Are the conservatives really this popular?

[LabourHere]

Listening to statistician on BBC who reckons the conservatives are head in all polls and will win a majority on election day.

I know only two people voting conservative (mil and dm). Who are all the other conservative voters??

Are the conservatives really going to win the election so easily?

If so...I'm very very sad

Labour's stated policy is to raise the Minimum Wage from £8.21 per hour to £10 per hour.

labour.org.uk/press/labours-real-living-wage-will-give-workers-at-least-9000-more-than-the-tories-by-2024/

All raising the minimum wage does is :

1. Put up prices as business have to charge more
2. Makes business go under if they can't raise prices
3. Flatten the wage structure at the bottom end meaning supervisor jobs and pence more than jobs under them
4. Remove mobility as there is no incentive to move jobs to find a better paying one as they all pay minimum wage

It does have it benefits but it also has drawbacks.

I remember life before the minimum wage. And yes, there were some appallingly paid jobs. But if you were n one, you looked around to find one that paid more. If you were any good, you either moved to a better paying employer or got a pay rise from your current employer to keep you.

Now crap workers are paid the same as good workers and there is no incentive to do better.

So Xenia says Cody would be wise to vote Conservative, based on Xenia's fantasy about Labour future policies. That's scaremongering. "Very likely to at some stage" and actual Labour policy, are two different things.

Labour have been salivating over taxing gardens and primary residences for years, especially McDonnell. All that lovely other-people's-money for them to ransack...

Yes Elprup, that's exactly my concern. I don't think anyone minds paying a bit more tax if it's well-spent and goes on services which desperately need it but you can't trust any of them to do what they say they're going to do.

Labour have been salivating over taxing gardens and primary residences this worries me too. On 21K a year I would not be able to afford a garden tax. Still, better than the Tories gross and offensive attitude towards the rising number of poor people in this country.

Still, better than the Tories gross and offensive attitude towards the rising number of poor people in this country.

If Labour get it and institute their Land Value Tax, you’ll be one of those poor people, as will anyone who has a house or garden but no spare cash to pay an arbitrary annual tax just for daring to own such a thing...

I think they are that popular, many people have been persuaded to vote against their best interests. BBC interviewing very poor family in a food bank "and who will you vote for?" ' Well, I like Boris'.

many people have been persuaded to vote against their best interests

So when people vote Conservative it’s because they have succumbed to propaganda, but when people vote Labour, it’s because they are independent thinkers? Nothing to do with the money Labour has promised to firehose at their target demographic? Convincing. Not.

So when people vote Conservative it’s because they have succumbed to propaganda, but when people vote Labour, it’s because they are independent thinkers? Nothing to do with the money Labour has promised to firehose at their target demographic? Convincing. Not.

Precisely.

Houses are sitting ducks. You probably don't think you're rich if you own a 3BR terrace out the outskirts of London, BUT YOU ARE.

If Labour get it and institute their Land Value Tax, you’ll be one of those poor people,

In a safe Labour seat so voting Lib Dem. Precisely because of the LVT and other proposed Labour policies, as well as the fact that I am a remainer. However I would vote Labour to keep the Conservatives out.

Even on 21K and paying a LVT however, I would still be vastly more fortunate than the swathes of people who can’t house or feed themselves, or those who have ended up committing suicide or dying due to draconian changes to the welfare state.

Shocking scaremongering going on here. Land Value tax is one of the possibilities to Replace Council Tax. Council tax is based on the value of the property (at 1991 prices), Land Value tax is based on the value of the land.

There is only one Council Tax band for properties valued above £320,000 (at 1991 house prices) and so the tax stops increasing after this point. Council Tax does not account for the great increase in property prices since 1991.

So Council tax disproportionately charges people in smaller houses/flats.

.
'Labour isn't committing to an extra tax on people's gardens. Its manifesto only promised:

"We will initiate a review into reforming council tax and business rates and consider new options such as a land value tax."

A Land Value Tax is a tax on the potential value of land itself, ignoring anything that's built on it. It isn’t being proposed as an additional tax, but as a potential replacement for council taxes and/or business rates."

fullfact.org/economy/labours-land-value-tax-will-you-have-sell-your-garden/

I think they are that popular, many people have been persuaded to vote against their best interests.

That’s democracy for you.

I know someone who voted UKIP because he had seen ‘proof’ that the UK would end up having to be part of the Eurozone eventually.

I know someone who voted Remain because he had been convinced he wouldn’t be able to go on holiday to Europe if we left the EU.

I know someone who voted Labour in 2017 because all her student loans would be written off.

I know someone who’s voting for Boris because she thinks he’s ‘funny’.

This is what happens when you give everyone the vote. Each person can exercise their vote in whatever way they see fit. What’s the alternative?

A land-value tax of .85% is half of a decent rental yield, i.e. you'd be paying both a mortgage and then half a rental payment, off to McDonnell.

Someone living in completely unremarkable terraced house in London would have to pay something around 8.5K/year under this proposal.

It isn’t being proposed as an additional tax, but as a potential replacement for council taxes and/or business rates.

The point here is that I (for example, I am sure there are many others) can’t afford an increase on the amount that I pay in Council Tax currently. What would happen to is when we can’t pay?

us

@ColourMagic there's no point wheeling out facts, I've found.

I've given up even attempting to convince dyed-in-the wool Tory and Lib Dem voters of anything other than the fact that they're the cleverest, nicest, most forward-thinking, least materialistic people on the planet. Some of them are especially clever for having been born into wealthy backgrounds, or, more often, Hyacinth Bucket nouveau riche circles, or even deprived parts of society where critical thinking isn't taught in school.

