To start saying no.

[Notwavingimdrowning]

I don’t post very often but when I do it is always about the same things so I hope some of you recognise my username and remember the history between myself and DIL.
I have been looking after dgs on a regular basis at least a couple of times a week when my DIL went back to work after maternity leave. This has included overnight stays as she works shifts, as I do and my ds is away till after Christmas. Child care is split between us, her parents and nursery depending on all of our work schedules, I also look after Dgs when she has appointments, or want she to go out etc all of which I am very happy to do and is not an issue but is just for context. The only time I ever hear from DIL at all is to arrange for me to look after Dgs and I’m really starting to feel like an unpaid babysitter rather than a grandparent. For instance I will receive a txt that says here is my rota can you send me yours so I can work out child care this month, or can you have DGS for a few hours so I can go out with my friends, thanks. All fine and I will rearrange plans etc so have never said no. DGS birthday recently and if I hadn’t asked to go and drop his gift off I wouldn’t have been aware that she had organised a party tea at home with her family as none of us were invited. Slightly awkward and hurtful but not unexpected. With my son away, I will txt ( have been asked not to ring in case she is busy/ DGS is asleep, even though I’ve probably only tried ringing perhaps 5 times in the past few years) to see if she is ok or needs anything and these txts are ignored, (you can see they have been read), until she needs me to babysit then she will respond to the previous txt that may have been sent days ago in order to ask if I’m free to have DGS rude but still ok and I don’t worry about it.
I have just received a text that says what are you working over Christmas as I only have Xmas day off so I am staying at my parents house, I could bring him round and leave him with you Boxing Day so that I can have a few hours sleep before work ? She has had my work schedule for over a month and therefore knows I will be at work, so that’s not possible and it was purely to let me know she won’t be bringing him round Christmas morning as was planned. Her parents are about a 5 minutes drive from us so not really that inconvenient to spare us an hour on Christmas morning, but ok I’m upset but her choice. I’m also at work right up until New Years Eve but working New Years Day. I then received another text to say will I babysit on New Years Eve as I’m off and her parents are going out. AIBU to say actually no, I’m not free, even though I am, but at work early the next day. This means that I won’t see Gs over the festive period at all. My DH thinks I’m cutting my nose off to spite my face in not having him and we could have our Christmas with him then, but I feel like a babysitter and that if she cannot even spare us an hour on Christmas Day, when we won’t see him any other time, then why should I drop everything like I always do so that she can go out. I’m really torn as I adore Dgs and have always had him willingly and happily, but it is literally the only time that she contacts us. I’m sick of feeling like a childminder at her beck and call but also know that if I stop looking after him when she wants us to, I will never see him at all.

I think you need to tell her nicely how you feel. She has become very reliant on your flexibility and is taking you for granted but if you point out your wants/needs it might make her wake up a bit and be more considerate. I would ask her if she can pop round on Christmas Day to swap presents or if you can go over to her family for an hour perhaps. You need to communicate more and make your voice heard instead of feeling put out in silence. Good luck.

That’s really not ok. I can count on the fingers of one hand the times my mil has looked after the dc, and they are 17, 12 and 10.
Say no. I find if you say no, people respect you more, I think she’s taking you for granted.

She's a CF, sorry.

I've stopped in for 13 NYE now too with children, it's not a hardship.

This is really difficult for you. I agree with mummadeeze that you need to talk to her about how you're feeling.

If you'd like to see him New Year's Eve then I would. But resolve to bring this up with her soon. You don't have to be confrontational. She probably just thinks you're all getting a good deal. She gets childcare and you get to see him. But I can see it's hurtful for you if that's the only way you'll see him.

The other thing you could do (in the new Year) is just slowly introduce a few more "no I'm not free, sorry/I can do x date but not y date" responses so she stops taking you for granted.

I think mother's like your DIL have a total cheek. They don't spend time with the childminding grandmother, they don't even hold conversations with the grandmother but expect the grandmother to babysit/childmind without fail. This is also without consideration that the grandparents may just want to be grandparents and not a nursery.
I took that cr@p for a very long time and even didn't complain when I was not getting help with things despite the constant childminding. I got the usual retribution from the mother, if I don't do as requested or was that demanded with menaces I was excluded completely from the child's life.
At least this way I am not having my good nature abused and I have self respect.

The thing is, if you say no, nothing will change afterwards. It will just mean you won't see Dgs so you're the one that is losing out.
I'd have him on that date and once, Xmas is over I think your relationship with DIL needs working on. Maybe you need to include her in things too, invite them all round for dinner or suggest going out to places so the relationship dynamics change, she may start to view you more as a grandmother then, rather than a babysitter. I say this with 2 dds myself and my mil looks after them more than other family members.

Ouch.

You're both adults and part of an adult relationship is recognising the full being of another person.

She doesn't recognise you as a full being, does she?

I think you need to arrange a coffee with her in a cafe (neutral space; both of you together as people, with no children) and have a chat about how you feel.

Standard advice for those conversations is to use 'I feel ...' a lot, and listen.

It takes the sting out of what you're saying and makes things more collaborative. It leaves an opening for her to say things like, 'I had no idea ... I've been so busy, I didn't notice ...[and ideally] I'm sorry I made you feel this way.'

It will require yet more work from you, which may be a bit irritating - but it may get there outcome you want.

Be clear before you start about what you do want: amorphous goals like 'more consideration; appreciation; being treated like a human, not a slave/apparatus like a washing-machine.
Less of a workload.
Being included in affective activities, not just used for childcare.
More warning about schedule changes.

Realistically, this is only going to work ^if you, yourself, work on your own boundaries.

