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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to think that my secondary age child at Harris Academy should not have to be “accompanied” to the toilet by a member of staff.

200 replies

Beetrootmashup · 17/01/2020 07:25

The policy at Harris Beckenham is that any child who wishes to use the toilet/bathroom for any reason, sickness, genuine need i.e. caught out, ( it happens to the best of us adults even.) period management the runs. Must be accompanied to the loo by the assistant principle of their house. The principle must be contacted by the teacher, I don’t know how, taken out of lessons (they teach.) make their way to the class room, before your child has time to be sick/wet themselves/bleed through.
I think it’s crazy. I thought we were teaching children to be independent self sufficient members of society but we can’t trust them to trot of to the bathroom sort themselves out and get back to class in good time? Does your Harris academy have this crazy rule?
So the vote is ;
Should Harris academy Schools insist that any child who needs the toilet or bathroom at any time during a lesson must be accompanied to the bathroom by the assistant principle. Yes or No?

OP posts:
GiveHerHellFromUs · 17/01/2020 07:51

Some children arrange to meet their friends in toilets to smoke, deal drugs, fight, have sex.

That's only on television...

MsJaneAusten · 17/01/2020 07:52

That's only on television...
Oh bless.

Bluerussian · 17/01/2020 07:54

Children must be told by their parents that if they need to go to the toilet urgently, they are within their rights to just go - being polite about it of course. They'll have confidence if they know mum will back them to the hilt.

Beetrootmashup · 17/01/2020 07:55

They can’t be meeting to do the television sex drugs fighting in the toilets here because they are open block. Gross- but stops any of those shenanigans.

OP posts:
thejollyroger · 17/01/2020 07:55

That's only on television...

Have you been watching Educating Essex again?

GiveHerHellFromUs · 17/01/2020 07:55

@MsJaneAusten I grew up in a pretty rough area and the only thing in that list that kids went to the toilets for was to smoke.

If they wanted to shag or do drugs they'd just disappear.

If they wanted to fight they'd just do it.

ColaFreezePop · 17/01/2020 07:55

It's to stop children going to the toilet during lessons time so I can understand why they do that.

I doubt Harris accepts children with EHCPs as they know such a policy would be challenged. Saying that at my secondary one of the people who did have such incidents didn't have any obvious or known issues. They just didn't realise they needed to go. One class room teacher was pissed off while the other 2 were sympathetic and tried to help.

In regards to girls with heavy periods - as a teenage girl if the toilets are horrible whether you are on your period or not you do whatever you can not to use them.

thejollyroger · 17/01/2020 07:56

They can’t be meeting to do the television sex drugs fighting in the toilets here because they are open block. Gross- but stops any of those shenanigans.

Then too many of them are saying they need the toilet and then truanting, or meeting their friends somewhere else.

Equanimitas · 17/01/2020 07:58

Your vote doesn't work. Which is yes and which is no?

SnugglySnerd · 17/01/2020 07:59

I'm wondering if they have a problem with drug dealing or something as I can't imagine they would disrupt the staff members' day so much otherwise.
Students at our school who may need the toilet urgently for medical reasons are given a card to show the teacher and they are always allowed put to go to the loo. Other than that we are not supposed to let them leave the room because, as others have said they meet up with friends, disrupt other lessons and so on. I am a bit relaxed with this rule if I'm honest!

Equanimitas · 17/01/2020 08:00

You can just imagine the assistant principal talking about his work.

  • Wow, you've been promoted to assistant principal? That must carry a lot of work and responsibility?
  • Not really, I just accompany teenagers to and from the toilets all day.
Alanna1 · 17/01/2020 08:00

Why don’t you ask to meet with the school to talk about it if you feel so strongly? I strongly suspect as others have suggested that there will be underlying reasons for such a policy. If your DC has a particular reason why they might need to go to the toilet in lessons more commonly, that can be discussed too. The school will have an obligation to make reasonable adjustments for a disability.

NearlyGranny · 17/01/2020 08:01

Making it difficult for kids to slide out during lessons using toilet breaks as an excuse, probably. And in the process, making life difficult for students with IBS and other conditions and every. single. young. woman. who menstruates.

Not on! When I taught secondary, every girl in my class who asked to go, went. No fuss, no delay, no questions. Think of the alternative for just a moment...

