Three persons worth of sick leave

[SayWhaaaat]

Name changed!

Ok, I may be unreasonable here, I'm not sure.
I work in a job where attention is important and losing focus can potentially result in multiple fatalities at the very worst case scenario. Most likely occurrence is just a small incident though.

Last night I had the worst night sleep thanks to the kids both waking up at various times, about 3 hours total.

I've had sick days recently because my kids had chicken pox and then again cos they had a vomiting bug.
If you have 3 absences in 3 months at my company then you get a disciplinary.
2 disciplinaries = sacking.

Aibu that I can't take a sick day for myself when I'm exhausted for risk of losing my job as I have to have time off for the sickness of three people!
You'd think employers would take it into account but they're very rigid with their procedures.

(Just want to add that obviously if I felt there was any danger at all when at work then I would stop and go home)

It seems like madness to me that an employer would even want to get rid of a loyal, long serving member of staff over 3 absences.
Surely recruiting and training a new employee would cause loads more disruption. Baffled.

The problem is that you can see it from both sides, they need dependable employees who turn up ready to work. Calling in sick/with sick kids puts lots of pressure on your colleagues to cover you and after 3 incidents in 3 months I would be complaining to my boss about you if were my colleague I had had to cover for you. Because of my kids I've worked flexibly pt so I've never had extra time off, I make it up

You are entitled by law to time off if your children are ill and there is no alternative. This should not count as sickness,

YANBU OP, the system sounds unfair and kind of stupid if a sleep deprived error could result in a fatality. Unbelievable!

Here you get your own sick days, you get paid days for when your kids are sick (I get 10 a year because I have a partner who gets I think.. 12? not sure. Single parents get more, parents of three or more kids get more), and then you get paid leave if you're longer term sick than three days in a row (including weekends) which requires a doctor's note.

Wish you had our system OP :( I hope you feel better soon.

I don't think many employers would be amused if an employee didn't turn up due to tiredness. If there was an unusual reason for lack of sleep (family emergency) then some flexibility but otherwise I'd say it's up to you to be fit for work and be able to do what's required.

As said do look into your understanding re absence, I know employers are pretty harsh, my contract says three periods of illness in two years is a sackable offence and yes, they have sacked someone who didn't turn up through being tired (their flight returned late from New York so they didn't feel up to work)!

Get the union rep onto this, not sure if the legalities of making dependence leave into sick leave, perhaps ask flowery

@MarkingTimeIm59 they’re not getting rid after 3 absences in 3 months.
They’re instigating a disciplinary investigation - OP isn’t totally clear on whether it is an automatic disciplinary measure, or an investigation. Hopefully the latter. In which case that is when they can decide not to result in disciplinary measure, perhaps because 2 absences have a legally protected basis, or perhaps because the OP has a strong service record. Even if the former, the OP still has to then been off 3x in 3 months a second time, before she is sacked.

So it’s not true to say they get rid of staff over 3 absences.

*not parental leave but time off for dependents in an emergency. It's a statutory right. It doesn't need to be mentioned in the handbook as it is her right either way...

The Government says;
If your child falls ill you could take time off to go to the doctor and make care arrangements. Your employer may then ask you to take annual leave or parental leave if you want to look after your child for longer.

There is no legal right to take time off if your child is sick. OP’s doesn’t sound like the emergency situation the rules allow for.

I can’t see why only having allocated days off prevents them from deducting annual leave days from your total.

I don't think many employers would be amused if an employee didn't turn up due to tiredness

It would depend on the job, wouldn’t it? I wouldn’t want a school bus driver operating if tired.

I very much doubt if "2 disciplinaries" is a legal ground for dismissal! It sounds to me as if your employer thinks that every disciplinary is a negative out come for the employee.

Why on earth do people post unhelpful things like this?

So phone your employer, explain you are tired and ask to take a/l? The worst that can happen is they say no

The worst that can happen is that they think she is a flakey fucker and she is top of the shortlist for termination on a 'restructuring'

My dh's work had a similar policy. I am a sahm so it wasn't normally a problem but we went through a period of 3 months when I was in hospital twice and one of our dc was in hospital 3 times. We didn't have anyone to look after the dc who weren't in hospital so dh had to do it. He was disciplined and eventually sacked.

Sounds like you work for a shit employer. Any chance of a change of job?

Why didn't. U arrange childcare ? Surely if u and partner are working it's affordable ? Seems like any small excuse your happy to take day off.

yes the whole 'time to arrange alternative care' used to drive me crazy - because you cannot pay someone to look after a sick child. Anyone that works in childcare is going to exclude sick kids

Not sure why this trotted out on thread after thread.

At work we have the dubious pleasure of a work benefit that provides precisely that - ie a care agency for use where care falls through or emergency care is required for a dependent, whether for an elderly parent or a sick child (routine child illnesses, not major stuff).

Yes, we have to pay to access such care - and the prices are steep - but this care is available. (I don't know whether this is just available through employer schemes or whether private individuals can access).

How long have you been working for your current employer?

The statutory right for dependants leave is more about reasonable time off to arrange an alternative .....doesn't equate to the parent getting the day off. Another poster had say that day was a statutory right.

Your partner (assuming he's the dad) should be splitting the children's sick days with you, it doesn't matter that he splits "everything else". This is important and skews your absence record, it's things like this as to why women are disadvantaged in the work place- unfair expectations (from employers, fathers AND mothers!)

I'm pretty sure it's discriminatory to count parental leave (which is unpaid) as an absence in times of the sickness policy.

Is there a HR department? Can you get clarity from them?

Completely agree their father should take an equal amount of unplanned emergency leave.

Why should your workplace bear the brunt of both your caring responsibilities, rather than just yours? It isn’t relevant that it’s not convenient because he works ‘with chemicals’. It’s up to his employer to adjust the way their department works to cope with that.

Your managers have had to deal with the stress of managing your absences - i.e. arranging cover - and now will potentially have the headache of a disciplinary case - while his managers have no concerns at all.

Managing staff who are parents should be equally annoying for the managers of the fathers as it is for the managers of the mothers.

Do you work for an airline? I do and we have similar system, 3 periods of absence in 6 months and you’re automatically under review. It’s a fair policy and most people in our business don’t have an issue with it. You’ve been unlucky with the amount of time you’ve had to take off.

Its funny how the man's job is always more complicated. I'm betting if the OP worked with chemicals, her DH would still somehow have the more complicated job. I've had to deal with his both as a manager and as the woman who's husband always seemed to claim 'important meeting' until he was kicked into touch. It's infuriating. Women must stop letting men's job compromise their's.

OP - you're job is also not doable if tired so your DH will have to suffer the consequences too.

*your

caroline21 and aridane

What is this world of which you speak in which it is possible to find short term childcare for a child or children who have chicken pox or a d&v virus?

Do you not think the psychological needs of the child ie to be with a care giver that they know when they are ill may be a factor?

If people have ready and willing family/close friends available then great, but most people don't have that.

Presumably the care would only be during working hours, so the parents would be the ones up all night with a vomiting child etc.

And how 'steep' is a 'steep cost'? For D & V in particular, I would imagine that it would the likelihood of the care giver being sick afterwards and (irony of irony) needing to ensure that they were financially compensated for time when they were unable to work.

And is this really proportionate when the parent's shift can be covered by someone else?

I have no annual leave left as I've used it mostly when DD is sick. If I get sick myself I would take that as sick leave