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AIBU?

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Original poster

To agree with JK Rowling?

999 replies

StraightenUpAndFryRight · 20/12/2019 09:22

mobile.twitter.com/jk_rowling/status/1207646162813100033

‘Dress however you please.
Call yourself whatever you like.
Sleep with any consenting adult who’ll have you.
Live your best life in peace and security.
But force women out of their jobs for stating that sex is real?
#IStandWithMaya #ThisIsNotADrill’

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
VMisaMarshmallow · 21/12/2019 01:05

I’ll be self IDing as John then. I want to dance to Barry white in court and pretend that’s a career too.

JulyKit · 21/12/2019 01:07

Not sure I'm allowed to mention this on MN, Prodigal but have you heard of Stephanie Hayden? Steph's your straight up, bona fide self-identifying lawyer. Not sure the Law Society's granted S a practising certificate (something to do with criminal convictions, as I understand it - or maybe it was just Steph's grades).
Seems jolly mean of the Law Society though. I mean, what about Steph's feelz, and everything? Sad

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 21/12/2019 01:09

I'm very familiar with the golfer in question's work!

Nunsnetting · 21/12/2019 01:13

JulyKit

You come across as an intelligent and well-meaning person, so I hope you won't take it amiss if I offer you some (kindly) advice.

When someone resorts to including personal insults such as 'prat' as part of their defence (note - this is often referred to as descending into an 'ad hominem' argument) it's usually taken to be a sign that they've exhausted all logical reasoning and have resorted to a primitive 'fight or flight' mode.

It's commendable that you've chosen 'fight' rather than 'flight' - this speaks volumes for your character and integrity - but I think you could shine even more brightly by channelling your spirit and determination into something more.

Learning to think critically, and developing debating skills that rely on rather more than name-calling, would stand you in great stead and command you much greater respect from those you wish to engage in future 'verbal duels'.

An important part of commanding credibility in debate, is to understand the concept of nuance. Like the famous curate's egg, it is possible for an argument to be 'good in parts'.

In that spirit, I commend a part of JKR's words to you - "Live your best life in peace and security" - and I urge you to find 'your best life' by eschewing the childish urge to 'fight' in favour of developing your powers of argument; your ability to respond not only passionately, but insightfully to your challengers.

It has been an honour to engage with you; and I am confident you will only grow stronger in understanding and wisdom as the years roll on.

Wishing you everlasting peace and security. Flowers

JulyKit · 21/12/2019 01:16

Well done, @Nunsnetting!
10/10 for effort!
Go well!

VMisaMarshmallow · 21/12/2019 01:16

People tend to get condescending when they have no valid argument. Same way they latch onto being pedantic to deflect from the fact their argument is void.

CharlottesPleb · 21/12/2019 01:17

I also saw that trans couple in the paper recently (trans man Jake graf and a trans woman who used to be an army captain, often in the press for being married and both being transgender), they are set to become parents as a surrogate is carrying their child. Anyway, they have said a few times they are having a baby girl, their daughter etc. How do they know they are having a girl??? If there’s no such thing as biological sex and the child hasn’t even been born yet

This bears repeating because it's important.

Being a trans person, and being a TRA who campaigns for paradoxical things that erase womanhood, these are not necessarily the same thing.

No trans person I have ever known has had any interest in special extra half-measure genders, in getting self id pre-op men into situations typically reserved for vulnerable women/girls, or in breaking feminism.

I have strong reservations about the purpose behind a lot of these conceptsm

JulyKit · 21/12/2019 01:20

I'm very familiar with the golfer in question's work!

Thought you might be Grin
As for their exclusion from the Law Society, I guess that Steph must just keep thinking of the old Groucho Marx quote: "Any club that would have me as a member..."
Dear oh dear Xmas Grin

Nunsnetting · 21/12/2019 01:20

Likewise, @JulyKit.

JulyKit · 21/12/2019 01:22

Oh, one more thing:
When someone resorts to including personal insults such as 'prat' as part of their defence (note - this is often referred to as descending into an 'ad hominem' argument) it's usually taken to be a sign that they've exhausted all logical reasoning and have resorted to a primitive 'fight or flight' mode.