Yes, you are being exploited.
No, you can't just say that (sadly).
Something has gone wrong somewhere for you to end up in this situation.
Either you have picked up that she is a bit scary and you are worried about - what? Not seeing your GC? Her temper-hostility? - if you say 'no' to anything

• or you generally have low self-esteem and constantly let others set your boundaries for you.

Or it could be somewhere between those things. Or something else.

It's a very difficult situation.

In the past, I have been in your situation with friends. Sadly, I ended up walking away from those friendships. Obviously, you can't do that.

It's hard, hard, hard. You have my sympathy.

She’s really not treating you like Grandma/Nan is she, she’s using you as free childcare.
I’d feel really hurt to not be invited to the party, she obviously doesn’t see you as close.
Why didn’t you ask her why she’s changed the plans for Xmas day morning?
And are you sure that if you stopped jumping up whenever she asked you to then she’d take him away? Surely that would be spiting herself and she’d be a bit stuck as she relies on you so much?

SIt down and talk to her.

I would be unavailable on this occasion.
I would only babysit when it suits me.
I would not say anything to her as this will result in you not seeing the child.
I would say I’ll pop over Christmas Day and drop dgs presents of at her parents if she’s not coming over Christmas Day as planned (maybe ask her are you still popping Over Christmas Day).
She’s a user but I’d your ds is away she does not have to facilitate a relationship at all so be careful.

By the way, one conversation alone won't do it.

It may help for you to think of it as 'The 2020 Project' in the grounds that by this time next year there will be an improvement.

Small steps, taking you to where you need to be.

(I strongly suspect you know your DiL is 'difficult' - because, really, most people would be falling over themselves in gratitude about the free childcare. So, either you have a desperate need to be loved or she's a bit 'tricky'. And it's more likely, given your ages, she's 'tricky'.)

She is an absolute CF. The problem is from what you've said here, I would worry that the minute you say something she may restrict access to your DGS or start being awkward. She sounds like that kind of DIL. You need to be assertive but gentle in approach for the sake of your grandson.

You need to talk to her. Do not do the 'not babysit, only do it occasionally' advice. It will just make you look unreasonable and cause more of an issue.

Talking is so much better. Also is your S back at Christmas. What is his view on it.

YANBU @Pennypinkhair and i’m not being forward to being you as I only have a son as well. My MIL only has sons and if she didn’t make a massive effort with DH’s ex then she’d never see them (we live 100 miles away so it’s harder for us to facilitate contact) I genuinely feel for you and don’t understand why these women do this

Yes and the party thing is absolutely shitty behaviour on her part. What a bitch.

Wow you've been very accommodating. Shes been very lucky! But now you need to push back a little. Yanbu

This is really really sad to read. You are obviously a very kind lovely lady who is more than happy to help out which she takes full advantage of. It was sad reading about dgs birthday and also that you won't see him Christmas morning. What a selfish cow dil is. Could you maybe tell her how you feel or talk to your ds when he's back. You should be included in the important celebrations too not just used for babysitting

Your DIL is incredibly rude and to not be invited to your GCs party tea given the way you support the family in unforgivable. I would talk to both your DS and DIL frankly and if they aren’t more courteous and considerate of your feelings I would withdraw all childcare.

Have you talked to your son about all this? Surely he gets a say in the relationship between his child and his parents, such that she couldn't just cut you off?

I would text back, and before mentioning NYE, ask if she will still be coming round Christmas morning as planned?, or can you go to her mums?, and see what her response is to that, before committing yourself to babysitting. Then see how you feel depending on the response you get. Let us know.

Can you discuss it with her face to face rather than over text?

Her behaviour is fucking outrageous. I rely on my mum and my MIL to look after DS the three days a week I work and I still expect to have fun days out and events with them around that. It's so unfair she isn't planning to bring him round on Xmas day morning - I'd really bring that up as the priority.

Wow op I was you 2 years ago. Had dgc 2 nights weekly. All the same issues as you. Free childcare and nothing more. Came to a head when I didn't even get a Xmas card in 2017... Told ds I was withdrawing all childcare. Haven't spoke to dil (they have been split since dgc was a baby) since. See dgc on a Sunday when ds brings him.
No regrets. My mh was suffering as was my family life..

Thank you for your replies. This is just one issue in the very many problems that we have had in the years that she has been with DS. I know that she simply does not like our family and uses us for childcare when convenient. I have tried to have several conversations over the years but she isn’t interested at all. She does not engage with us unless impossible not to do so. She has treated us appallingly over the years ( see previous posts ! ) and I have shed so many tears that I do not give our none existent relationship head space any longer as nothing I have tried to do in the past has ever made things any easier. It is without any doubt that unless we are babysitting we would not see DGS at all, she will deliberately walk past us in the street unless she is with DS who obviously stops to talk. I don’t have low self esteem but bite my tongue for the sake of peace and to ensure that we still get to see DGS, even though it is only ever on her terms. I’m just really sick of being a second class person in her eyes and allowing her to treat us this way. I allow it because I know that if I say or do anything then the fragile relationship that I have with DGS and DS will be over.

How does your son feel about her just walking past you in the street and ignoring you?

She is incredibly rude and realistically if it did all go pear would her parents willingly do all the childcare you currently do including nights? Would she be able to increase the number of nursery days and afford to do that?

She is betting on your relationship with your Grandson for you not to rock the boat. But she is treating you like a childminder and not a Grandparent. I am assuming she just drops the child off, never stays to talk to you. It is terribly sad.

You're actually in a stronger position than you think as she needs you to care for dgs.
There's no easy answer and I think dil probably has huge self esteem issues rather than actively dislikes you. (I have previous experience of a similar situation).
Would your ds allow his wife to cut you out as grandparents? I know my son wouldn't.
Choose where your priorities lie and decide accordingly.