To have said this to SIL re checking her DD's phone?

[weymouthswanderingmermaid]

My niece started year 7 this year. She's settled well, and is generally a well adjusted, well behaved sensible child. My DC's are younger and not quite at the smartphone / social media stage yet.
DN got her first phone when she started secondary school. Me and SIL we're chatting about DN yesterday, and SIL told her about several WhatsApp groups my DN is now on. Friends chatting and making social arrangements, and the like. I asked SIL if she was checking them / her phone is general, and she was horrified and said no of course not, she doesn't know her password anyway. I said that to would be sensible to check it every now and again, and to let DN that she would be doing so. To me, 11 is so young to have private access to WhatsApp and social media, and it's a parents duty to monitor it to keep the child safe and check for issues like bullying.
I explained that what I was saying was what i understood the general advice to be for parents, not just me being a snoop. I honestly did not say any of this in a judgemental holier than thou way, I was trying to be factual but helpful, iyswim?

But, SIL has not taken it well. She's seen it as both a slight against DN who "can't be trusted", and against her parenting, as I suggested she wasn't doing it right! SIL is a lovely, sensible woman and great mother. I really didn't expect that reaction

I always reserved the right to look at them but I never did. I respected their privacy but they knew that I could do if I felt the need.

@Rubyroost you're ok laughing at me but my sister is the pastoral care lead in a secondary school. The kids out the loop who don't have phones are targeted they also feel incredibly sad when their friends are talking about plans etc they've arranged on their phones.
Times change. My friends used to talk to me on MSN or the landline. Not many people have landlines anymore. All my friends lived in the same village. My DD and DSD have Friends in several villages.

@churchandstate and when your child is the victim of bullies, because kids are vile at times, you'll know you caused it. No child wants to text their friends mums phone.
My DD had been advising her friend who lives with a single dad about starting her period. No way would her friend have text my phone. Those issues are personal and private.
Same as I wouldn't have known DSD's friend was
Self harming. I informed the school and she got some help and support. As long as you monitor things well it's fine.
The kids send messages to me to let me know they get places ok, they use them to check bus times, let me know if they are running late, if they're feeling unwell. Can talk to me when they are at their mums or their dads. All these things they couldn't do without their phones.

My daughter is 17 - I checked it up until she was around 16 mainly as there was so much going around - nudes, bullying etc. She seemed fine and obviously I don't check now.

Of course, because a 16 year could be groomed/manipulated/coerced but not once they reach 17...

That's the thing - at what point do you stop? Is 18 safer than 17? They might be a legal adult but they are they any safer the day after their birthday than they were the day before?

Greggers2017

We all weigh up the risks of parenting decisions every day. If I said to you that when your child accesses a dark web suicide site behind your back, that will be your fault, would that be true? Probably. But you did the best you could, would be your defence. And it will also be mine.

@Rubyroost - then I do hope your child has friends with similar minded parents. DD was left out significantly and it caused a year of tears, anxiety, lost friends, no plans outside school as she just wasn't invited anymore.

She luckily found new friends in secondary but you know what, the one who doesn't have a phone really struggles as none of them wants to text her mum's phone. So all plans are made in school but it is hard to organise anything spontaneous. They do try but the girl is left out a lot.

It may not what I would have liked but unfortunately that's today's reality. You can't compare a pre-teen today with your or my childhood where we blocked the landlines for hours or just walked over to see a friend.

But you can have a family phone, reluctantbrit. A phone that an 11 year old can give out as their number but that doesn’t stay on their person or in their possession and could as easily be given to a 12 year old to call home. You don’t have to go all or nothing.

It is hard and no one is getting this right. We are all just doing our best.

What works for one won’t another, and this is half the issue

I check DDs (Y8) phone and she knows it. We have had several messages from her school asking us to keep an eye on their messages, social media etc as various things crop up and school has to then get involved.

@reluctantbrit horses for courses. If my child has friends that want to include him then they will regardless of phones. Jesus wept, all kids must have mobiles when they're 11 now. 🙄

@churchandstate that's where parental controls and apps such as family link come in. I've got very tight restrictions on their internet. I do on the home computer too. I also restrict how much time they have online, especially on school nights. Phones get removed at bed time too. This is because my son would stay on his all night long watching YouTube if I let him 🙄 though I don't know what's interesting about watching somebody play minecraft

@Rubyroost it doesn't work like that. What if his mates organise on a Friday evening to go shopping or the cinema in the Saturday? They won't ring your home to ask him. He'll be left out. It's horrible but it's how society works nowadays.

Greggers2017

That’s how you choose to play it. It doesn’t mean that’s what everybody has to do.

@Greggars then they're not his friends are they and they can't really want him there. Seriously kudt because people choose different ways to bring their kids up it doesn't mean you have to go on and on. My child won't be getting a phone at that age. It's simple! And at 11 I can't see him going out to the cinema with his mates

@rubyroost - DD had a phone because she also spends 2 days a months at the riding stable, goes alone to school and back home, goes to classes where parking is impossible so we let her go around the corner and she walks the rest. That was all in year 6 already.

It is more about using Social Media, it is the tool to enable them to be independent.

That's up to you @reluctantbrit, but I repeat my child will not be having one and no amount of trying to tell me about the advantages if phones and social media will make me change my mind

I’d be quite happy letting mine have an old Nokia type, text and calling for secondary. Still let’s us stay in contact sort out pick ups etc.
It’s the internet enabled that worries me, but i also don’t want them to miss out socially.
Really difficult.

@Rubyroost what are you going to do about homework? Most schools use apps for homework, so they get added to the app (even during holidays teachers will log in and add stuff). Some lessons they even get told to bring their phones for research.

SaveKevin

I can answer that from my side: I will do everything I can to avoid sending my child to a school that makes the use of a smartphone an essential for the education of an 11 year old.

It’s every secondary school round here.

I truly dislike this need for constantly internet connectivity with up to date systems. Mine missed out on flu jabs this year as they would only accept online parent authority and it wouldn’t work on my ages laptop. The OAPs round here struggled to get new bus passes or up to date info they need as it’s all done online. It’s a big on going cost that’s suddenly an essential now.

DC know that there have no right to expect privacy on their phones.

But they are mostly given it.

If you're checking all the time and there is something they dont want you to find they will hide it. Its really not hard at all to hide it, work round filters etc.

As the policewoman who was in charge of media and online child safety said when she came to my ds's school, "it's imperative a parent remains vigilant in regards to their child's online and phone safety". There were children as young as 7 sending nude pics at one school she got called into. So yes. Parents must check.

@SaveKevin 🙄 homework, whatever next?! This is bushit and would be seen as discriminatory and a perfect for my child not to do the shite homework that teachers set because they have to, not because it means anything. 👍
To be honest I think there's more pressure to get a kid a phone at 11 years old from mumsnetters than there is peer group. I REPEAT t doesn't matter aht crap you come up with my child will not have a phone at 11.