To ask how you can live with yourself if you use Amazon

[paperbeatsrock]

Just kidding! All those political threads asking how people can possibly vote for X or Y must be getting to me.

I use Amazon. (While I’m frequently ordering from a vendor rather than Amazon themselves, Bezos still gets his cut.) Yet, the more I read about them, the more I realise I’m part of the problem. So I guess my question is, do you have stern words with yourself for using them, but keep doing it anyway?

Yes, totally.
I don't buy physical things from Amazon if I can possibly find them elsewhere. Even if it's more expensive elsewhere, if I can physically find it locally, I will buy locally.

I never buy books from there anymore - or toys. Our local independent bookshop will order any book in for you, so I do that now, and view the extra cost as a contribution to my local high street.

But I do have a Kindle, and music subscriptions. And I use audible for audio books. So I remain part of the problem, and I do feel conflicted about it.

I live in the sticks so using Amazon means not having to get in the car and drive 15/20 miles to a decent town. I do try to avoid loads of individual orders and save it all for one.

Last weekend when in a town I thought let's support the High St and went to Waterstones. I queued for ages only to be sent to another counter only to queue for ages again then discover they didn't have the book. Went to another branch of Waterstones a couple of days later to be met with huge queues and no member of staff to point me to the right area (slightly odd book that could be in a number of places). I gave up, left the shop and will be ordering from Amazon.

I don't agree that Amazon are that shitty towards their employees, a few disgruntled one mean nothing, especially at such a large scale

There's no such thing as a truly ethical company, it's all a big marketing selling point. Calling yourself "ethical" only gives you a reason to put your price up, it all comes from the same factories unless you buy truly local - and where do they get their own supply from anyway?

And I agree with above , I haven't found any decent competitor to order gifts going to other countries either.

The only thing that will put me off Amazon is shoddy sellers and them becoming too cocky and putting their prices too high, then I go somewhere else.

Primark is also pretty poor ethically

None of the main clothing retailers are any better. They just have a bigger mark up for the same items.

The chances are very high that if I ordered it on Amazon, I'm highly unlikely to find it in town, and probably never could have done.

There needs to be a global approach to closing up tax loop holes and making multinationals pay a fair share, particularly if they have profits exceeding the GDP of a small country. It's not just an Amazon problem and it's not just a UK problem.

It's not as simple as Amazon is bad. Small independent businesses get a larger market through it even if conditions aren't the greatest.

The High St is hardly the epitome of good employer standards either. 20 years ago working in a chain store, we were on less than the headline minimum wage we were supposedly paid by the time our sub-minimum breaks and unpaid obligatory overtime to clean the shop for 30 minutes every day were taken into account.

I do love Amazon. Christmas shopping and the returns are so easy! I've tried shopping at stores. But had shocking problems and had to wait for more stock to be reordered in. 5 days later and extra parking fees I finally got what I wanted. Amazon rules.

What a great thread. I work in retail and can I just say a lot of shops have gone under because of Amazon, Mothercare for instance to name one... Amazon's turnover was £50billion+ this year and paid no corporation tax. Yes they give jobs to people and those people have a choice. But if you make billions of pounds, pay them a living wage and make sure they are safe. We get cheap goods because they don't pay their way, simple. They are using our infrastructure, so giving jobs don't exempt you from paying towards the upkeep of this. Also, after my babies were born ( both c sections) I used Amazon until I could drive again, but now that I can support local and smaller businesses, I absolutely do. Every time. I also understand convenience factor for some families and don't judge. One day when we can only shop from Amazon and eBay because all other retailers gave gone bust, don't cry over having no choices.

I have cut down. I have chosen John Lewis and Waterstones as two retailers who I want to survive, so as long as they have what I want and it isn't too much more expensive I've been ordering from them and using click and collect where possible.

It's not feasible for everything, but I'm happy to spend my money to support things I value.

I use amazon all of the time because it is easy for me and decent value. I don’t give a stuff about their business approach, or any of the ethical discussions.

They are a business. They are selling the things I want at a good price. If other businesses cannot compete then that is their failing. I’m certainly not losing any sleep over it.

“Shipping is not free or next day if you don't have Prime.”

It often is, not both mind, but it usually is free delivery or paid for next day delivery.

It’s the delivery charges that make things more expensive elsewhere... which is a bit swings and roundabouts if you’re buying one thing, but if you want 6 different things from 6 different websites and they only do free delivery over certain amounts, it adds up.

So yeah, it’s not strictly speaking true that it’s a choice between amazon and going to physical shops, but when you’re looking at £5 delivery from each other website, even when the actual item is cheaper, it’s often cheaper to use amazon.

I treat Amazon as a shop of last resort. I don't like them because of tax dodging, bad working conditions, and just being a megacorp. I'll buy from Amazon if it's the only trustworthy option or it's significantly cheaper than the competition.

When I buy on Amazon, I do prefer to buy from Amazon. I don't like the "marketplace" thing and find Amazon the website makes it annoying to see and filter who you're actually buying from. If I wanted to buy from a seller I've never heard of I'd go on eBay.

The lockers are good if I don't want to wait for a delivery.

People are always going to do what's cheap/convenient to them. People tend to be time-poor these days and don't want to spend their limited time-off traipsing around the shops.

I went to my local "big town" on Saturday. It was a 45 minute drive both ways, the customer service I received was pretty appalling everywhere, it cost me money to park, and two of the shops didn't have what I came to buy in the first place.

