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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Friends asked to rent to buy house!

177 replies

Greedypeopleithink · 03/11/2019 00:28

Okay so DH close friends occupy one of DH flats. We reside in the other. Flats are part of one building. DH asked if they wanted to buy both flats as we were looking to buy bigger house. They said no and DH did not put flats up for sale because friends wanted to remain in the flat.
Fast forward 18 months.
DH and i purchased broken down house. Under full renovation. Dh friends ask if they can now buy both flats, but they want to pay for the flats on a monthly basis!! So basically rent it for the next 20 years and the own it once they have paid the value of both flats off!! I am seething. DH said no. He is very close to the friend. More like family for him. N the flats were purchased by DH before marriage etc. I just think had they bought it before or not guilt tripped us into not selling to someone else, we ciuld have bought our dream home. Instead we are going through stress of renovation and in 10 years will aim to buy house we wanted all along. I am so angry. AIBU? After all DH bought the flats before marriage so can do what he wants really. Also cherry on the cake was DH friends son saying “when you move out, i can deliver my art classes from ur flat” and the boys father said “yh good idea”. Dh is a soft touch n will prob agree until he gets tenants in there. Wat pees me off is this entitled attitude. In the past i have mentioned my views to dh but he thinks i am greedy! We are mkn ends meet and his friend is very rich by comparison. On a locum doctor salary!!

OP posts:
TowelNumber42 · 04/11/2019 07:34

Maybe he is having trouble changing the dynamic of his relationship with the CFs. Maybe help him with baby steps. You need to decorate the empty flat but can't afford it. So the obvious solution is, "Oh what great news that the son wants to rent out the flat for art classes. That income will help us pay for the decorating. Result! We'll have to be careful to make sure we organise room by room decoration so he can keep renting a room while we decorate another. What's the going rent around here now?"

Then you get a lettings agent round to tell you how much your flat would rent for redecorated, now, one room for business use while you decorate. You probably think you know the rates but still get them from official sources who will then spam you. If DH is worried about money (sounds like he must be) then seeing the gap between potential and actual rents might be the final push to see the CFs as CF and act because he can't afford otherwise.

lottiegarbanzo · 04/11/2019 08:27

Yes, the art class thing is terrifying. IME it's the people you're doing a favour to and who are most clueless about the regulations themselves, who react worst when things go wrong. All their casual 'it'll be fine' turns into 'this was completely unacceptable, you should have sorted this out before I got here!' as they retreat into petulant, demanding child mode. They go totally OTT too, blaming you for things that aren't your responsibility and stupid things they've done, because they have no clue where the lines of regulation or responsibility lie.

lottiegarbanzo · 04/11/2019 08:29

Has your DH always seen himself as the 'older brother', or 'bigger man' of this relationship? His behaviour is very much that of someone playing 'the successful one'. Sounds like the other family actually has a better income and more assets though!

Sparklybanana · 04/11/2019 09:17

You're not being greedy. His friend potentially is going to gain from your dh any changes in the value of the flat. I'd assume that if the value drops then your dh would say 'you've paid it off' and take the hit but if the value rises then he'd take what it is worth today and stop getting payment at that point. Either way the friend benefits seemingly willingly from your dh. The friend is also quite willing to use your flat for personal gain whilst you have no tenants and would they pay for any damage? You'd still need a contract. Perhaps the friend does t have a contract and your dh doesn't want to admit that? Either way, friend or not, if you need to sell them, they need selling, one or both. It's irrelevant that you're 'lucky' to have the flats - its an asset. One that is actually a bind rather than a solution...

CleansUpDragonPoo · 04/11/2019 10:40

"get a lettings agent round to tell you how much your flat would rent for redecorated, now, one room for business use while you decorate. You probably think you know the rates but still get them from official sources who will then spam you."

Avoid spam by setting up new email account eg mrs.landlady@gmail etc, and use that for all letting agent enquiries. Then ignore it once you've got the responses you require.

Suggest you do it soon then show dh the results so he can see the consequences of allowing / not allowing these cf art classes.

woodchuck99 · 04/11/2019 10:46

Suggest you do it soon then show dh the results so he can see the consequences of allowing / not allowing these cf art classes.

It would be really underhand to arrange for letting agents to value the flat and considering she couldn't do this without asking the current tenants for permission and ultimately her DH how could she do this anyway,

TowelNumber42 · 04/11/2019 14:00

Do it with DH, looking at the existing flat to decide, for example, how much it is worth spending on decoration or how much to charge for use for art classes.

sunshinesupermum · 04/11/2019 14:07

YANBU - the friend (however close he is with your DH) is taking the piss by wanting to 'rent-to-buy' rather than get a mortgage and pay full value.

SunnyCoco · 04/11/2019 14:30

Yeh your DH is a mug.
Either that, or his friend has some dirt on him.

MinisterforCheekyFuckery · 04/11/2019 15:12

i honestly feel i have no say with the flats as they are his properties prior to marriage. So i find it difficult to stand my ground.

Sorry, OP but this is bollocks. They might have been 'his' flats before marriage but when he chose to marry you those flats, along with everything else he owns, became your properties too. Besides, it doesn't matter what went on before the marriage, what matters is your current reality, which is scrimping and saving to complete your home renovations, watching every penny you spend on food and dressing your child in hand me downs while DH's wealthy friends are sitting pretty in a flat you could be selling to make life easier on yourselves! How can you "have no say" in something that directly affects you and your child?

Ridiculous of your DH to say "what if we didn't have the flats"... the point is you do have them! He's just trying to shut down the conversation, using avoidance tactics and let's face it, it's worked! He's made it so difficult for you to have a sensible, grown up conversation about the flats that you've stopped trying and are silently seething instead. But why should you seethe silently? You're "making ends meet" and selling the flats would give you a more comfortable life. You work, you're entitled to be comfortable so why should you struggle?

