having babies despite the state of the world

[TruthOnTrial]

I am wondering about any that are contemplating pregnancy at a time when the world weather is in crisis, fires ranging out of control across Aus, also california, and others. Floods regularly now around the UK, tornados even and more extreme weather generally, a summer just gone with record heatwave temps.

Many are making a decision to not start a family as the continuing viability of life on earth is ever more unsure.

Half a billion animals killed in the Aus fires alone. People having to lock themselves indoors and residents considering leaving Aus for good.

Is it U to consider bringing future children into this?

The world is already massively over-populated, and people's activities are contributing enormously to climate change - so I think it's a very sensible idea. I am always slightly baffled when MN, bastion of environmental concerns when it comes to flying, diet change and "plastic tat", urges women, who are posting about their desire for a third/fourth/fifth child, to keep trying to persuade their husbands to agree. It's like the ignorant argument that the UK needs more children because of a declining birthrate (conveniently ignoring the fact that our population has been increasing by a city the size of Manchester every year for a decade, and that declining birthrate only starts to be even a potential issue when a country's population is shrinking annually by a certain percentage).

It baffles me the amount of cognitive dissonance people will collude in so that what they want is justified, and the needs of the rest of the world are selfish. It's a global problem, that needs global solutions, of course - but this doesn't mean that Moira in Nottingham is entitled to bring another child into the world to add to her existing three because she "doesn't feel finished", as "China's power stations are the real problem",whilst at the same time twatting on about using beeswax wrap or whatever.

Although, admittedly, it probably doesn't actually matter, as the environment is fucked, and the price of climate change won't be paid by Moira's children anyway

It's one of the main factors which has influenced our decision to not have children.

Humans are the worst thing for the environment. I do worry what lives all these babies are going to have- water/food shortages etc.

It's going to affect us in my lifetime too. I couldn't bring any kids into that.

It's very hard to digest though and people don't like others saying it.

Probably going to get flamed for this but oh well. I have two kids and if I could go back in time, I'd still have them. However, I desperately (and I mean BADLY) want a third child but DH has made me see why we shouldn't (for these reasons stated). I'm gutted but he is right.

Well not any more actually as now the planet itself poses the ever increasing risk, so although there have always been risks managed, this one is way out of control and potentially unmanageable.

People are dying now. The fires are continuing to spread in Aus and create their own weather systems which bring lightning igniting further fires.

The equivalent looks like a fifth of the UK being alight. Noone can stop it.

This was forecast, years ago.

I don't see an argument for letting the human species die out

I wouldn't worry - I promise you, a few conscientious MNers declaring they're not having children is not going to wipe out the human race!

Putting that sort of pressure on one generation is unreasonable and will just make the mental health problem worse.

By only having one child, or smaller families in general, countries in the western world have already fallen below the rate needed to maintain their populations. Seems like a better solution to me.

No one knows what will happen in the future, we have a pretty good idea but no one can say when and what exactly will happen. So why is it so wrong to enjoy yourself while you can and if that’s surrounding yourself with children that you love then why not?

One way to improve viability of the species is definitely not to stop having children

If you don't want a child then don't have them but don't use the state of the world as an excuse because no one who really wants them does that.

The 'developed' world is killing those tribes that live with nature and respect its limits and other inhabitants. Those people have already lost their children, without the benefit of scientific prediction and insight the so-called 'developed' world has.

Decide is that meant to be serious, or seriously sarcastic..

I’m Australian. I’m actually considering moving back. No one I know has even mentioned moving away. The strongest comment I’ve had is ‘unusually big fires this year, must be climate change’. I guess most people live in cities and aren’t really affected although it is sad and occasionally smokey for a day or two, hopefully the drought will end and we won’t see a repeat for many years but I doubt it. I definitely would allow a few bushfires in outback regions of Australia put me off reproducing given that it has zero effect on my life.

The planet becoming a unviable environment to support life is hardly an 'excuse' is it.

Many want children but are now deciding against having them because they are thinking of their futire childrens sustainability.

The future terrifies me .

