To be sick of ‘turkey voting for Christmas’ comments if you are voting for a party somebody doesn’t like

[missingdale]

It’s a stupid analogy.

If I voted Labour, there would be some parts of their manifesto that would benefit me. Same for Conservatives and Lib Dems.

There are also things from each of the main parties that wouldn’t benefit me.

So AIBU to think I’ll vote for who the fuck I like?

And merry Christmas.

I feel the same as you. Trouble is, I’m still trying to figure out which party has more of the policies I do favour.

Here you go, try this
www.whoshouldyouvotefor.com

But Sunderland might just, maybe, possibly, have voted to leave for reasons that had nothing whatsoever to do with cars.

Whatever reasons individuals may have given, the area still voted against its own economic interests. Turkeys still voted for Christmas.

People who think they have a right to abuse and mock people for their political choice are the idiots. We live in a fought-for democracy. The snide comments and digs are a sign of small minds. They also like to tell tens of millions of people that they don’t know what they’re voting for, that it’s all media bias, that they’re ill informed, etc etc.
It’s all bollocks. I try to ignore as best I can. However, quotes such as ‘losing the NHS, not needing a state education for your children’ perhaps seems they are the ill informed ones...

It is the point.

Let me put it this way. Conservatives are going to ruin the NHS (apparently) and so as someone who can’t afford private health care I am apparently a turkey voting for Christmas.

OTOH, Labour are going to raise taxes. So my family will struggle - am I still a turkey voting for Christmas?

It’s best fit. It always is.

I like it, I find it quite accurate.

The NHS is not going anywhere.

Yes it is, how many times to the right wing have to be caught out making policies and actively promoting their views for an insurance based system? They're selling it off bit by but, why wont some believe it until it's completely gone?

@missingdale, do you earn over 80k a year?

Sorry I meant this one, it’s much more in depth
voteforpolicies.org.uk

@1Morewineplease

Try something like this

uk.isidewith.com/political-quiz

Torys will Give me more money in my pay packet. Labour have come out and said they will be raising taxes for everyone

The manifesto's are:
Minimum wage
Tory - Raise the national living wage to £10.50 an hour by 2024 for those over the age of 21

Labour - Introduce a "real living wage" of £10 an hour in 2020 for all workers over the age of 16

Personal tax
Tory - No rises in income tax or National Insurance rates

Labour - Top 5% of earners to pay more income tax – including a new 50% rate on income above £125,000

Not sure where you're getting the info from about labour raising taxes for all. Do you have a source for that?

Although the Tories are promising a higher minimum wage by 2024 it depends on how quickly they reach that goal whether you'll be better off for the duration of this parliament.

The manifesto information above I got from www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50291676

No, square

Let me give another example, which you might find easier to grasp:

A professional footballer earning £100k per week voting Labour, knowing that the party would substantially increase his tax bill to pay for public services that he and his family don’t use (because they pay to go private) would be a turkey voting for Christmas.

If voting for the Tories (or whoever) works for you, then go for it. I associate the term with people who will be directly negatively affected by a political group voting for them. For example, poor or disabled people or those working in the public sector voting for the Tories.

This. I wrote turkeys/Christmas elsewhere, people see the effects of the last 10 years and still think it is all Labours fault. They will moan about the effects of the cuts, but don't seem to make the connection. The rest are just looking forward to the promised lands of Brexit.

I think there is a real lack of knowledge and understanding about politics. They will look at what the local Labour MP is doing (or isn't as the case may be) and decide therefore that it is all Labour's fault, the local council is Labour run therefore it is Labour's fault that the bins are no longer collected weekly. They fail to connect the two, so in their eyes if we get rid of Labour everything will be alright.

(I, may of course, read the room wrong on this.)

I do find it scary though when people are adamant the NHS isnt going anywhere. That is the thinking of turkeys voting for christmas. It can and it will.

Labour are going to raise taxes
Yup, if you earn £82,000 a year they will charge you an extra £8.86 a month
less than Spotify or Netflix

Have you got children, OP? The plan to scrap tuition fees may appeal to you. As a teacher, I’m desperate for a change of government for the sake of our state schools and the pupils from low income at my school. Any increase in tax we have to pay would be worth it to help the public services that we all (apart from the likes of many of the Conservative cabinet) rely upon.

@missingdale, so if you dont earn over 80k a year then Labour isn't going to tax you. They're trying to do what the Tories will NEVER do, get the richer people in the country to pay more. In some cases actually getting them to start paying tax at all

It is the most overused phrase. And ridiculously simplistic.

I totally agree with you OP.

@agelikewine; no that isn’t right.. turkeys voting for Christmas means that those who unwittingly will be very severely negatively affected by one aspect of the thing they’re voting for. Mr footballer has plenty of money and may actually want to share it with those less fortunate.

A professional footballer earning £100k per week voting Labour, knowing that the party would substantially increase his tax bill to pay for public services that he and his family don’t use (because they pay to go private) would be a turkey voting for Christmas.
No that is a person choosing to share their wealth for the benefit of society.

A Turkey voting for Christmas
is a non taxpayer who relies on the NHS voting Tory
because Labour will put up taxes

But Sunderland might just, maybe, possibly, have voted to leave for reasons that had nothing whatsoever to do with cars.

Cross posted with this, but it would fit well with my previous reply.

I also think there are different kinds of “turkeys voting for Christmas”.
Low income people reliant on public services voting Tory, sure.

But some high earners might still vote Labour, despite incurring a higher tax rate- the hit they will take would be less extreme comparatively! Eg someone on 200k will have take home pay of £109,000 instead of the current £117,000. And that extra money will get pumped into public services 🤷‍♀️ which some people on that salary will still rely upon.

This calculator shows what tax you would pay under Labour, as opposed to now.

calculate.forlabour.com/

Age, I know I’m a thicke not earning 80K a year, but I do understand what the phrase means. However, politics is so complex and far reaching it can’t be applied to one set scenario like that.

Maybe the footballer is willing to pay some more taxes because other things are more important to him.

I absolutely hate that saying. Regardless of its meaning, it’s shit.

The tories have done such a grand job over the last 9 years or so, I can’t understand why anyone wouldn’t vote for them!

The hypothetical footballer’s hypothetical altruism is not the point.

He is voting to pay more tax for no benefit to himself or his family. He is voting against his economic self-interest, therefore he is a turkey voting for Christmas. That is what the phrase means!