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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To not understand how this is cultural appropriation?

837 replies

NewUsername18382828 · 25/11/2019 17:39

Namechanged for this.
DH and I decided to give DD (who is now 6) a name which is originally from another country. Neither of us have relatives or any connection there, we just liked the name. There is an English variant of the name but we didn't like the sound of it as much so went with the one we liked most. Didn't think it would be a problem, a name is a name.

Well anyway, a mum of a girl in DD's class at school was born in that country. She heard me call DD at the gates and started talking to me about her name. She was asking what our ties were to the country, and so on. When I said there weren't any and we just liked the name, she muttered something about cultural appropriation and left with her child. Fast forward another couple of weeks and I've just been informed by another parent that she's been badmouthing us, saying we shouldn't use a foreign name when we have no ties to the country, it's cultural appropriation.

AIBU to have no clue how this is cultural appropriation? I always thought a name was just a name.

OP posts:
LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 26/11/2019 19:18

You are calling your child a name that you love. No insult, piss take or slight intended (unless you are particularly perverse).

Staffy1 · 26/11/2019 19:27

If a person from Pakistan told me he didn’t mind being called a Paki, I still wouldn’t do it.

This is not comparable at all. Everyone knows that term is meant offensively, whereas I think finding offence in this issue and some of the other things mentioned, (hairstyles, etc) is just going out of ones way to find offence in things that people haven't a clue cause offence and the thought of it offending someone never entered their head.

MadameButterface · 26/11/2019 19:45

Yeah but the point is that once the potential to cause offence has been pointed out, the correct thing is to not do the thing or stop doing it, not bluster on about political correctness gone mad and melting pots and where do you draw the line and should we all just be called saxon names and but i would be flattered if someone did x to me and NOT ALL WHITE PEOPLE etc etc

Staffy1 · 26/11/2019 19:57

But who is doing the pointing out, because it seems to be people who it doesn't affect that are just looking to be offended on other people's behalf. I wonder how many people it really causes offence to. I do think a lot of this is started by supposed liberals and it's only affect is to cause division. If you keep the mentality of "dominant" or "oppressed" cultures, how will things change? I think it is patronising to non-whites to think it's ok for non-whites to borrow things from white culture, but not ok for whites to do so from non-white culture.

merrymouse · 26/11/2019 20:03

Yeah but the point is that once the potential to cause offence has been pointed out, the correct thing is to not do the thing or stop doing it

So in the example given in the OP, she should change her child's name??

Footiefan2019 · 26/11/2019 20:20

So the minute someone says they find something offensive, everyone has to stop doing it ? What?

merrymouse · 26/11/2019 20:21

Agree it's cringe to call your child a name from a completely different culture for no reason.

What is a completely different culture though? Some people on this thread seem to be putting very tight boxes around culture and nationality, and I think that is dangerous.

Many people don't fit neatly into any cultural box.

MaButterface · 26/11/2019 20:21

What is wrong with cultural appropriation anyway? I lived in a foreign country half my life and people there would feel honoured if a white person dresses like them or names their kids their local name. The world has gone mad.

Notsurehowtofixit · 26/11/2019 20:22

Honoured Grin

merrymouse · 26/11/2019 20:28

Calling your child Cariad does seem weird. A Welsh (but not Welsh speaking) friend called her daughter this.

Many English speaking Welsh people use Welsh words and phrases.

It's no more strange than calling a child River or Apple.

BetweenTheMoon · 26/11/2019 20:36

Exactly what @bridgetreilly.

Like racism, it's about where the power is. So without knowing the name no one can say whether it is or isn't. If it does fit @bridgetreilly's description it is.

Saying CA doesn't exist or isn't a thing is utterly bat shit to me and incredible rude to those who are being appropriated.

BertrandRussell · 26/11/2019 20:41

“It's no more strange than calling a child River or Apple”

Well- as I said earlier, Cariad Lloyd says that Welsh people she has met so find it strange...

Jiggles101 · 26/11/2019 20:44

merrymouse - say Korean or Japanese. If I called my white child Seunghyun or Hikaru you honestly don't think that would be odd?