... or, alternatively, they're dealing with a prat.

Evening, all.

Nunsnetting · 21/12/2019 01:24

As the famous saying goes, @JulyKit, it takes one to know one!

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 21/12/2019 01:24

Sleep well, GMT zone people!

PJsatMidday · 21/12/2019 01:26

I can't believe someone is seriously suggesting they are female because they have a "female" name.

What about someone called Andrea? That might be a female name here in the UK, but it's a male name in most parts of continental Europe. Do Uk Andreas change sex when they go on holiday?

How about Alex, Kit, Jo, Terry, Sam, Jerry. How do they know if they are male or female?

What if you are named River, Sky, Apple, Blanket? How do you know if you are male or female?

How about Kajal, Sujal, Viral, Harshal, Deepal, Bobby, Mrinal, Jyoti, Shakti, Nilam, Kiran, Lucky, Ashwini, Shashi, Malhar, Umang, Shubham and Anupam? How do they know if they are male or female? How do you know?

How about Aalam, Aang, Aaradhya, Afsar, Akira, Bai, Bhagyi, Bo, Chaman, Chang, Chiaki ? How do they know they are male or female? How do you?

What a fucking batshit argument for knowing you are a female.

It's also beyond insulting to suggest that not calling a biological man a man is on par with not calling a black person the N word. But there we go, the racism of TRAs is never far from their thought process.

Nunsnetting · 21/12/2019 01:28

I can't believe someone is seriously suggesting they are female because they have a "female" name.

Are you missing the difference between being female and identifying as female?

ErrolTheDragon · 21/12/2019 01:30

What about someone called Andrea? That might be a female name here in the UK, but it's a male name in most parts of continental Europe. Do Uk Andreas change sex when they go on holiday?

OT, but that's a funny example as the origin of name, andrós, means 'manly'!

VMisaMarshmallow · 21/12/2019 01:33

PJ I always think it’s super funny Aubrey is now considered an exclusively female name, when it means king of the elfs.

Totally of point I know, just think ‘female name’ is such a stupid term.

Nunsnetting · 21/12/2019 01:35

PJ I always think it’s super funny Aubrey is now considered an exclusively female name

Really? I have never heard of Aubrey as a female name. Are there any examples of female Aubreys you can give to support this assertion?

PJsatMidday · 21/12/2019 01:43

Are you missing the difference between being female and identifying as female?

Please explain the difference.

JanesKettle · 21/12/2019 01:46

I love that 94% of Mumsnet mums stand with JKR :)

ArranUpsideDown · 21/12/2019 01:47

Really? I have never heard of Aubrey as a female name. Are there any examples of female Aubreys you can give to support this assertion?

Bread:

And Aubrey was her name,
A not so very ordinary girl or name
But who's to blame?

Singer-songwriter Aubrey O'Day

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aubrey_O%27Day

Many examples.

Nunsnetting · 21/12/2019 01:51

'Many examples' (and you've only given one) doesn't make it 'exclusively female' though, does it?

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 21/12/2019 01:54

I love that 94% of Mumsnet mums stand with JKR

Perhaps this will help the mods feel more confident in saying no to unreasonable demands from those who want anything too honest deleted.

JanesKettle · 21/12/2019 01:56

If you think 'woman' means taking a name that is traditionally feminine, and declaring yourself to be a woman, regardless of material reality, then you are in a tiny, quite insane bubble and should probably get out of it and go and talk to the other 99.9% of humans worldwide who understand that there are two sexes only, and that no-one in the entire world can change sex. People can use hormones and surgery to allieve dsyphoria and simulate woman, but the only people who are women ? Are females.

JanesKettle · 21/12/2019 01:57

Perhaps this will help the mods feel more confident in saying no to unreasonable demands from those who want anything too honest deleted

Not counting on it. Women are product here, we create the market for advertisers. Advertisers get to set the rules, otherwise the Feminism and Women's Rights board wouldn't have special rules that don't apply elsewhere.

PJsatMidday · 21/12/2019 01:58

I'm sure if I met an Aubrey, I would know they were a male or a female because evolution and millennia of human existence has programmed me to be able to tell a man from a woman. Basically, I have eyes in my head. I don't need a name.

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