AIBU to think that McDonalds need to up their vegan game

[Hiphopopotamus]

As a vegan the start of veganuary is always really exciting when all the new companies bring out their vegan stuff - this year seems to be particularly great - Greggs have brought the vegan steak bake, kfc have their vegan burger and McDonald’s....well they’ve taken the horrible goujon things they have in their veggie burger, sold them separately and marketed them as a new vegan meal! AIBU to think that they need to seriously up their game?

I would LOVE a vegan cheeseburger at McDonald's it would make my year just in case anyone in marketing at the golden arches are listening!

Greenwich market 😂 the next time i fancy a bit of vegan fast food I will make my way there 200 miles

Why would any right minded vegan eat in McDonalds? The point of veganism surely is animal welfare and the impact of eating meat on our planet right?

I think some vegans should instead be called Plant Based Eaters or something. Which would serve to differentiate them from ethical vegans, who would never support a business like Mc Ds and help it to flourish.

I'm not a vegetarian or a vegan but sometimes I don't fancy meat or I like the sound of a meat-free dish, so the more vegetarian/vegan options the better.

I don't get the 'vegan hate', sure there are 'militant' vegans (I've never known one though) but there are also meat eaters who lecture people about eating meat, just avoid the annoying people regardless of their chosen diet!

I agree that if McDonalds are going to bother making a vegan option, they should at least make it nice. There are so many types of 'fake' beef and chicken burgers they could easily leave their menu as it is and offer it using a meat burger or a meat substitute burger.

However McDonalds isn’t the right place for a serious vegan

@catherine - should they not shop in supermarkets either? Some 'ethical vegans' also known as a vegan do support eating in popular places to increse the demand for vegan products. Different people have different thoughts on it.

Those chains turn vegan into a very bleak projection of what’s to come in terms of feeding the masses:

People will be fed processed fungus mixed with artificial flavourings to get some taste into it, with the same greenhouse grown bland lettuce and tomatoes as before.
In fact, major companies such as Kraft etc. must be rubbing their hands with joy, creating long-term plans on producing even cheaper food for the masses without negotiating with the pesky dairy and meat farmers because the soy plantations somewhere in Asia are so much cheaper and people irrelevant.

But there will be no little cute piglets slaughtered and calves separated from their mothers where the vegans gagging to buy the next Greggs roll live so who cares.
Not sure about the environmental sustainability and buying local produce but I deeply believe that those will remain out of reach or irrelevant for people currently flocking to McDonald’s anyway.

Vegan food offered in chain restaurants and outlets are heavily processed crap. I wouldn't touch most of it with a barge-pole. The public is being conned about it even being about animal welfare and health - it's yet another cynical money making bandwagon they're all jumping on.

It's also about the environment and it's difficult to deny that humans need to fix our eating habits regarding that.

It’s a no from me

@daisychain01, exactly but try explaining that to the bigots who immediately start waving posters of slaughterhouses in your face.
The thing is, how environmentally sustainable and healthy can vegan food remain when going mainstream? None of the vegans I asked could answer my question so far.
There’s a huge gap between the current happy vegans chewing on their locally produced organic veggies and going mainstream where whole nations will have to be fed. You won’t see the likes of families relying on food banks right now ordering boxes of organic beetroot with clump of soil still attached. It will be fungus based and heavily artificially flavoured sausages with baked beans and potatoes instead, imported from wherever it’s cheapest.
How ecological will that be?

@eeriesilence how environmentally sustainable and healthy is eating meat now, especially as it's been escalated to factory levels? It's just more palatable to more people because it's the status quo.
By and large non meat products take less resources and less space to produce. This is a really crucial point in human history to be considering this.

@EerieSilence I’m not going to argue with your well made points, but...people eat junk food. Omnis consume “crap processed food“ on a daily basis so why should vegans have to be paragons of food virtue? Why are you only doing vegan-ing right if you live on a diet of organic mung beans? Omnis are allowed to crave “a cheeky Nando’s”, or eat an entire tub of ice cream, or go for a kebab on the way back from the pub, so why aren’t vegans allowed to do the equivalent?

I spent the weekend with my ILs; 4 omnis, 3 veggies (including me) and 2 vegans. Not a mung bean was consumed! On Friday FIL cooked (vegan) vegetable bake with (vegan) spinach sausages (from Waitrose) and meat sausages. On Saturday we all had frozen pizza (meat/cheese/vegan) with home made vegan garlic bread and tomato pasta salad (vegan, Sainsbury’s). On Sunday I made a completely vegan curry buffet. This is how normal families eat; the veganisation involved zero extra work and made no difference to anyone’s enjoyment of the food. This is why I find the attitudes to vegans on here so strange and don’t understand why anyone could possibly feel so threatened by it.

No ones forcing you to be a vegan. It’s bad for human bodies and bad for the planet

There's mounting evidence against both those claims.

