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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To want to protect this money

81 replies

Foxylass · 27/12/2019 00:27

I have been lurking for ages - first post.

In a nutshell - my DH and I have worked hard for years and now are in a position to gift our DC's a good bit of money.
We are thinking chunk of deposit on a flat/small house. We will hold onto it till the DC's are ready to buy, which should not be long..
We are however worried, what if our DC's go off the rails - not likely, they are all quite stable and money savvy - could we protect the 'gift' in some way?
Also, that a future partner or spouse etc..might have some kind of claim on it.
Of course in the long run if a partner/spouse has contributed (financially or in a supportive manner) or if there are children (our grandkids) we would expect them to be secure BUT for the first few years how do we ensure security for our DC's?
AIBU to want to protect the money - should it simply be a gift that we write off after handing it over?

We would never want the money back.

First world type problem I know - but we have worked so hard for so long and we are very lucky to be able to get the kids started in this way - it would be a shame if it all got lost somehow.

OP posts:
Havaina · 27/12/2019 00:31

YANBU, I would want to protect it too. Have you spoken to a solicitor?

Original poster
Foxylass · 27/12/2019 00:37

We have not taken advice at all yet, no.

OP posts:
katewhinesalot · 27/12/2019 00:42

Watching with interest. This will be our problem soon.

Lifecanonlygetbetter · 27/12/2019 00:46

And us, money inherited unexpectedly and invested.

fallfallfall · 27/12/2019 01:09

legal advice is probably preferable but i have two friends who have the homes in joint names with their adult children and in one case had the partner sign papers that they have no recourse to the house.

justcly · 27/12/2019 01:19

" i have two friends who have the homes in joint names with their adult children and in one case had the partner sign papers that they have no recourse to the house. "

If the property is the joint home and there are children of the union I could overturn that in a heartbeat. Otherwise, I could probably still overturn it, but it might take slightly longer. Once you have gifted money, it is no longer yours, and you have no legal interest in what happens to it.

Japanesejazz · 27/12/2019 01:25

Yes, you can protect the money if this is used to buy a property
You can place a restriction on the title so that the money can be returned to you if the property is sold. Although any charge on the property i.e. a mortgage will have priority over your restriction. A solicitor can draw this up for you, and it will be submitted to land registry and registered against the property when the property is purchased

Japanesejazz · 27/12/2019 01:29

You need a deed of trust
As said previously, a gifted deposit is just that. A gift, you cannot claim it back

Original poster
Foxylass · 27/12/2019 01:33

Thank you.
We dont think we would want to be joint owners because if there is a mortgage and it was defaulted on - we might become responsible?
We also do not want responsibility for other property.

It's a worry. We had such good thoughts to begin with but now it seems sad to be thinking this way.... You hear so many stories of people being ripped off.

OP posts:
Original poster
Foxylass · 27/12/2019 01:35

Thank you Japanesejazz. We will look into a deed of trust.
We would not want the money back, just to protect it for the first few years.

OP posts:
Rachelfromfriends1 · 27/12/2019 01:35

Seek legal advice.

KareyHunt · 27/12/2019 01:55

You can't sort this out through AIBU!

Find a decent solicitor who specialises in property. Take preliminary advice now. And then use her for all three conveyances when the time comes. Don't use licenced conveyancers or anyone "recommended" by estate agents. It's probably time to review your wills too.

justcly · 27/12/2019 01:59

@Foxylass:

A Deed of Trust may be the answer if you are talking about a current partner. However I believe that you said that your concern was a future partner, in which case a Deed of Trust will not work for you. If, as I understand, you are considering paying an amount towards the deposit on a property your DC will be buying alone, but are concerned about the impact of a future partner moving in, what you will need is a Living Together Arrangement, which sets out each partner's financial obligations, as well as contributions to, and interest in, the purchase of the property. However, please be mindful that a Living Together Arrangement is an agreement between your DC and their partner, and neither you nor your DH can be an interested party or signatory to the agreement. Also a LTA will not stand if the couple later marry, or enter into a Civil Partnership, and the courts would take a dim view of any LTA that excludes the interests of any child of the union, or for whom your DC assumes parental responsibility. You need legal advice, but the bottom line is, you can't really maintain a legal interest in money that you have gifted.

