fairytale new york homophobia disguised christmas cheer

[Ontheboardwalk]

This is my Christmas song, Christmas starts when I hear this song. Kirsty MacColl sounds fabulous.

It’s all over the newspapers again about the outrage.

Shane MacGowan has explained a million times what the word faggot means in his life and this song. There’s no harm in the song

AIBU that outrage at this word finishes and everyone should all sing along together to a great tune

I can so easily avoid the Faggot meatballs, I don’t even know where they are kept in the supermarket - in the fridge section? Don’t know.

They play the word Faggot at my son’s primary school disco. It’s on the radio when I pick up my daughter from nursery. It’s all over Facebook because people will defend their right to hear faggot because fuck anyone who is bullied for being gay, it’s a rude word at Christmas!

@Pumperthepumper if my child used them in the context of an insult I wouldn't, if my child used them in the context, as is the case of the fairytale of New York I would be fine.

Should my child not be able to be served faggots as a meal and say "I hate faggots", as they would say "I hate broccoli".

Context is everything and maybe teach your child that?

I can so easily avoid the Faggot meatballs, I don’t even know where they are kept in the supermarket - in the fridge section? Don’t know.

So you would rather avoid something than teach your child to deal with it effectively.

Absolutely ridiculous, you should be saying not every use if the word (it any other word) is used against you. You will need to learn throughout life that and deal with it effectively.

Not, it Might be offensive so let's just ban it, because my snowflake can't effectively tell the difference because Ive taught them that way of thinking.

Context is everything and maybe teach your child that?

Sure, I will! As I said upthread, next time Sl1pkn0ts young gay son is called a faggot, he should be encouraged to double check with the bullies whether they mean ‘derogatory term for gay person’ or ‘thirty-two year old Shane McGowan song/Irish/Liverpudlian’ version.

Same if my son uses the word ‘Spaz’ I’ll explain to him the 1952 context and not the 2019 context. Sound advice 👍

I hate this song, it makes me skin craw

So you would rather avoid something than teach your child to deal with it effectively.

Context seems an issue for you, which is weird when you argue so strongly about how important it is.

Faggots (meatballs) are not shoved in my sons face regularly over the Christmas period. He has no opportunity to know about faggots (meatballs) because they are not regularly referenced on the radio over the Christmas period.

Calling someone a Faggot (in a derogatory way, in a song) however, is regularly shoved in his face over Christmas, encouraged in fact!

Sure, I will! As I said upthread, next time Sl1pkn0ts young gay son is called a faggot, he should be encouraged to double check with the bullies whether they mean ‘derogatory term for gay person’ or ‘thirty-two year old Shane McGowan song/Irish/Liverpudlian’ version.

I think he will be able to tell the difference, body language, tone etc.

Ok to say "I hate faggots when served to you and you don't like them?" Or are you going to say they mustn't be served in your child's presence?

Love it.

Ok to say "I hate faggots when served to you and you don't like them?" Or are you going to say they mustn't be served in your child's presence?

I honestly have no idea what this means.

I honestly have no idea what this means.

Doesn't surprise me, you do struggle to understand things like faggot also means "tyke".

I do struggle to understand why people want words like faggot and spaz used in 2019, yes.

Actually @Pumperthepumper if I called my cat a faggot then my neighbours would understand as they both Irish .....

Regardless I've never called anyone a bloody faggot in my life and don't intend to start now 🤦‍♀️

Should my child not be able to be served faggots as a meal and say "I hate faggots", as they would say "I hate broccoli”

I once got a huge and very public telling off in a restaurant because i described a wet hanky as “sodden”.

My local primary school was studying roald dahl recently and there was uproar on social media as he calls cinderella a “slut”.

Language evolves. I don’t think we should ban Dahl, and I don’t think we should ban the pogues.

In fact Fairytale of new York is probably the only song that makes you think- christmas isn’t all sparkly and happy for everyone. Peoples lives can be shit, even at christmas.

I do struggle to understand why people want words like faggot and spaz used in 2019, yes.

The song wasn't written in 2019? It's part of the lyrics, it's not offensive in context.

Maybe if it was a new song the word faggot wouldn't have been used.

I think that those who are so upset about the cultural use of this 30 year old song would be better spent writing or emailing British radio and TV stations , boycott any that do , starting an online petition etc instead of getting upset and venting on Mumsnet.
If you are that bothered take a stand and do something about it .
Otherwise just switch off or turn over when this song comes on.

Pumperthepumper

Unless your cat was born in God's own county or self IDs as a Yorkshire terrier I'll ask you to refrain from using that particular term of affection.

Let's sterilise everything! Leave the Pogues song alone. It's part of Xmas!

Coincidentally to this thread appearing, the man behind me at the self checkout till yesterday had a box of beer, a bottle of vodka, 2 bottles of red wine and a box of Brains Faggots which he carefully placed at the front of the belt.

I totally forgot to be completely outraged at the word 'faggot' on the box.
The only thing that crossed my mind was how much I loved them c.1980.

So I’ve just discovered that it’s not ‘you’re an old southern drunk’ but instead uses ‘slut’.

I don’t like the song. I don’t like the use of offensive words. I don’t understand why people say ‘well it’s insulting to women as well so that’s ok’.
If a group of people are saying a word / phrase is insulting then we need to listen to that - I know plenty of gay people who are hurt by the F word and to say the song is referring to the dish or a bundle of twigs is disingenuous at best.
So yes, I think the word should be bleeped out, and while we are at it you can take out the s one as well.
As for hip hop, that’s also problematic for playing on radio - and I think it should be addressed.

But as ever with these discussions, when people say ‘oh well cuz song has offensive lyrics as well so let’s just leave everything alone’ - there’s not a limited number of bleeps or edits that can be made! Take all the offensive stuff out!
What you listen to in your own home is your issue and if you want to play the original in all its glory then crack on.

Do you know what I do when I don't like a song or I find it offensive?
I turn it over or don't listen. This is because I am a grown up and I realise people have different tastes.
Snowflakes are trying to ruin everything.

Unless your cat was born in God's own county or self IDs as a Yorkshire terrier I'll ask you to refrain from using that particular term of affection.

What?

‘well it’s insulting to women as well so that’s ok’.
Who said that though?
And how is saying faggot has different meaning disingenuous? Yes we all know that in the US it is a slur, but that really does not mean it is elsewhere. Brain’s faggots above is a perfect example. In this song it was meant to be an insult but IT IS NOT HOMOPHOBIC.

The author of the song is on record as being homophobic. His reference to The Pet Shop boys is appalling.The term is homophobic both here and abroad, it is offensive to many.

It needs to be blanked out.

And referring to people who have suffered from homophobic insults as snowflakes frankly sums up the attitudes of those who wish to keep it. Pretty shit really.