Watch game changers on metflix

@EerieSilence, who has ever waved a poster of a slaughterhouse in your face?

"The thing is, how environmentally sustainable and healthy can vegan food remain when going mainstream? None of the vegans I asked could answer my question so far."

There's two aspects to this. The first is that most people, myself included, lack the years of specialist scientific training to be able to predict exactly how agriculture and ecosystems would adapt if the entire world switched to vegan diet. There are experts in this field but even they don't agree, as a quick look at the literature will tell you.

What we do know is that the vast majority of the world's soy, for example, is grown for use in animal feed. 98% is one figure I looked at. People often point to mass soy monoculture as one of the impacts of the switch to veganism but actually it was happening already, and it was happening as a direct result of industrialised meat and dairy production.

The second aspect is that many vegans aren't interested in trying to change your mind. Personally speaking I'm just trying to do what feels right to me - and no doubt you also make your own decisions based on presumably some sort of ethical framework that makes sense to you.

@letsghostdance - where did I say I agree with the current status?
All I am saying is that mass produced veganism won’t be healthy or ethical.
All those who are jumping on the Greggs vegan bandwagon show that vegan can be sold as ethical, healthy and environmental even though it’s far away from it. People like the nice pat on the shoulder for being woke because someone told them so while big companies are rubbing their hands and count nice profits while organic or free range local farmers are still struggling.
I personally believe that veganism will become mainstream because it’s the cheaper option and gives big companies more space to play around with the quality of food while real meat and dairy will become the food of the rich.

No they don’t because they aren’t aiming for a vegan clientele...

If you don’t like the food. don’t go there.

Not being rude but why do some vegans feel entitled and like everyone HAS to cater to them. I wouldn’t go into a vegan restaurant and demand more meat dishes.

I would prefer them to start working on offering even one thing suitable for someone with celiac. Would be nice for my husband to be able to have a fast food burger or sausage roll just for once instead of always having to find a sit down restaurant because they are the only places that will cater for him.

@MaggieAndHopey - I had posters of slaughterhouses waved into my face as I was passing a well meaning group of vegans who were not delighted with me not signing their protest against dairy farms. Ironically, there was a bunch of pro-lifers just beside them and the zealotry in the air was overwhelming.
Btw, the 98% of soy grown for animal feed vegans love to mention has been disputed because it’s very incomplete and omits some very important details. Read it up if you want.
I have nothing against vegans. I am just trying to predict what will happen when vegan goes mainstream. And I see a gold mine for companies which certainly don’t have ethics as a priority.

If you care about the planet or animals at all, then you really should't be spending your money at MCDs anyway OP.
Do some research!

Been veggie for years, I never eat at McDonalds or BK or indeed takeaways these days. My mum hated them would never let us go near any of them. Overpriced horrid stuff with loads of junk in it. There were also cases of them grilling the veggie offering on the same grills as meat too. Mind you we don't eat out much as too expensive anyway. I've lived without going near these places for 48 years and I shall doubtless survive many more without them too. I'm not militant about being veggie and never wanted to be vegan whatever your choice it's up to you.

We do use Quorn and I manage our version of fast food with that at home. The only niggle I've had with the current Vegan fad is that the supermarkets have replaced some veggie options (like Quorn Beef slices) with Vegan Ham (alongside the veggie ham) reducing the veggie choice rather than just adding it on.

I don't think a lot of the big chains put much thought into veggie/vegan food and just fling out an afterthought product. I think stuff like falafels etc are much nicer.

@EerieSilence you're right, 98% of soy isn't for animal feed, it's 70%. 6% produced globally is for human consumption. The rest is for other purposes.

But you are aware that meat produced cheaply for the US market is fed soy, so obviously the majority of soy is produced for animal feed.

McDonalds are one of the world's biggest brands. They pretty much wrote the book on how to make money in the fast food market. They do not do things in a half-arsed way or on the spur of the moment. If they are only offering a very limited range of vegan food then they have obviously crunched the numbers and make the business decision not to expand their range. They don't need to "up their game".

I'm not interested in being a vegan, and 99% of the rest of the country aren't interested either. That doesn't mean I won't - occasionally - choose vegan food but mostly I'll choose something else. The whole "Veganuary" thing is just not my cup of tea at all. We do meat-free Monday in this house and have done for years, and planning on increasing meat-free meals this year even more.

The whole vegan push has actually taken the veggie options away and made them vegan. So meat/fish eaters have the same choices but the veggies have the option of what is usually rather uninspired and sometimes downright nasty vegan food.

I’ve been veggie for 36 years now and I’m finding that I have less choice now than I have in a long time. I don’t want fake cheese (yuk), fake chicken/beef/bacon, fake butter or cream, fake eggs...

The ‘protein’ in M&S is disgusting but since I won’t shop there anymore it’s not a problem now!

@megletthesecond definitely my brother is gluten free and only eats meat at home due to texture issues gluten free and Veggie/vegan would be amazing