How dare your DH call you "greedy" for not wanting to live hand to mouth for the convenience and comfort of friends who earn 100k+ and have several of their own properties but still neglected to pay him rent for a whole year! Then they come up with this (frankly, insulting) rent to buy scheme and their son wants to run a business rent free from your other property...but you're the "greedy" one?? Unbelievable.

The fact that you think you're not entitled to a say suggests that this marriage is not an equal partnership.

MissConductUS · 04/11/2019 20:57

When DH sold his parents holiday house he had a couple of buyers approach him about a private mortgage. It's a terrible idea. First you're entangled with them for decades and may have to evict them, second if they can't find a bank who thinks they can afford it why should you?

Original poster
Greedypeopleithink · 04/11/2019 23:54

Thank you for taking your time to reply everyone.
Dh and i were talking finances and i lightly told him we are not a partnership because he owns these flats and my views around them dont matter. He likes to think we are partners n wants a joint account etc. I refused as i may have less income but i dont want what little income i do have getting mixed up with all his daft decisions.
Re his friend i will slowly tell dh about all the regulation issues and see if that does anything. Alternatively, depending on how things go i may borrow money off parents to redecorate and so we can let the property immediately thus preventing art classes from taking place. Dh can repay parents using rental income. But i feel i shouldnt help him with this. Perhaps helping him would make me feel i have more of a say when it comes to the flat.

OP posts:
TiceCream · 05/11/2019 00:07

basically they want you to provide them with a mortgage without them having to pay any interest
This. It’s incredibly cheeky and obviously you must say no. But I think you need to talk to your DH and make him understand that these flats are now a joint asset of the marriage so you get a say. Truthfully I’d sell them otherwise these people will continue being a pain.

Original poster
Greedypeopleithink · 05/11/2019 01:01

Inheritance and property purchased independently prior to marriage is not included in the division of assets in most cases. Only property acquired during marriage is. Dh and I have only been married 2 years but were together for 10 years before marriage.

OP posts:
UhareFouxisci · 05/11/2019 07:08

Inheritance and property purchased independently prior to marriage is not included in the division of assets in most cases.

That's true in the event of divorce after a short marriage but that doesn't mean your DH is reasonable to exclude you from these decisions. It means that if a marriage irretrievably breaks down after only a few months it was a failure as a partnership anyway and the couple's finances never got entangled in the first place.

In a real partnership that is set to last, all property and income is held in common. The old-wording wedding vows say "all my worldly goods I thee endow" because marriage creates the two of you to be a unit which owns all assets jointly from now on.

aboutthelibdems · 05/11/2019 07:17

Dh and I have only been married 2 years but were together for 10 years before marriage.

When there is no break between the married years and the together years, that block of time counts all together. So my solicitor told me when I was getting divorced.

Hippee · 05/11/2019 08:14

woodchuck99 - the flat that they want to rent is theirs - the CF friend wants his son to use it rent-free for art classes - so they wouldn't need CFs permission to get it valued.

verticality · 05/11/2019 08:17

I think this is what happens when you don't set strong boundaries with people. A majority of people will take the piss if they get a chance.

You need to reset the terms and conditions of this relationship, and to separate out the personal from the landlord.

TiceCream · 05/11/2019 08:33

Inheritance and property purchased independently prior to marriage is not included in the division of assets in most cases
You’ve lived in one of the flats - it was the marital home therefore you have a claim on it. You may or may not have a claim on the other flat depending whether you’ve ever had any involvement with it. But don’t let your DH tell you that you have no claim because it isn’t true.

Spidey66 · 05/11/2019 08:57

Surely the mates plan would mean you would still have the overheads and expenses of owning the flat?

And surely the point of selling it would be a cash injection for you to buy your dream home with?

woodchuck99 · 05/11/2019 12:01

woodchuck99 - the flat that they want to rent is theirs - the CF friend wants his son to use it rent-free for art classes - so they wouldn't need CFs permission to get it valued.

Yes but OP isn't the landlord so she can't get it valued and then present her DH with the results. She would have to ask her DH to get it valued which he is unlikely to do. I'm not sure that the CF have to let estate agents around to value the flat anyway. They could certainly make it quite difficult.

Oliversmumsarmy · 05/11/2019 12:05

But op could get the flat she lives in valued without her dh being around

woodchuck99 · 05/11/2019 12:11

woodchuck99 - the flat that they want to rent is theirs - the CF friend wants his son to use it rent-free for art classes - so they wouldn't need CFs permission to get it valued.

OK I got confused as I assumed it was just the CF flat the DH didn't want to sell. Not wanting to sell or rent out the empty doesn't make sense.

CleansUpDragonPoo · 07/11/2019 09:49

@woodchuck99 Mon 04-Nov-19 10:46:46

~It would be really underhand to arrange for letting agents to value the flat ~

Not sure I understand your point. Did you mean underhand towards husband or letting agents? Letting agents in my area are always dropping leaflets through begging for the chance to do a no obligation valuation. She'll need to know the potential letting value in order to discuss this sensibly with her husband, so nothing underhand either way.

woodchuck99 · 07/11/2019 12:03

Not sure I understand your point. Did you mean underhand towards husband or letting agents? Letting agents in my area are always dropping leaflets through begging for the chance to do a no obligation valuation. She'll need to know the potential letting value in order to discuss this sensibly with her husband, so nothing underhand either way.

Underhand towards husband if she doesn't ask him in advance because he is the one that owns the flat. Underhand to the agents if she pretends that she is the owner of the flat or is doing it on behalf of the owner if she hasn't told him first. I know that they married but if his name is on the deeds and not hers I'm not sure that the flat necessarily belongs to OP.