To ask if other working mums feel lonely?

[HiiiPaigehere]

I work five days a week and I have a 4 year old and 3 year old. I am pretty career focused and am trying my damn hardest to get a promotion. That means I'm working late some nights, doing stuff in my spare time, studying.
I love what I do but I feel lonely sometime. I don't have any friends in my situation. I feel like there's a distance between my mum friends and I as I'm never around in the week and they don't want to meet up at weekends as their husbands are home.
I also feel like when we speak there are a lot of things I don't mention as it's probably boring for them. I feel they judge me for the amount of time I spend away from my dc's but everything I do is for them.
I really want some friends who understand. Most of my friends are currently SAHM's or work 2-3 days in a job they don't want to progress in. They would quite happily give their jobs up to stay at home if they could. I work in a field I'm passionate about so for me, going to work is my release, if I'm honest I enjoy it more than parenting.
My colleagues either don't have kids or have grown up children so I only have one friend there who gets it. I've even deliberately omitted that I'm a mother in certain situations because I thought it might alienate me from 'group banter.' Plus because I'm quite young, when people hear that I have two small children they change, they talk to me in different way.
Anyone feel the same?

I like enjoying myself more than I do my 'career' and get bored quickly so I can't relate to this feeling of 'otherness' and don't get offended by people saying, 'it's a shame for them not to be collected by a parent and go to after school clubs'. I've had that said to me but the Mum didn't know I used the after school club a couple of times a week and I think there's probably some truth in it.

But don't you think that it's a bit easier to brush off those comments if you only use after-school club twice a week - and doesn't that speak to your point upthread where you say you don't understand why people are saying it's different if you work part-time? I find it a bit tough when people I know who work one or two days a week go on about how they feel soooo guilty because, whether or not they mean it that way (and sometimes they definitely do) it feels like the implication is that I should be feeling much worse.

I have 2 DC's but mine are now heading into Secondary school. Always worked full time in city roles and I travel abroad every 2 weeks. I am in a highly pressured role, as I have 100% accountability. If i don't meet my targets I'm out of a job. I am in top earnings bracket and I reckon I earn more than 95% of all the working dad's at my dcs primary school. I sleep breathe, wake up and stress about work and my days are from 06:00 to 11pm 5 days a week. Plus I volunteer at my school an hour a week breakfast club and I raised some serious funding for school PTA (like x3 over what they made last year) because our PTA lacked commercial knowledge in tapping into corporate funding, networking and proper marketing (not making flyers and Facebook). And honestly few women have the corporate background to do this well. I do a lot because I can but not really because I enjoy it. I think I would enjoy it more if I had a peer group locally and that are women but in all honesty, it does feel like we're a rare breed. I'm sure we're not but just spread out. I have loads of work friends so I'm not sure of office banter and discussion but it's different as my personal friends have different lifestyles and ambition. I will get shot down for saying this but we all know here on this thread, the stress of being the breadwinner and earning money to keep a roof over our heads. This alone is incredibly stressful especially if you are a lone breadwinner. Which is why I think many women opt out and take the less stressful option of being the homemaker. Because being accountable for bringing money in is a whole different ballgame. And I for one, can't put this entirely on my husband to shoulder. The pressure is too immense.

Im literally just in the door from my work. I travel every week to places all over the UK. I'm gutted to be away from my wee one (1yr) for 2-3 nights a week often but I have to remind myself it's for their benefit in the long run and in a few yrs they'll be away to school and I've worked all my life to get where I am in my career and if I step back or away it'll be almost impossible to get back.

It's actually me who doesn't want to meet up at wknds so often as I'm away and want to spend time with my OH and babies! I try to stay active with friends in WhatsApp chats, arranging (in advance!) nights out for cocktails, spa days, zoo trips with the bubs, wee overnight Groupon stays with OHs and bubs etc. but it's mainly me instigating. I do find they're more willing to meet up if I do the organising though and plan in advance.

Maintaining friendships is hard work when you've all got busy lives or different priorities, but rewarding and supporting in the long run!

