Rees Mogg uses common sense to flee burning building.

[longwayoff]

Or, he would, if he were to find himself in that situation. Having previously insulted the medical knowledge and expertise of a leading neurologist, he now advises ignoring fire service advice, saying those who died in Grenfell lacked common sense and should have left the building. AIBU to say this man's ignorance is an embarrassment and he is unfit for public service?

I remember on a live broadcast a guy said “this is a war on the poor”, the broadcast was never shown again, but might be available on YouTube.
It seems another snipe at the uneducated poor. It does seem to be a poor war going on, but it isn’t covered by the media.

Who the fuck votes for him? That’s what gob smacks me!!

There must be hordes of people who would vote for a shit covered sofa cushion if it was the Tory candidate!
Unthinking twats!

Awful man and so damaging for the conservatives.

'the more one's read over the weekend about the report and about the chances of people surviving....' has been conveniently left out of the reports of his comments. ie. he was referring to the evidence that the wrong advice was given, against the 'common sense' or instinctive action to leave the building.

He first said:

And I think if either of us were in a fire, whatever the fire brigade said, we would leave the burning building. It just seems the common sense thing to do.

He clearly thinks he can predict how both he and the presenter would act if they were trapped in a burning tower block, and certainly gives the impression to Andrew Bridgen that:

"What he's actually saying is that he would have given a better decision than the authority figures who gave that advice."

He then attempts to back track.

"What I meant to say is that I would have also listened to the fire brigade's advice to stay and wait at the time. However, with what we know now and with hindsight I wouldn't and I don't think anyone else would."

However, as a comment that makes no sense. Of course everyone would have left the building as early as possible with the benefit of hind sight.

Again, if the common sense course of action is to disobey the instructions of the London Fire Brigade, please could JRM explain what Boris Johnson was doing as Mayor of London for 8 years and why Eric Pickles said that the recommendations of the Lakanal House fire report were over the top?

I think it's really important that the Conservatives clarify their policy, because at the moment it seems to be 'you're on your own'.

Bridgen has now apologised for his fatuous witterings. Rees Mogg has a majority of 10,000+. He can't employ them all, surely? What on earth are they thinking of?

Oh God, Bridgen!

An awful thing to say words fail me

He has apparently apologized

Unfortunately won’t impact his career or the party share of votes

At the end of the day, he's right though. Most of the people who survived Grenfell got themselves out against the advice of the fire service and without fire service help. They either made their own decision to evacuate, or told to by friends/relatives (either by phone or neighbours banging on their doors).

He's a thundercunt of the highest order. HTH.

At the end of the day, he's right though. Most of the people who survived Grenfell got themselves out against the advice of the fire service and without fire service help.

But that is the equivalent of the manager of a hospital saying after a listeria outbreak "The common sense thing is not to eat the food - I wouldn't".

The emergency services are the responsibility of the government and the local authority

He's a thundercunt of the highest order. HTH

Let’s Blame the firefighters for giving the correct advice for any normal towerblock fire, for not being psychic and realising this one was different

They didn't need to by psychic. They could see that it wasn't a normal towerblock fire over an hour before they scrapped the "stay put" policy - when the flames had gone from the third floor all the way to the top by around 1.30. The "stay put" policy should have been changed at that time when it was blatantly obvious the building would be lost. (Even at the inquest, fire officers admitted they knew they couldn't put it out at that stage!, yet couldn't explain why the "stay put" policy was still in place!).

He started by saying it was a tragedy caused by the cladding and compounded by the stay put advice from the fire brigade. It sounded to me that he was saying the fire brigade gave advice that was lacking in common sense and also that as white middle/upper class males himself and Nick Ferrari would be less likely to follow advice. All of that is true. It's not about common sense though. It's about privilege.
JRM is an awful person and an MP for a horrible party whose policies definitely impacted on the death toll at Grenfell.
But the posts on here that are tipping into trying to explain why it's a good decision to stay are just bizarre. Everyone has acknowledged the stay-put advice was wrong and cost lives.
If we learn anything from Grenfell, it should be that the emergency services can give wrong advice and that's it ok to go against that advice.
Because if governments continue to treat the poor with disdain (and they will because they always do regardless of the party) then we can't rely on them to ensure buildings are safe and we actually do need to make it clear that all people have permission to ignore advice from authority figures or emergency services when their lives are at risk.

