.... to think my relative may find it hard to be a first-time Mum?

[Plurabelle]

Someone in my family is expecting her first baby in May.

Her husband is very ambitious and work long hours - 50-60 hours a week is the norm and sometimes more. Frequently away from home overnight and there's also an expectation to take part in work-related socialising. (Team bonding weekends away in European cities.)

Her own job is also demanding. Certainly 50 hours a week and very full-on. But term time only.

They have a pleasant flat and are financially fairly secure, though the husband is ambitious for them to get 'on the next level' ie buy their own flat. He is very, very work-focused and just cannot switch off from this - other than when taking holidays/playing sport.

Their lifestyle means that although they have many friends, few of them are local and the ones who are in couples, mostly haven't had children yet.

My relative's mother lives 300 miles away and has major health problems. His parents live a bit closer - but it's 120 miles. A good few hours by car.

Both parents-to-be are excited about the baby. The current plan is for the baby to go in full-time childcare once my relative has finished maternity leave.

My sense is that things are going to be very tough for her, though as her job is demanding, her partner is likely to be absent for much of the time and at present she has no close friends nearby.

Is that 'just how things are now?' - I am an older Mumsnetter. Or would most of you anticipate that things might get quite tricky?

Not only were we both work-focused and working in demanding, high-pressure jobs (and still are) when I was pregnant with DS, I was actually commuting internationally until I was 36 weeks and had antenatal care in both countries, we lived in a tiny London flat with no family in the UK and few local friends, none with children, I didn't gel with NCT group AND when DS was tiny, DH was suddenly made redundant and moved to a job with a lengthy daily commute to another city AND we decided to move closer so that we could actually see one another, and landed in an extremely insular village in a freezing midwinter with a small baby.

And you know what, we managed. It is perfectly possible to manage without 'mum friends' or family support without going crazy. I'd be lying if I said maternity leave was an easy time, and I've never felt tempted to do it again, but it is perfectly possible to be two career-focused people with a baby without the sky falling in.

I think Relative's Husband's partnership means that he is more akin to, say, a commercial lawyer. He'll be tasked to work with a particular organisation for a particular time. And they'll pay very high rates for this. In return they will want total commitment for that period of time - so weekend working, late hours, emails and phonecalls on Sunday. Until the project is finished and then onto the next.

So I suppose on the one hand there are the challenges of teaching. You are there for your class in term time. You have an early start, you have preparation and marking and assessment.

And the challenges of commerce with demanding clients, and business partners who want you to pull your weight.

All alongside the challenges of being a parent.

However brilliant people are at managing, delegating, outsourcing it sounds as if that brilliance will need to be utilised.

OP, you are behaving as though people in these kinds of jobs don't usually have children -- of course they do. Perhaps when you had your children, your life became largely or entirely child-focused, and you only worked within set hours and never at weekends, but that's not the reality for a lot of people. Including DH and me. We wouldn't want it to be.

Both my partner and I were self-employed in the early days. I mainly worked from home, though began to build up hours as time went on - often doing evenings and weekend assignments out of the house as then my partner could take care of our three children. After a few years, I got a part-time job, which again involved evening work, and we found an excellent childminder.

I think the main differences were that neither of us worked quite such long hours as the generation that has come after us. We didn't have long commutes or work abroad. Housing costs were lower.

We did opt to trade a lower standard of living for more time with the children. My partner - not from rich background, despite the way it sound - had been brought up by nannies and was in boarding school from an early age. He really wanted to be a hands-on Dad, and - despite money being tight - his wanting this made life a lot easier for me.

Why are you so invested OP?

2 threads assuming friends are doing it wrong before the baby is even here. Why be like this?

@Plurabelle - you aren't listening to anybody, so let me be a little clearer. They have not asked you for your opinion, so butt the fuck out. Where adjustments need to be made, they will make those adjustments. Stop looking for trouble.

I don’t know that it’s so unreasonable to look at the setup of a relative it sounds as if OP has been involved in supporting in the past and think “gosh that’s different from how it was for me, I wonder how that’s going to work for her?” Assuming it’s a discussion she’s having on MN while thinking to herself about how she can support and remaining positive with the soon-to-be mum, I don’t really see what the problem is. I’m not sure why people assume OP is delighting in her relative’s potential struggles, rather than just privately nervous for her and keen to help.

In the kindest possible way, you need to take your judgements and buzz off. I pray you are not a mother or MIL of the relative

Meh, I have had two babies and to be honest conpared to my usual job it wasn't that hard.

DH and I both have the sort of jobs where we can work long hours/travel and we had our babies on the other side of the world from our families.

We had plenty of money and a tag team approach to parenting.

Not everyone struggles. You just don't actually really hear from the people who are chugging along OK because, well what are they going to say?

Nah, I know people like this and they’re the ones who’ve gone on to have two or three children, whereas the people I’ve thought of as ‘born mothers’ (including myself) have stopped at one and have given up all hobbies whereas the first lot still manage lots of activities on top of their children and jobs.

Remember God gave you two ears and one mouth, so use them in that proportion. Listen out for her anxieties but don't project yours onto her.

For example, I'm on my second breastfed child.
MIL- both times- despite both babies having fat thighs and falling backwards off the boob after a feed with their eyes rolling and milk running down their chins- "Oh it's such a worry isn't it, breastfeeding, because you never know if they're getting enough. (She herself had quit BFing at 6 weeks).

I coslept for ages with the first and will do so with the current one; my mum helpfully kept a bloody Daily Mail newspaper clipping for me about how children who cosleep past 6 months end up apron string clutching socially inept unhappy losers as adults or some shit. (My siblings and I cried it out in cots from a very young age).
They made their own choices according to their own circumstances/necessities/advice available when they had their children- validating their choices for them 40 odd years later was fairly low on my list of priorities.

If she is a babywearing cosleeping breastfeeder, don't start picking at her choices.
If she gets the baby into a routine and a cot, and bottle trained, early, don't start handwringing about it being too regimented.
If she goes back to work quite early don't say "Oh the poor little mite...he's so tiny to be left with complete strangers". If she takes a year off don't say "Oh poor thing he will get so bonded to you it's going to be a terrible shock to him when you go back".
Basically, don't start "worrying on her behalf"- about her, the baby, or her relationship. If she is secure in her choices it's just bloody annoying; if she is a bit anxious about something it'll only make her worse. Either way it's pointless and doesn't bring anything to the party.

Disgruntledguineapig has good advice about nursery places though. That was one thing I didn't know when I had mine- I was shocked how quickly they fill up and lucky someone mentioned it early on.

NCT classes- well, not the be all and end all. I was too knackered after work to go to antenatal classes. Never went to a single one and winged it on the day. It was fine. There are so many baby sensory, baby massage, baby signing, baby rhyme time classes now- every baby extracurricular activity you can think of, every day of the week in every church hall, village centre and hole in the road- that she'll not want for mum-meeting opportunities.

powershower OMG that sounds like my parents! Even when I was breastfeeding my 3rd child, they'd pop round with tins of formula milk because "you can see what they're getting if you feed them that"! They were so worried about my milk not being enough despite their little fat rolled thighs and arms! 😂 Was constantly donating unopened tins of formula to a baby bank who must have thought I was very peculiar!