I could have ordered what I did online and saved myself 90 minutes of driving/fuel, parking costs and got what I was after in about 10% of the time! I like the idea of going shopping "in town" but always regret it!

I don't agree that Amazon are that shitty towards their employees, a few disgruntled one mean nothing, especially at such a large scale

It's not a few though. It's basically every employee. It's been in the news a LOT recently. They treat their employees awfully. Google it.

Not everyone can afford to be ethical when it comes to shopping, though

No, but many can. I'd argue most on here could afford to pay £2.50 more for delivery from a smaller business that pays its employees more (which is basically every other business), but they don't care enough to do so. That's their decision, and I'm not even trying to argue that. I'm just saying let's not pretend we all HAVE to buy from Amazon and have no other choice. We do. We choose convenience and a small saving because that's what we care most about that. We should at least just admit it.

I’d rather use Amazon than drive to some grim, packed, out of town shopping centre. For hand made stuff I still try and shop locally though, as small businesses need my support more than Tesco etc do.

I have prime - for that I get TV along with movies, books, magazines and music to rent out as well as free next day delivery.

Amazon are giving customers what they need. A quick service, a large selection, easy ordering and reasonable prices (yes, not necessarily cheapest). Other businesses need to do the same if they want to compete and so does the high street. Not everyone can afford to look at what might be ethical and employees aren’t slaves. If they don’t like their job they can move on.

I’m happy to shop in other places and I do so but budget and convenience does win out because I have no choice. If I were rich - both in money and time - I likely would have the option to shop around more thoroughly. If other businesses want me to purchase from them they have to offer the same kind of service.

Used to all the time, now much less often unless it's a well known brand I am buying. Find a lot of stuff comes from China now and is poor quality. Don't bother due to that.

You choose to support Amazon because it's more convenient. That's your decision

I choose to support and use them because they are better at what they do than anyone else in most areas. I support businesses that offer, not the lowest prices but value for money, and great service. It's not convenience, it's just common sense and practical not to be throwing good money after bad with a company which makes it more difficult and more expensive to be a customer.

Like with Aldi, I don't just go in there because it's excellent value for money, but because I like their products and the shopping experience is so much better than in Sainsbury's which is my other nearest supermarket.

I’d rather use Amazon than drive to some grim, packed, out of town shopping centre

There are other websites!!!

And I'm guessing most people who are struggling to pay for shipping are paying £75 a year or however much it is for Prime membership

We pay montly - but we worked out it was less than 12 months of delivery charges plus when we started -before amazon TV got interesting content- we often needed things quickly (mainly for primary school ) and at time we got next day delivery - that's not as good now.

PP who said there are other sites - I know and where cheaper or only option we use them. I also buy second hand books - including some of the aformention revision guides -through amazon where it's cheaper including delivery charges than getting new and free delivery with amazon.

It's also cheaper for us to buy for family in rest of UK and get amazon to deliver than to buy in shops and pay via royal mail.

I choose to support and use them because they are better at what they do than anyone else in most areas. I support businesses that offer, not the lowest prices but value for money, and great service. It's not convenience, it's just common sense and practical not to be throwing good money after bad with a company which makes it more difficult and more expensive to be a customer

Right. That's the choice you made. To you, it's more important to save 3 minutes and 3 quid per purchase than to support businesses who pay their employees a living wage, allow bathroom breaks, don't regularly work their employees so hard they require an ambulance, etc.

Like I said above, I'm not trying to change your mind on that. I'm just saying that's the reality of the situation and it is for many people.

At least this person owns it:

I don’t give a stuff about their business approach, or any of the ethical discussions. I’m certainly not losing any sleep over it

I use Amazon as the nearest town is a 24 mile drive away to get something that may not be in stock.It also helps reduce impulse buys for things I don't really need.

I'm just saying let's not pretend we all HAVE to buy from Amazon and have no other choice. We do. We choose convenience and a small saving because that's what we care most about that. We should at least just admit it.

Who's arguing that? Everyone I can see on here is saying they choose Amazon due to a mixture of convenience and price.

I'd rather spend ten minutes of my day off shopping than 2+ hours. I know if I order off Amazon I get free returns, prompt delivery, refunds on faulty items and free delivery to my workplace, which means if I'm on a day off, I know my items will get signed for and stored safely. That means I don't need to waste more time waiting in for a delivery that apparently needs a signature even though it can quite easily fit through the letterbox!

I don't know any other website that offers that kind of service for such a small charge. I can pay £79/year and get unlimited free delivery on anything I want, from dog treats, to vacuum cleaners, to clothes, to perfume, to books. I also get Prime Video, Music and Kindle books chucked in for free.

I'd argue most on here could afford to pay £2.50 more for delivery from a smaller business that pays its employees more (which is basically every other business), but they don't care enough to do so.

Amazon pay employees a minimum of £9.50 an hour. Minimum wage is about £7.80, and loads of retailers only pay that.

If you are going to worry about being an ethical consumer, at least take the time to get your facts right.

Those of you saying "there are other websites" but amazon just offer so much ease.

Delivery is usually free or cheaper. They require no minimum spend, faster delivery and a range of brands.

Some shops thy offer online retailing just can't beat that.

There are other websites!!!

So you keep saying. But it's still easier to go on one website, order five items and pay than it is to go around several different websites, pay several lots of delivery and have to wait in for several different couriers.