BillHadersNewWife · 27/12/2019 02:03

Justcly OP cannot ask her children to ask their partners to sign that! It's outrageous! I mean...what if the couple went on to have kids? Or OP's DC decided to stop work and let their partner pay all the bills.

Pixxie7 · 27/12/2019 02:09

Whilst understanding what your saying I think you to trust you DC as it’s not really a gift if it has strings attached.

Verily1 · 27/12/2019 02:10

Just tell your dcs not to marry and to maintain their home themselves so no one else ever has a claim on it.

Best advice for dcs in any case!

lboogy · 27/12/2019 02:12

I don't know about this. If you gift money to your children, you can't control what should or shouldn't happen to it. You just have to trust that you've raised them to be financially responsible.

A gift that comes with conditions based on scenarios A, B or C is not a gift imo but a tool of control.

SoEverybodyDance · 27/12/2019 02:32

My siblings and i each inherited money when a relative died. I was 14 and had some time to get used to and appreciate the value of it. I used it to pay for my university education, put a deposit on a house, travel for a couple of years and decades later I have a little bit left even! It set me up for life and I'm now mortgage free. It was a marvellous gift.

I was lucky. One of my siblings, who was 18 at the time we inherited, was less responsible and spent it all in two years and quickly got into debt. My parents had to bail them out and it was a source of great conflict and aggravation in the family. It was very frightening for my parents and probably made the rest of us much more cautious.

If I was to do the same, I'd wait until my children were 30+ so they'd established themselves, earned a bit of money first and got used to the idea they had to make their own way.

Good luck with it and well done!

justcly · 27/12/2019 02:55

@BillHadersNewWife:

I agree, it is an awful thing to expect your child to ask of his/her partner. However, the OP asked for advice, and I am setting out the legal (not the moral) position. And, it bears repeating, whilst Deeds of Trust and LTAs can afford some protection, a decent lawyer representing the partner or a child of the union would have little difficulty in overturning it. The basic principle stands - you cannot give money away and retain a legal interest in what happens to it.

GreenTulips · 27/12/2019 03:15

I think there are ISAs where the government pay a % into the savings for a house deposit

Not sure what it’s call though

Modestandatinybitsexy · 27/12/2019 03:34

I was gifted money for a deposit by my parents. When I bought a house I bought it with my DP and we both contributed to the mortgage but I put down 100% of the deposit. We signed an deed of trust that would return the deposit to me if we sold the house. The next house we bought DP was outearning me and contributing more to the mortgage and we were about to get married so we did away with the dot.

I think yabu to try and ringfence the money if your dc gets married, I guess you would need a pre-nup type arrangement which is unenforceable in the uk.

Soon2BeMumof3 · 27/12/2019 03:43

The legal position is one aspect, but I think the relationship aspect should be given more weight.

If you try to quarantine this money for you or your child, then that will impact their relationships. I know some people get married but keep money separate, personally I don't understand it and would rather be all in on building a life and creating wealth with my partner. You having an agreement that 'this is mine' undermines that sense of shared property and goals. It's like a mini pre-nup within the marriage, which can be insulting to the spouse. It's also inserting yourself into what should be a partnership, which never goes well (as a million MIL threads on here will tell you.)

My DH's parents gave him some money towards property before we were dating. They all signed a bogus 'loan' agreement which is supposed to fool a court into thinking it wasn't a gift and therefore shouldn't be assets in the case of a separation. I happen to be a lawyer and I know the court would not give any weight to this 'loan' and in fact it would probably only make them look bad for trying to remove assets.

It bothers me. It impacts how i feel about my in-laws. It impacts how I feel about the (significantly more) assets I brought to the marriage, as I think of them as 'ours' while the assets he brought to the marriage is apparently his and his family's.

If you want to give, then give. Don't risk the relationships at play by adding strings.

Cloudykisses · 27/12/2019 03:53

I know you are trying to protect them but to be honest as long as they have no special needs then I think it needs to be given to them when they are adults, with no strings attached, with good grace.

Otherwise just keep it and give it as an inheritance when they die.

Cloudykisses · 27/12/2019 03:54

When you die

MinnieMountain · 27/12/2019 06:55

"don't use licensed conveyancers" Sorry, but that's utter bollocks. I'm a solicitor who works for one. They are specialists in conveyancing. Obviously looks at reviews, and some firms are crap. But that's just plain snobbery.