AIBU to think there’s no justification for eating meat and dairy any more?

[AnnoyingVegan]

People are educated now. People know that eating meat and dairy is disastrous for the planet. People know it’s causing an unprecedented climate crisis. People know it causes untold cruelty to animals.

So why are people still doing it? There is a vegan substitute for virtually every meat and dairy product you can think of. What is going on here?

The number of people I’ve seen on social media breaking their hearts over Australia shooting wild camels and horses because they drink too much water while still eating beef blows my mind.

No.

Reread what I said, your sarcasm isnt part of healthy debate. You've missed the point.

@NellieEllie you've written three very well put together paragraphs, articulate and clever .. if a little goady and intentionally offensive .. it would be an impressive addition to the 'vegan' argument if it were not for the fact that you've intentionally (or I guess unintentionally if you're really that short sighted) dodged all of the many well thought out and fair points risen against full vegan lifestyle.

1. people with celiac will actually just starve to death

2. most affordable vegan options are so heavily processed that their making has a pretty extensive carbon foot print of their own!! For all of those people on the poverty line and below 'well balanced' vegan eating is totally beyond their means.

3. we are biologically and evolutionary designed to eat meat. In no way were ever meant to be so vile in the way it's produced I'll give you that .. but our bodies are designed to hunt (we're apex predators) and eat flesh and many of us believe that ignoring that basic point may hold
   Long term, yet to be fully understood, negative side affects for our species.

Lastly ..

4. you're right 100% right currently 90% of soy production is for the feed of cattle .. however .. should the whole world turn vegan right this second then the sheer amount of soy needed and mass produced would be catastrophic for the planet!!

In short no extreme is going to save us .. we need to learn to moderate our production of all food products for the human species.. swinging the pendulum from one danger to another is stupid!

I was raised vegetarian, was constantly ill and tired.

I now eat small amounts of eggs, fish and meat (am allergic to dairy) and am finally healthy.

That's why a lot of people do it.

How can a vegan diet with all the processed shit food it includes be good for people or the planet??

I think I’ll stick with what’s natural thanks!!

You keep asserting that people support animal abuse

Do you see how thats lying and twisting? No, I think your response tells us that you can't see that.

I’m guessing my ancestors killed the odd mammoth here and there and are it. Guessing they hunted other animals also. Guessing they liked the taste of meat. I’m guessing my enjoyment of nest is somehow linked to this and the fact some of my teeth are canines.

I like the taste of milk. Real milk, from cows. I don’t enjoy the taste of oat milk, almond milk etc. I detest vegan cheese - no idea what they do to get something to taste so vile. I have tried fake vegan meat and I’m not sure that processed stuff is good for you, am thinking in 20 years they will announce it gives you cancer or something.

So I will eat meat and drink milk and have other dairy products.

However, I eat locally raised free range pasture fed meat.

I had relatives who had a sheep property, also raised a few cows for personal consumption and milk and other relatives who owned a dairy farm. I have seen animals slaughtered on site for personal consumption, hung to bleed and dry, skinned etc. No problem with it. Have seen male calves born in the dairy and the truck that came every morn to collect them that used a rubber mallet- on wondering what they did with them I was told ‘Devon’. I’m aware that my eating of true free range eggs involves getting rid of the males after sexing. It is what it is.

I can’t tell you how much posts like this make me want to go and eat a massive bloody steak, just to be contrary.

Don’t be an arse.

I think people (extreme vegans) need to suss the difference between what they preace and sustainability

@AnnoyingVegan, I've have actually caught, killed and skinned/prepared my own meat, which I then cooked and ate. It was pretty tasty. (rabbit, in case you are wondering). I've also helped my Nan (when I was a child) who reared, killed, prepared and ate her chickens. Also really tasty (and yes, I used to name them). Didn't stop them tasting good, and I knew that they had a good life and a quick death.

I don't feel bad eating what I eat, although I am cutting down on sugar/refined carbs.

@AnyMinuteNow

To help clear up any confusion, I've prepared some handy questions for you.

