doing fine" and in top sets.

Things I've learned in the last 24 hours: there are different exam boards for GCSEs! Phoned up the school to see which they use and they use not one, but three different boards depending on subject. The lovely woman in the exams office was very patient with me and gave me all the information I wanted (possibly the easiest part of my experience with her education so far). 😁 So now I've ordered the correct revision guides for her subjects and have found a good maths tutor. She starts on Saturday (only time slot he had free -- sorry DD!)

Feeling much more optimistic thanks to you lovely lot, I think she can raise her predicted grades before applications are due next year. Thank you everyone for the advice and commiseration!

It is perfectly standard to use a variety of boards, each subject picks the one they think is 'best'. DD2 has mainly AQA & Edexcel, but has one WJEC/Eduqas and will have OCR if she does foundation paper for Maths.

Ok wales from year 2 we have welsh national tests in numeracy, literacy and reasoning. Thier scores are then standardised against all the other children born in thier month so you can see where they are compared to everyone else
So 100 is the average score so if yours has 140 you know they are way above average in that area.
They also show thier scores from previous years so you can see if they’ve dropped position etc

if she doesn't do an A level, it limits what university courses she can do though, doesn't it? From looking at uni websites it doesn't seem she can apply with a bunch of humanities A levels.

This comment maybe reflects that there's also a difference in higher education between the US and U.K. - UK Bachelors degrees are 3 years not 4, and in most subjects, especially STEM, the students need to hit the ground running with the relevant A level content and skills. A US student wanting to apply for a U.K. chemistry degree would, I believe, need chemistry and other science AP grades. But there are foundation courses available at many for applicants who don't have the right A levels - thus making it in effect a 4 year BSc.

The school does sound poor with their communication. For instance, the numbered GCSE grades should come with an explanation of how they relate to the old lettered grades. If you post specific queries on the Staffroom thread in education, I'm sure one of my colleagues there will be bale to translate educational gobbledegook for you. I work in a slightly old-fashioned private school where we still give letter grades and - gasp - percentages!

Bale??! Wtf predictive text. 'Glad to'.

Totally agree re Scottish system, my son is just away to pick his Nat 5’s going into 4th year, nothing is closed off

OP I completely agree with your original post. I went to school in a different country and really dislike how the UK system requires children to make such serious choices at so early, and narrows their opportunities.

I'm a teacher and I have to share the children's levels with parents...? As do my colleagues?

I have no idea how you have not been told ever?

The problem is that that the key stage three levels don't correlate to the gcse criteria at least not in my subject anyway. It's wildly difficult to compare them. I will mark a set of key stage three assessments and the level 2 criteria looks a lot like a gcse mark scheme level 4. It's all totally wrong and frustrating for teachers too. If she's predicted 5s I would wager that she'll struggle to get 7s as the predictions are usually optimistic but you can try tutoring and if she's very diligent she might do better.

Considering moving to Scotland it sounds wonderful

Oh with that CAT score I wouldn’t worry.

I’m surprised her predicted grades are 5+ tbh, because they’re generally generated using CATs plus SATs.

Anyway, the most important thing is the future. Good luck with it all!

Oh with that CAT score I wouldn’t worry.

This is largely why I was surprised at the low predicted grades. I emailed her science teacher yesterday and still haven't heard back -- I asked if they're meant to represent what she would get if she sat the exams right now or if that's what they think she'll get in a year and half's time.

@flyingfoxes At my DD’s school, the Chemistry dept. demand an 8 in Triple Science for the A level, as do Physics. Biology will accept Double Science and will also accept a 7. This information was given to us (along with the minimum GCSE grades for all the other A levels) in Year 9 when they chose their options.

Are you sure her current school will allow her to progress to Chem A with the Double curriculum? If not, then you might investigate other 6th form provision.

I teach GCSE and Alevels. Sixth form will look at predicted grades but it's really on results day that actually count. Predicted grades are vastly inaccurate at all ages and teachers are able to move school target grades up and down accordingly. You don't need to be worrying about Alevel entry requirements until next year or where she will be going. She has plenty of time to be getting that grade up over the next 2 terms.

OP I am totally with you. The opportunities are narrowed way too early. It is quite oppressive really.

I love US system as it is(was) forgiving. And almost no age is too late to start over.

For a system that relies so much on grades the communication is way too wishy washy. It would work for a more liberal educational system but not a system that is super competitive but pretends not to be.

You daughter can hopefully improve by the time GCSE starts. Wishing her all luck.

Canadian living in the UK here. I worked in primary education here, and it genuinely makes no sense to me. "Reports" tell parents nothing. In Canada, each report card (3x per year in Primary, 4x per year in Secondary) gives you a grade or percentage for each subject (expected student average being B- or 70%), along with a comment on their work, and a separate section for learning goals and behaviour. I truly feel for parents here who can't possibly know anything about their child's progress in relation to curriculum and their peers. High school students in Canada can also choose their courses annually, so if maturity hits a bit later (like it did for me), a kid with average grades can go on to excel with high level material.

I find it hard to believe you had no idea how your child was doing. Didn't you read with them or do homework - spend time just chatting. I know exactly how my children are doing. Then I can chat with the teacher at the parent/teacher meeting and can ask about strengths and weaknesses. My DDs primary report says if they are below/average/above compared to expectations of the average child their age.

YANBU. I went to a system where we got grades from 1 to 6. The teachers would also tell us how many pupils got a 1,2,3 in each test, so we knew if eg. our 2 was outstanding or average within the class. At the end of the year we would be told who the top 3-5 people in the class where. That was motivating and helpful.

Here we are not only not getting any information, we are also blatantly lied to. I was told by a teacher that children in band B covered exactly the same as children in band A. Well, now I have a child in band A and one in band B in the same year and it is clear that that was a lie.

All the numbers and statistics are basically just a huge fog machine.

For those who are from other countries, what country-wide exams do the pupils sit? And how is teacher / school performance measured?