To be horrified at the abuse towards Green Party candidate who said he wanted to ban halal (non stunned) slaughter?

[FreshFreesias]

To be horrified at the backlash against Green Party candidate who said he wanted to ban halal (non stunned) slaughter?

Jonathan Bartley of the Green Party, was asked in an interview what he thought about halal slaughtering methods (where animals are often not stunned so are fully conscious when slaughtered). Quite reasonably, considering the party is meant to be pro animal welfare and that he is Vegan, he said personally he’d like to ban it.
There was a big outcry and calls for him to resign for Islamophobia. However he was asked about halal not kosher (which also requires animals not to be stunned prior to slaughter) and no doubt he would have decried any slaughter that requires animals to be slaughtered without stunning, whether it was kosher or halal.

This is a bit like campaigning against bull-fighting and being accused of racism against Spanish people.

Worst of all, when he was criticised, he back-tracked and explained that the Green Party supported kosher and halal slaughtering methods, so a bit of a 360 degree turnaround. Other Green Party apparatchiks then came aboard to grovel and apologise on his behalf.

I remember when the Green Party supported animal welfare and to find them going against recommendations from Compassion in World Farming and the RSPCA, who insist that stunning animals before slaughter takes away some of the pain from this unconscionable process, is very depressing.

Slaughterhouses are already so poorly regulated that to deny animals some relief by rendering them unconscious before they are killed is surely a terrible abomination. I do wish to respect all religions but I am disappointed that animal welfare is being so disrespected.

The reason people are calling out the OP is because the vast majority of halal meat in the UK is pre stunned and the only difference between the halal and non halal slaughter is a prayer being said (or probably a prayer recording playing) whilst the slaughter takes place.

@Birthdaycakemondays The OP doesn’t even know what halal is (neither do you it seems) and thinks a world renowned researcher is a random public body. OP chose not to mention kosher despite it requiring no stunning, OP also chose to ignore standard british stunning which is the same in halal and even claimed a “special” type of stunning happened in halal. Someone who was actually against all slaughter would at least know what slaughter entails.

@SimonJT, halal and kosher slaughter is surely the same. I am not separating the two.

Shame on you for making this a religious issue when it is an animal welfare issue.

The Green Party candidate was only asked about halal slaughter. I have no idea why he wasn't asked about kosher.

It really isn’t difficult.

Halal is the same as standard british slaughter, stun then slit throat. Or with chickens stun then behead.

Kosher does not use any stunning.

How can you be anti something you clearly know nothing about?!

Fresh Freesias
Given that the majority of halal meat is prestunned why have you singled it out.

Someone who was actually against all slaughter would at least know what slaughter entails.

Why would they? If you find something horrifying you’re not going to go searching on the internet for the nitty gritty details are you?

When I go to my local supermarket I always see a ‘halal’ section, I’ve never seen a ‘Kosha’ section. I agree with neither, irregardless of the sodding religion - totally irrelevant.

Shame on you for making this a religious issue when it is an animal welfare issue.

^^ 👍🏼

@FreshFreesias so you are discussing chicken slaughter as opposed to how animals are slaughtered generally? Larger animals being stunned using captive bolt systems usually?

Not knowing what something entails but disagreeing with it is pure ignorance.

I support the RSPCA view that animals that are to be slaughtered should be first stunned
If a prayer is then said afterwards, that would not affect the animal in the slightest

imo, we should ban slitting the throat of unstunned animals

That would affect about 20% of Halal meat and all Kosher meat
but religion is no excuse for making an animal's death more painful than need be

Fear you’re going to banging your head again a brick wall here @FreshFreesias. Clearly you are a massive racist

@simonJT

You are being deliberately obtuse.

I am not singling out Halal slaughter, I have mentioned Kosher slaughter methods in many posts.

Again, as you keep missing it, I will requote:

Chickens slaughtered for Halal meat are not being stunned effectively.
Instead of being rendered instantly unconscious when stunned, they will be receiving a painful electric shock that immobilises them before being slaughtered whilst fully conscious.
Chickens are immobilised, meaning they are unable to move, but still aware of what is happening to them and are able to feel pain, when their throat is cut.

www.ciwf.org.uk/contact-us/faqs-halal-chicken-slaughter/

There is no need to dismiss the public's, Compassion in World Farming and the RSPCA's genuine concern over standards in British slaughterhouses quite so tritely.

You do realise that it’s the same for all non-kosher birds right?

Birthdaycake

If fact is a brick wall so be it. The fact is that most halal meat in this country is prestunned and slaughter in the same way as non halal apart from the prayer.

By all means object to animal slaughter but object to all slaughter done the same way not just that linked to a specific religion.

Getting back to the OP:

No, the Green politician shouldn't have wimped out on his beliefs re animal cruelty

I'm sorry you degrade legitimate concern about slaughterhouse methods as `ignorant frothing'.

No. I degrade illegitimate concerns, as evidenced by your dismissal of the world leader in the field as an 'obscure religious paper', as ignorant frothing.

@SimonJT so going on best case scenario (from this thread) 20% of animals slaughtered are not stunned when halal & 100% are not stunned when kosher.

I know enough to decide that is not humane, & that if you’re going to kill animals to eat at least make the death as quick/painless as possible.

It’s not hard to understand is it, really?

"most halal meat in this country is prestunned"

It is the other 20%, plus 100% of kosher meat that is concerning

Clearly is for OP!

I think simonJT has been absolutely spot on with 100% of what he has said actually.

He is right.

If you do not have a decent understanding of something it is not right to be actively against it.
It is ignorant.
Educate yourself then ask yourself what your view is.

Also, re the chicken stunning.
Um, you do realise that pre stunning is missing a lot of chickens in all slaughterhouses...?

The CIWF is concerned about British slaughterhouses
Not British halal, but British, overall.
The standards in all British slaughterhouses are poor.
The stunning method that is performing badly in halal slaughterhouses is the exact same stunning method that is performing badly in non halal slaughterhouses!

@Birthdaycakemondays
I think I've got the entire British Meat Marketing Board on the rampage tonight, lol.

If I said the moon comes out at night they'd want a fight about that.

It's hopeless trying to reason with these people.

YANBU. Halal is a cruel vile practise and should be banned

Shame on you for making this a religious issue when it is an animal welfare issue.

It'll be a religious issue for the people who can't practice their religion if your rules come in.

No doubt if asked about kosher he would have said the same thing.

Except it's never about Kosher is it? The people who get exercised by this are always bothered by Halal meat for some reason.

The reason people are calling out the OP is because the vast majority of halal meat in the UK is pre stunned

This. The animal's welfare is not impacted once it's unconscious. It's going to die either way (though I believe there is a specific issue with bird stunning in general).

and the only difference between the halal and non halal slaughter is a prayer being said (or probably a prayer recording playing) whilst the slaughter takes place.

Yeah, but that prayer is in foreign and the people who eat Halal look different, so it must be bad.

The fact is that most halal meat in this country is prestunned and slaughter in the same way as non halal apart from the prayer.

Most - not all. That is what I object to. Because 20% might just be a number to you, but to me it is 1000s of animals that were the ‘unlucky’ ones - tough luck mate, you don’t get the decency of not knowing or feeling pain because of a religion. Doesn’t matter if it’s 1%. Principle is the same.

Sherbertx
You want to ban pre stunned halal slaughter too?

YANBU. Halal is a cruel vile practise and should be banned

@Sherbertx. How is it worse than normal slaughter? How is it worse than Kosher slaughter?