I feel exhausted rather than lonely.funnily when i was sahm i felt very lonely and judged. I was too young a mum for middle class mums but not young enough for working class mums. I hated it and would never stay at home again. It chipped at my soul.

Yes , I can sympathise . Don't have any advice except hoping you find your people soon!

@Basil90 where are your children while you troll on mumsnet?

@QueenoftheDay I think we may work in a similar role..I was literally up until 2am the other day ! Worry about prospect of balancing it alongside children! Courts are not very child friendly ironically!

You're not 'doing it for them' - all children care about is time devoted to them, love and consistency.

Nobody would say the above about a man working full time.

My DH does more drop offs than me - there are only a handful of other men who do it regularly. We need to normalise this not be judgey.

I don't work one or two days a week, I work 4 days a week and have to work from home as I'm the only person in the organisation that does my job. So I pick my youngest up twice a week on time,I get home, cook a meal and then get on my lap top, I can't wait for bedtime of 7 as they don't go to bed at that time anymore. My eldest is in year 8 and needs help with homewprk, general cajoling, listening to as his concerns are not Infantile anymore that I can resolve with a kiss. I don't feel 'guilty' là

Basil90, when I'm working 50hour weeks, it's cos I'm working from home. My job allows me to work where I want, when I want with full autonomy but that's because I've very senior in my role and no one tells me what to do because if they needed to tell me what to do or when to do it, well then I wouldn't be worth the 6 figure salary they pay me for. However point is, I have wonderful sahm mums but they are ones we were friends prior to having children. I think ultimately you need to widen your network of friends as much as you can. But know that working you are in it for the long haul. It really does pay off. Having good pension, paying towards mortgage, running your own car, financial independence, children's trust funds, being able to help out with Uni fees etc...these are all big ticket ££££ . Really you need to be earning decent wedge to be able to do this for the long term game. But even if you're sahm mum or dad and all that is provided for or actually you don't need to prioritise those big ticket items then lucky you. Honestly. Unfortunately, a lot of us aren't in that position.

@Basil90 'doing it for them' can mean making money so that they can enjoy things like new toys, clothes, holidays, days out etc or indeed saving money for their future.

Do you plan to return to work yourself?

I don't feel guilty, I feel flustered and bored if my life is linear and predictable so for my own sense of spontaneity, I would rather pick my children up on time in the summer in particular and head down to the beach. I think my children certainly would so I am not going to pretend otherwise and make out after-school club is more fun as in our case it simply isn't!

@Basil90, until they make food, shelter and clothing free, providing financially for your child will always be crucial for any parent. Because all the love, consistency and time together in the world is not going to cut it if you and your child are sleeping in a doorway.

And while I’m sure DS (7) would love it if I didn’t work, he would also like to live on chocolate, stay up all night and never go to school.

Where I live, there are lots of men doing drop offs and pick ups, my DH does every drop off so that I can get to work really early and leave earlier.

Personally, I think people are starting to comment on men spending more time with their children. My DH is in a senior role in Architecture and there are many Dad's that share the drop offs/pick ups with their partners or wives. I have said that he has to be a pioneer in a sense as nothing will ever change if the expectations aren't challenged in senior positions.

Mine is asleep upstairs. I’m lucky in that I work full time from home and my family rally around to help with school runs. I work a roughly 50 hour week but the hours are flexible so I am there for tea time and bedtime every evening. I travel roughly once a month and my DD stays with family. As a single parent I need my job to pay the mortgage and feed us!

I don’t have mum friends. I don’t have time!!

Also - when you're kids get older they will very likely respect what you've achieved. I've done it as a single Mum and I've got a really great career which will stand me in good stead when they are both off at university (one has gone, the other very likely next year). When my DD was around 12 she told her Dad ' when I grow up I want to be like Mum, have lots of friends, be the boss at work and be a great Mum.' Both my DC have told me they are proud of what I've achieved.

I would try not to think so much about finding friends that get it. Do they really need to? No-one has exactly your life, so no-one is going to exactly get it. What’s important to me in a friend, is that there listen to my woes and care - whether they’ve experienced it or not.

