Wheelchair / buggy on bus

[MoonlightMistletoe]

Today I had got the bus with my sister we both have children I had my toddler who was walking and my one year old who's only just started to walk who is still in a buggy, my sister has a 12week old baby who was also in a buggy.

We had got on the bus as you do and the next stop another parent got on with their buggy, a few stops later we stop and straight away a woman is screaming/shouting at the rear doors with her phone in our faces demanding we collapse our buggies, very angry , shouting at us with buggies and also at the driver. The driver is telling us to stay put due to her being aggressive and recording us. Someone on the bus was telling us to co operate with the woman who wanted to get a person on the bus who was in a wheelchair. We know disabled people are a priority and had absolutely not said we wouldn't put the buggies down, I was taking my sleeping one year out the buggy while this woman was still swearing and being nasty and recording us, I had given my baby to my sister to sit with my toddler and herself while I was about to take her baby out the pram then all of a sudden everyone made a "ohhhhhhh" gasp and the disabled man has fallen down the side of the curb and bus sideways in his wheelchair.

She then looses her absolute shit at us for her own mistakes being so caught up in recording us to make sure we move that the man is now probably injured.

AIBU to think all she had to do was say excuse me can we move the buggies so I can get the wheelchair on?

So are the people in the space supposed to psychically predict when there is going to be a wheelchair user at a stop they've yet to reach?

There are other options such as buying a foldable lie flat pushchair newborn.

It doesn’t matter how frustrated somebody is - it does not give them the right to start screaming and recording innocent people.

That’s the crux of the OP.

Oops accidentally hit post.

....suitable for newborns. That way parents could board and hold their baby and a folded pushchair. I get it’s hard for twins. But they’re aren’t likely to be many twins on the bus.

If the law were adhered to she wouldn’t have anything to get upset about. She is innocent yet being charged guilty by surprise surprise able bodied people, who have no idea what it is to walk smile in their shoes.

Whatever option you go for the person in that wheelchair spot can't just vacate instantly so there is no waiting for a person boarding in a wheelchair. The only way that might be possible is if the space was physically blocked off to the other passengers.

smile = a mile

Snuggly
It should be blocked because what we see is bus drivers abusing the system and refusing to board disabled passengers when there are buggies in the space. It’s clear this carer has experience of it. It is clear the bus driver in this op is guilty of abusing the system.

But the OP hasn’t broken any laws. She was ready to move as soon as she was asked. Taking this situation at face value, nothing at all justifies that level of abuse directed at someone else.

As he is abusing the system, op should report him - as I said upthread.

August
Are you disabled? I am. Please don’t tell me how a disabled person or their fed up carer should feel or act.

Of course I can say that abusing innocent people is inappropriate regardless of whether I’m disabled or not.

Being irritated - sure. Why wouldn’t you be? But screaming in someone’s face? That’s abusive and not justifiable.

And just as a reminder, the person shouting abuse wasn’t (as far as we know) disabled either. They were a carer. Are we extending the permission for abuse to friends and family too?

Ah so you’re not disabled. And you’re not a carer either I take it. So you have NO IDEA how it feels to be treated systematically as less than. To have to beg for the generosity of others for just having your basic needs and rights met. And how was she screaming in someone’s face when she was denied access to the bus?

So now we are making assumptions?

I don’t have to verify anything about my person life to once again say - there is NO justification for abusing an innocent person.

If you hold the position that abuse to an innocent person IS justifiable, then so be it. I hold the opinion that it is NOT excusable.

I asked you if you were disabled. No answer. Then my very very fair assumption that you’re not. So as you’re not, don’t presume to walk a mile in my shoes... if I could only walk a fucking mile.

As for op being innocent, she stopped being innocent the moment she didn’t challenge the law and posted on here instead.

You are making strawman arguments. My personal life (which you still don’t know) is not up for argument. I am arguing one position;

Abusing an innocent person IS NOT justifiable. That’s it. Are you saying it IS justifiable?

And the OP was innocent at the time of the incident - she was packing away her buggy despite the driver telling her not to. She did nothing wrong.

And how was she screaming in someone’s face when she was denied access to the bus?

As per the opening post:

we stop and straight away a woman is screaming/shouting at the rear doors with her phone in our faces demanding we collapse our buggies, very angry , shouting at us with buggies and also at the driver.

Nobody is denying that the wheelchair user had the right to use the space. However that does not give the person travelling with the wheelchair user carte blanche to scream at innocent people when they have done nothing wrong.

The law says that wheelchair users have priority, and nobody has denied that. That doesnt mean that you can get aggressive for not vacating the space when you havent actually given them an opportunity to vacate the space before you got aggressive.

You’re terribly naive if you think this woman was upset for no reason and that people with buggies systematically vacate the space and bus drivers systematically make them do so and systematically get the ramps out for wheelchair users. And that the bus driver refused this time... as a one off because of the woman getting irate. No. Not buying it at all.

So you're basically insinuating that the OP is a liar and has misrepresented what happened to vilify this carer ...

Perhaps this carer is well known to this driver because she goes out of her way to be rude/aggressive, using her companions disability as an excuse. Just because someone is disabled or a carer for a disabled person doesnt mean they can't also be a rude and/or aggressive person too.

The bus driver is under no obligation to accept abuse from passengers and has every right to defend the passengers who have already paid over an aggressive person who isnt yet actually a customer.

So you’re insinuating op is a liar. No. I’m not. I’m saying the bus driver or bus drivers on the route are 99.9% likely to be the ones causing the problem by not abiding by the law. The only other explanation is that the carer is mentally unstable. Only a mentally ill person would act as she did for no reason.

The whole point of a wheelchair space is that it is for the disabled to use, it should be left empty not filled by a pram 'because no one is using it' until a wheelchair user needs it.

Parents are the first to moan and shout if a person without kids parks in a child and parent space. And why? Because they see it as 'their' space even though it is advisory and not a legal right, unlike disabled bays.

The hypocrisy here is astounding. And it is clearly partly the bus driver's fault as he should know better.

It would take some refitting of busses but a blocked off space would make sense. I think letting people put large unwieldy buggies in the wheelchair bay was a mistake. It would also stop it being filled on an overcrowded bus

Signs should be enough Snuggly. Plus a buggy park for use for disabled parents maybe.

The space has a sign which allows for use by pram if empty but shows priority to person in wheelchair. So it is different to a parking space.

I'm thinking more when the bus is rammed and standing passengers end up crammed everywhere. No one gets on a bus intending to stand in the wheelchair area but you do kind of get hemmed in wherever there is space. The whole policy of letting people use it if empty and expecting people to be able to fold and move mid journey seems unrealistic. Its surely better for people to fold buggies like they used to and keep it empty.

Anecdotally when I'm asked why I use a sling on the bus and I explain its because I'd rather not have to negotiate folding a buggy or having to get off mid journey my friends are surprised. I don't get why because I thought it was well known but most people I talk to have no idea that they might have to make way for a wheelchair. I think normalising large unfolded buggies on busses has been detrimental for people needing wheelchair and disability spaces.

Of course if drivers don't enforce the policy then it's as useless as any policy that doesn't get enforced.