Did anything that ended up on your plate have a mother? Did it bleed? Was it capable of feeling pain? Was it capable of feeling fear? Was it capable of wanting to live?

If the answer to any of these questions is 'yes' then congratulations, you support animal abuse.

Hope that helped.

I have a question I'd like answered if possible: What do we do with the 65% of land in the UK that is ONLY suitable for grazing and growing grass?

Not sure why you are so full of self-importance that you would believe, after my comments to you already, that I would be in the slightest bit interested in anything else you would have to say, or that I would consider answering questions ffs!

Get a grip of yourself, letting your anger twist everything you say.

I mainly follow a vegan/vegetarian diet, however for health reasons I must eat a small amount of meat.

And before you start going on about how I can get everything I need from a plant based diet, no I cannot. I've tried and failed numerous times, my medical history backs this fact up.

@annoyingvegan please recommend a good (genuinely really good!) alternative for a nice mature cheddar? It's the only thing stopping me from going full vegan. (Am pretty much vegan in every other aspect)

Thanks. Haven't read all the other replies so apologies if I'm getting wires crossed hit I think a great way to bring others round to your way of thinking is to offer the alternatives that are there

I've only read a couple of the holier than thou posts from the OP and wont read any more. You do what is right for you and ignore other people's choices rather than demean them.

@AnyMinuteNow

Sometimes, it's appropriate to be angry.

I'm angry because we live in a world where the cognitive dissonance is so great that people can mass exploit and kill cows, pigs, chickens and other animals with total impunity but would go to jail for doing the same stuff to a puppy because animal abuse is only considered "real" when perpetrated against certain select kinds of animals, for profit.

If it wasn't wrong, it would be fine to do it to cats and dogs. The fact that it isn't means that we, as a society, accept that it's animal abuse, we just don't consider all animals worthy of the same protection.

It's unfair. It's barbaric. And these creatures have no voice so yeah, we owe it to them to be angry and we owe it to them to speak up.

• not for profit, typo

Vegan substitutes (with the exception of bonsoy) are disgusting though. There’s also a health issue. Most substitutes are quite unhealthy, natural alternatives are generally derived from pulses which are bad for the gut in large quantities. Then there are individual peculiarities, for instance, I have an iron deficiency and a rather sensitive stomach ( in particular I struggle with pulses and green leafy things). Without stomach friendly animal products (Friendly did my stomach at least) i wouldn’t be eating enough protein or iron (I barely manage as it is).

I'm vegan but leave people alone. They will either eventually come to it or they live in a way which makes it seem impossible. We're hated because people think we're psycho....

Many many millenials and GenZ are vegan or vegan-curious, eventually we will likely be 50% vegan but you can't force people.

I mean environmentally I agree but I am sick of people thinking I'm having a go just by asking for the vegan menu.

@obviouspretzel I saw a video of all the parasites being pulled out of a prawn before it was edible and damn.... that was a major factor in my veganism it was vile. I fucking loved prawns

Although I do have to say to everyone complaining about unhealthy vegan food... just eat whole food vegan food and it's way better. None of the new shite

Vegan doesn't automatically mean eco friendly. I think it's more important for people to be aware of where their food is coming from, and to make choices that reduce their impact on the planet.

For example - I keep a goat and chickens. They roam my land for food, and also eat kitchen scraps. I am comfortable eating my chicken's eggs and drinking my goat's milk. That is much better for the planet than me going to the supermarket and buying irresponsibly produced almond milk and soy products, or oranges that have been flown in from the other side of the world.

We need to think about the actual impact of the food production chain, not just cut out certain food groups. It's not that simple.

Vegan diet makes me ill. My gut, skin and mental clarity are best on meat veg and dairy. 🤷🏼‍♀️

Also, I used to be a vegan, and although I found that plant based milk, ice cream and chocolate were perfectly nice, plant based cheese is absolutely revolting. I struggle to think of anything I've ever eaten that is more disgusting. I wouldn't wish it upon my worst enemy. It is not a like for like swap.