My only hope is, that if they DO vote for these parties, they experience the consequences.

PERSONALLY.

In a way that will leave them in no doubt whatsoever of the effects of their votes in the long-term.

Still, that nice Boris chap, wottalaff, eh! Wot's not to like! VOTE BORIS!

Well yes, lots of people vote conservative as really there isn’t much of a choice currently, which is a massive shame. I’m not tied to one party, I just vote foe whoever has the best policies and labours are mental. The Lib Dem’s seem to jump on the most popular bandwagon and I hate the fact that they have received donations related to fracking.

Voting Lib Dem is not the same as voting Conservative .

@cannycat20

Why would I vote for Labour when every single one of their policies make me worse off? All of them.

I would be certifiably insane to vote Labour since it not only makes me worse off but goes against my personal view of personal responsibility.

To re-iterate for those who have not RTFT:
__

Entrprenaurs relief scrapped and all capital gains to be be taxed at marginal rate (currently 20% after the allowance) - no incentive for small businesses to try to grow

Dividends to be taxed at marginal rate (which means after they've been taxed at 26% corporation tax they then get taxed again for the recipient meaning they actually get taxed at 66% or worse)

Corporation tax rising from 19% to 21% and 26% if turnover (note not profit) is over £300,000 - you could make a profit of £1000 and still pay 26% tax

Income tax rising to 50% if you happen to earn over £80K - which is onlu slightly above the MP's salary so they are ok

Married persons allowance scrapped - so a £250 tax rise for the poorest since to qualify you have to be a basic rate tax payer and the spouse has to be earning less than the personal allowance

200% second home tax even if accidentally inheriting or having to move and trying to sell

10% of uk based companies share capital to be "owned" by the government who wil then pay some back to the workers - let watch all international companies remove their head quarters from the UK the day after election

Full employment rights from day one - so no chance to get rid early of people who don't perform - which is going to put companies off actually hiring people in the first place or just using temps.

Collective bargaining to be introduced across all sectors - removes the incentive to work harder for better pay or better negotiation

Maternity leave to be increased and flexible working to become a right - thats women having less chance of decent employment then as I for one would not hire one

Government policy to eradicate gender pay gap - the reason for it is because women IN GENERAL tend not to do the higher paid jobs because they don't like the hours, stress, committment or travel and are more family orientated. Women get paid the same for doing the same jobs.

Keeping sunday restrictions on trading - so we're still stuck in the 19th century

Ending two child cap - so basically reverting to paying people to have children whether they can afford it or not

Finding the magic money tree for WASPI women who if they read the news should have known about the pension changes - not anyone's fault if they didnt educate themselves

REnt controls and open ended contracts for renters - so how do you manage to evict the problem tenant? Pushes the balance too far into the hands of the renter and will actually reduce the supply of reasonably affordable rentals.

A Labour government will repeal the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011, which has stifled democracy and propped up weak governments. - this is hyocritical when they relied on it to STOP a general election for several months

Brexit - another year of uncertainty before we even start on trade deals.

A cautionary tale of horror indeed. Labour would screw the entire economy into the ground for the sake of their socialist ideology.

Sorry - removal of the married persons allowance has no effect on me.

I'm a swing voter, with no allegiance to any particular party. Last time I voted Lib Dem but this time I'm voting Conservative. Labour's economic policies terrify me, I actually think they've made a major mistake on the nationalisation of the rail/open reach policies. Is that really a big vote winner? Their entire manifesto of big giveaways just smacks of economic incompetence and the thought of John McDonnell as chancellor is really scary. The whole Labour front bench give off an air of utter incompetence which is so frustrating as we need a really strong opposition.

My whole family work for the NHS and not one of them is voting for Labour. What they all say is that the NHS does not need more money just throwing at it....it would just be swallowed up in a massive black hole immediately. What they do say is it needs a major overhaul, layers of middle management on big salaries stripping out and an honest conversation about what its future needs to look like.

Someone I know is a die hard Corbyn fan, constantly sharing memes on social media about how gorgeous and wonderful he is and how her family are in poverty and evil Tories must just really hate poor people. This is someone who doesn't work despite being perfectly able to, has two school aged children and lives on benefits as she can get more money that way than being in work. That sort of grabby, entitled attitude really sticks in the throat of people working their butts off and if she would bloody get a job, there'd be more money in the pot! The fact that she feels voting Labour is some morally superior position and voting Conservative makes you a monster is frankly, ridiculous.

For me, the Conservatives are the only credible option at this time, although I can't bear Boris I agree with more of their manifesto than any other parties. I'd just encourage everyone to really look at the policies and decide for themselves which party for them they feel most closely aligned with without resorting to name calling and histrionics.

The fact that she feels voting Labour is some morally superior position and voting Conservative makes you a monster is frankly, ridiculous

Great post, especially the part about your family working for the NHS and recognizing firehosing money at it isn’t going to work because it’s bloated and dysfunctional.

I've a postal vote but have already voted Labour. I'm in a constituency who hasn't a chance of beating the sitting Conservative candidate. This guy reads and replies but never actually changes anything. The labour candidate is a young Oxford graduate but she's Pakistani, and some of the comments about her were along the lines of ye 'let a Pakistani gain control of the overseas budget etc.'

I'm also a swing voter but the only party I could support this year had to be labour.