"The "stay put" policy should have been changed at that time when it was blatantly obvious the building would be lost."

The stay put policy was called into question after the Lakanal House fire, but no new general guidelines were implemented. The people telling residents to stay put were just people on the end of a phone giving out standard advice.

The time to think about an alternative to the 'stay put' policy was 2013 after the coroner's report on the Lakanal fire, not an hour after the Grenfell fire had started.

However, in 2013, Johnson was busy trying to build a pointless bridge.

Ahhh his cloak of sensibility which deflects flames. Man’s a disgrace.

If we learn anything from Grenfell, it should be that the emergency services can give wrong advice and that's it ok to go against that advice.

If we can't rely on advice from emergency services we have no emergency services.

The lesson to be learned is to act on advice from the Grenfell report, not file and ignore.

also that as white middle/upper class males himself and Nick Ferrari would be less likely to follow advice.

But why was he bringing himself into it at all?

He wasn’t there. He’d never be in an a position like that where his safety was compromised by penny pinching. It isn’t about him.

The egotism of the man is mind blowing.

Viques and oneofthegrundys way upthread make excellent comments. Particularly "as is often the case, offhand comments reveal more the true depth of ignorance, selfish and entitlement of people like JRM than any commons speech"

He shows a complete lack of empathy. If he had been caught up in the tragedy being a superior highly intelligent man he would have fled unlike all those silly poor (mainly non-white ) residents. Obviously because they are poor they are stupid. Including the "you or I" to the interviewer makes it worse.

I have watched the whole thing, yes he praises the fire brigade and talks in somber tones but this little comment reveals so much of how he sees those different to him, and i truly believe his views are not uncommon among his ilk and his party.

Those saying his comments have been taken out of context are missing the point.

It sounded to me that he was saying the fire brigade gave advice that was lacking in common sense and also that as white middle/upper class males himself and Nick Ferrari would be less likely to follow advice.

What planet are you on? Most of the people who made their own decision to self-evacuate Grenfell were coloured, low income, disabled, etc. It was nothing to do with social class, intelligence, race, etc. It WAS and IS common sense to get yourself out of a burning building if at all possible. The majority of people in the tower that night got themselves out - the fire service rescued/assisted a relatively small number compared to the total living in it. If you don't believe me look at the Grenfell enquiry website - there's the evidence - even down to a timeline of people in/out of the building - large numbers got themselves out right at the start of the fire, in the first 30-45 minutes, either because they could see/hear/smell the fire/smoke or because their friends/relatives etc phoned them to tell them to get out. There were some whose relatives phoned them to get out after seeing it on the TV!

He absolute contempt for the poor is so clear to see.

I bet he still gets elected though. He's a real symbol of what we've become.

It WAS and IS common sense to get yourself out of a burning building
No it's not. Most fires in tower blocks are contained and people are more likely to be injured while evacuating. Grenfell behaved differently because of the cladding.

Clearly you think people who died didn't have as much common sense as you and JRM.

Not read the full thread so if I'm repeating then sorry but it is worth repeating.

firefighter tweeted that he and colleagues were searching a 2 bedroomed flat (maybe house) and one of them went missing. The 'rescue' team came in and found him in a playhouse.

As he said, if trained firefighter with BA can get lost what chance do 'civilians' have.

JRM has voted to loosen building regulations consistently, that man has blood on his hands.

Clearly you think people who died didn't have as much common sense as you and JRM.

Actually, I'd guess that every one of them was questioning the wisdom of the stay put advice until the very end.

Which adds a layer of poignancy atop this abject tragedy, given what we know now.

The cold facts are that if people HAD listened to the fire service and heeded the stay put policy, far more people would have died - probably at least double. Just look at the enquiry statistics to see the relatively small number of people that the fire service rescued/assisted out of the building. Huge numbers of lives were saved by people making their own decisions to get themselves out. Whether that is down to intelligence, common sense, instinct, following advice from friends/relatives/neighbours, or whatever is irrelevant - it's the fact.