The boys sometimes got stroppy: "Miss, you let the girls go!" Yes I do, sunshine. Get over it. Not up for discussion.

With pre-pubescent children it's often a case of not wanting to go at playtime because they'd rather play, and then they need to go later, on lessons. I lined them up and made them visit the toilet before I let them out for play or lunch. I inspected their hands to see they'd washed them, too. Teachers can't do those things once children are in double figures!

If a boy, or a girl for that matter, had a medical issue, fine, of course. Parents would tell me directly and I was discreet. And frankly, you can tell at a glance if it's a genuine request, just from the child's face. No fuss. No problem.

But all this prisoner and escort stuff? Tosh. It won't last five minutes. Those deputies have other, more important work to do! Whoever dreamed up this scheme is making a point but will be wildly unpopular with the entire staff.

noblegiraffe · 17/01/2020 08:01

Surely the easiest way to challenge this policy is to have lots of children desperately need the toilet in the same lesson in different classes. When the HoH fails to accompany them all to the toilet, as per the policy, parents can then ask why it isn’t being implemented and what children are meant to do when the HoH fails to attend.

Equanimitas · 17/01/2020 08:01

I doubt Harris accepts children with EHCPs as they know such a policy would be challenged.

Academies aren't allowed to refuse children when they are named in their EHCPs.

HPandTheNeverEndingBedtime · 17/01/2020 08:09

We have this at my school too. Students with a medical need have a toilet pass and are free to go, everyone else needs escorting. The escorting teacher stands in the corridor and can't hear anything.

If a child in my class looks very ill and feels sick I tell them to go and I'll email our oncall system after.

It's to stop students arranging to meet up to truant, they go to class get their mark then it's 'miss I need the toilet', it's to stop students going to the toilets and vaping and most importantly it's to stop students going to the toilets to selfharm.

The toilets in a secondary school are often nowhere near the classroom (nearest to mine is down 3 flights of stairs) and it wastes a huge amount of time if children are back and forth to the toilet, once one goes the others follow.

NearlyGranny · 17/01/2020 08:12

Beetroot, may I just ask whether those toilets opening onto a corridor have floor to ceiling partitions between cubicles and cubicle doors that nobody could put their head over or under to peer in? Does every cubicle have a sanitary bin so girls aren't left carrying used pads or tampons out into communal areas with them to dispose of? Are they unisex spaces?

I worry about the privacy and girl-friendliness of these designs and the scope they could offer for harassment and bullying of any and all students.

You hear stories about spiteful kids actually timing girls in the cubicle and period-shaming them.

thejollyroger · 17/01/2020 08:12

A few years ago I pulled a truanting child out of the toilets at my school falling down drunk. It was her birthday. Her mum has given her a quarter litre of vodka to bring to school to share with her friends. She didn’t share it, like. She just drank it in the toilets when she was supposed to be in science. 13.

mummytothree87 · 17/01/2020 08:12

My child is at a Harris Academy and they have never been escorted to the bathroom. The stories about bullying i've heard though...maybe some of them should be.

GiveHerHellFromUs · 17/01/2020 08:13

@thejollyroger presumably the child is now in the care of social services? That's disgusting.

thejollyroger · 17/01/2020 08:15

GiveHerHellFromUs

I have no idea. She left the school shortly after the incident. But yes, it is disgusting. She was completely out of control. Poor girl.

lisaorris99 · 17/01/2020 08:15

I’m a secondary teacher.

This is how it works in my school ...

‘Miss can I go to the toilet’

‘Yes / be quick / can you hang on for 5 mins for break? / sure ‘ depending on the situation.

Insanity having that process and it’s probably to put kids (and teachers) off from asking!

Beetrootmashup · 17/01/2020 08:20

@Equanimitas sorry if it’s unclear, I’m asking ;
should they have this policy ?
Yes
Or
No

OP posts:
GrammarTeacher · 17/01/2020 08:22

Seriously, not all schools are like this. I have never taught anywhere with draconian toilet rules.

BoxedWine · 17/01/2020 08:24

You could home educate or privately educate them in whatever context you like.

How are you drawing this conclusion based on the information OP has provided? There's nothing to tell us either way whether homeschooling or private would be an option for her.