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 26/11/2019 20:46

People call their kids all sorts these days. I blame Game of Thrones for a fair old chunk of that.

Jiggles101 · 26/11/2019 20:48

I'm pretty sure the babynames board on here would give their approval anyway!

Jiggles101 · 26/11/2019 20:49

Wouldn't obviously

momoney1 · 26/11/2019 20:55

Op should be banned from Mumsnet for not telling us the name Sad

Snoozysnoozy · 26/11/2019 21:00

Well- as I said earlier, Cariad Lloyd says that Welsh people she has met so find it strange...

So?

merrymouse · 26/11/2019 21:01

merrymouse - say Korean or Japanese. If I called my white child Seunghyun or Hikaru you honestly don't think that would be odd?

Why would I look at your child and assume I could tell whether they had any links to Korea or Japan because of their skin colour? Why would I assume that you had no links to Japan?

I can understand why cultural appropriation is a problem, but I also think sometimes people just really like a name. I don't think an English person calling the most important person in their life Rhiannon is the same as reducing an entire culture to a stereotype by treating their culture as fancy dress.

BercowsFestiveFlamingo · 26/11/2019 21:11

I've read the full thread hoping to see what the name is and am now disappointed.

My name is of Cornish/French origin.
DD1 has a French name
DD2 Irish
DS Irish
Mum's name is French
Dad's if need to check but probably very English.

When dd2 was born exH's friend went nuts about us using an Irish name when we aren't Irish. I do have Irish heritage from my Grandad's side though.

Can any culture really claim a name as theirs?

Cyberworrier · 26/11/2019 21:32

It depends whether or not you are appropriating something from an oppressed group. someone said this wayyy earlier and I think it sums it up.

@Staffy1, If you keep the mentality of "dominant" or "oppressed" cultures, how will things change?
The thing is, it’s not a ‘mentality’. It’s reality. Pretending racism doesn’t happen won’t fix the problem- and it really shouldn’t be up to oppressed groups to change their mindsets- that is all of society’s responsibility.

We have a PM comparing Muslim women to letterboxes and simultaneously parading his Turkish grandfather as his get out of jail free card against racism/ Islamaphobia. For some reason, that kind of sums up the cultural insensitivity we’ve seen on this thread for me.. Not sure why.

And FFS, Ancient Rome and Greece were basis of European culture, as were the Romance languages, the enlightenment etc- not a big surprise to anyone that Greek/French names popular (usually in long since anglicised versions). So don’t sweat it, all you Sophie’s. No one thinks you are CA. Your cultural heritage as a citizen of anywhere gives a connection to such cradles of civilisation (Old Testament names too). Apologies for the Eurocentric slant of my rant but we are in the UK and aiming this at all the people thinking having a French or Greek name is what us PC brigade have our knickers in a twist about.

MikeUniformMike · 26/11/2019 21:44

@Snoozysnoozy, to a Welsh person, her name is " Lloyd's Girlfriend".

Go to google translate and translate Lloyd's girfriend to welsh if you don't believe me.

Calling someone Cariad, is like calling them Darling or Love or Sweetheart.

Would you name your child Darling? Sweetheart?

Snoozysnoozy · 26/11/2019 21:58

Calling someone Cariad, is like calling them Darling or Love or Sweetheart.

So is it ok that I find Cherish Finden's name odd? Or would that make me racist?
Or can I accuse her parents of cultural appropriation?

merrymouse · 26/11/2019 22:06

And FFS, Ancient Rome and Greece were basis of European culture, as were the Romance languages, the enlightenment etc- not a big surprise to anyone that Greek/French names popular (usually in long since anglicised versions).

I don't think the people who were invaded by Romans and Normans saw it that way.

We have a PM comparing Muslim women to letterboxes and simultaneously parading his Turkish grandfather as his get out of jail free card against racism/ Islamaphobia. For some reason, that kind of sums up the cultural insensitivity we’ve seen on this thread for me.. Not sure why.

I don't think you can compare somebody naming their child to Boris Johnson dashing off a newspaper column.

hoxtonbabe · 26/11/2019 22:09

@Staffy1

I’m curious, what do non whites borrow from white culture?