I look at my DDs who bring me enormous joy and feel so sorry they are inheriting such a mess. I feel I shouldn't have had DD2 just because it is now obvious how bad it is.

It's easy to say we've had problems before and overcome but I think this problem requires so much change and cooperation on an international scale it just won't be done. Everyone thinks it's not that bad or someone will fix it or anything they do on a personal level is futile.

I am in Australia and I want to leave as every time I leave my house I can see the smoke in the air and smell the burning. My children can't go outside because the air quality is so bad. People I know are losing their houses. The sheer scale of the fires is beyond comprehension.

And I know I'm one of the lucky ones. There are mothers who will watch their babies starve to death in less wealthy countries, who will be caught up in conflicts and succumb to disease... I know it's always happened but it is about to get much much worse.

I wish I could take comfort in there seemed to be general political willing to do something...anything but instead we get prayers not action and a throw away she'll be right.

We are so fucked

Theres a bigger picture unfolding, rapidly

I was born in the 60s. As a teen I was convinced we were on the verge of nuclear war. I wasn't going to have children because we would all soon die in a thermo nuclear blast.

DH convinced me it wasn't going to happen. Our 2nd DGC is due any day. I have passed menopause so couldn't have DC now. It's been 40 years since the Bomb was imminent but it hasn't happened yet.

If you don't want DC nobody is saying you have to have them, but don't make that decision on the basis of the climate. 40 years goes surprisingly fast.

Not to dismiss anything else you’ve said, but I’ve seen a few posts mentioning an expected mass migration from Australia. Many of us have no other nationality so I’m not sure where we’re meant to be going?

Back to the Old World on ancestry visas I suppose, although there seems to be far more UK to Australia migration than the reverse.

I don't know what the answer to the question is. By the time any of us knows whether we were right to have or not to have children, it will be too late to do anything about it.

Some of us have hope for the future, faith in the majority of humanity adapting to the changes in our environment and working together to deal with this crisis and make the necessary changes to slow down and eventually reverse global warming. Some of us believe in the good that the majority of humanity possesses. Perhaps we've lost our way a bit, we're not being the best that we can be. But how can you be certain that we can't or won't turn this all around? Or learn from our mistakes? Or evolve? Survival of the fittest is about adaptability. Humans can adapt, we have a history of adapting, changing the fabric of society, revolutions, innovation, discovery, learning, helping, working together, solving problems etc. I hope we will pull together and create a bright future. I am not ready to throw in the towel and give up on humanity.

Call me naive, but I don't think the majority of people are greedy. Looking at the entire population a small minority have unimaginable wealth, more than what anyone really needs. The people who profit most by keeping fossil fuels as the main source of providing electricity, transport, industry instead of investing in renewable energy are a small portion of the human race. They profit so much they don't want to give it up. They are greedy, they value the status and power that comes with wealth. They hold leadership positions or positions of power and influence. Despite their power and influence they are still the minority not the majority of the human race. Perhaps the majority of us will create another revolution and divert us from catastrophe.

This is simply the crisis ‘of the day’. Think back over the past 100 years or so when the threat of, or actual, world wars raged, the very real nuclear threat of the Cold War, the grimness of the 70s with strikes, no electric etc

And yet.....

This is simply the crisis ‘of the day’

You're right

So you have a self sustainable lifestyle OP?

People were saying this when I was in my twenties over forty years ago.
I had my children....they are now 43 and 40.
There's never been a perfectly safe time to have children, especially in other parts of the world, and yet, we are all here.

My great grandmother was born in 1913. The following year her father, a professional soldier, was off to war. My grandmother was born in 1934, in the aftermath of the Great Depression and with war brewing in Europe once again. Her sister was born in an air raid shelter during the Blitz. My mother was born in 1961 when the world seemed to be on the brink of nuclear Armageddon during the Cold War. The year of her birth saw the Berlin Walls construction, and happily the year of my birth the Wall came tumbling down.
What’s my point? My point is there has always been a good reason not to have babies. What’s the point of worrying about an unknown future.

Are you going to support your assertions OP with facts or just make doom laden non specific projections