I work full time. Many of my friends do. I also travel a lot for work overnight - my friends rarely do. Of the two that do - neither is divorced like me, so they don’t “get” that I can’t just get in at 02:00 and have a sneaky look at my sleeping child to make me happy - she’s with her dad.

I agree it can be more isolating as it’s harder to make time for friends. But I’d say don’t make the isolation more intense by thinking your best friends will be those who are in similar situations.

I don’t need to be a SAHM to care when my friend says she’s stressed at having no money, and bored during the holidays of yet another day at the park. I don’t think my SAHM friend isn’t interested in me letting off steam about the stress of a big deadline.

The exact experience you have may not be the same - but many of your emotions will be. Just in different situations.

Embrace all your friendships, and don’t narrow the field looking for people like you.

@Ellisandra I hear what you're saying. I don't necessarily need to be friends with people who live identical lives to me. I just would like one person who I could talk to about juggling full time work and small people and trying to do everything well. I find I bore people with my work chat (because I'm passionate about it) and also they assume that I judge them not working. I do a bit but they judge my working too!
Plus there's the logistics of trying to meet up when I'm at work Monday to Friday and they don't do weekends.

I would try not to think so much about finding friends that get it. Do they really need to? No-one has exactly your life, so no-one is going to exactly get it. What’s important to me in a friend, is that there listen to my woes and care - whether they’ve experienced it or not.

I think it's ok to want a mix, isn't it? For instance, only one of my close friends have children and obviously that isn't going to stop us being friends and sharing a great deal, but it is different talking to people who have had that experience. I do have different conversations with the friend with a child and there is something nice about sometimes being able to have that conversation with someone who 'gets it'. Similarly, I talk about work with friends but I think we'd all say that, supportive as we all are of each other, sometimes it's nice to talk to someone in the same industry as that is a different kind of conversation too. I agree it's limiting and unnecessary to say that you want all your friends to be 'people like you', but I don't think it's unreasonable to sometimes want that. And again, I find it's just logistically impossible for me to keep up friendships with SAHM (maybe it's more so because mine's a toddler not yet at school) because they don't want to meet at weekends. It doesn't matter how open-minded you are to other people's experiences if you never see them!

Bouledeneige that's lovely and very inspiring. I really hope my DD grows up like yours. Sometimes the guilt is so crippling - not helped by comments like those from Basil90 that its hard to keep sight of this.

Just to say op I was a stay at home mum and now work very part time hours while I study. I got judgement/ rude comments aswell. What I would say though is if you are working all week and not around at all it would be pretty hard to meet up I'm guessing after school time no good and weekends tend to be busy , seeing family, swimming , my husband only gets one day a week off so we usually go out for the day on sunday. So I dont think its personal just that everyone is busy and if you are not available the vast majority of the time it's difficult.

@Basil90 CM 3 days a week and father 2 days a week. Father also does Saturday AM.

I have said I am conducting the perfect social experiment. I worked with first two children, and stopped work when youngest was 3, to be a SAHM. Had two more children. Just returned to work after 6years as a SAHM as youngest has started school.

So have worked for two lots of early years and been there for two. Been around for first two as they went to school and now am working as second two are settling in school.

I found being a SAHM incredibly lonely as I hate cliques, was never going to focus my life around play dates, school gates and going to the gym. I hated the financial dependency, and whilst it was lovely to have time with my kids, I did need more, for me, if that makes sense.

I was also worrying how I would get back into the work force and when this job presented itself, I grabbed it.

I am loving it!!! I feel like I have found my tribe again.

I do hate the rivalry between working mums and SAHM. We are all mums and we all have guilt, stresses and we are all trying to do our best according to our unique families and choices that we have made.
I love the fact that we can make those choices. Many women globally are not so fortunate.

OP, I hope that you find the confidence soon to talk freely about your life with your colleagues and peers, without fear of judgement from others. You are doing an amazing job!

@bakesalesally thank you
I know, the rivalry is silly. My SAHM friend described it to me as 'I don't feel I can moan to you as you do everything I do and still fit in a full time job' but then every situation is different and has different challenges. She has a slight disability so I could say the same to her, I could say the same to a single parent. We all have unique situations. I think a SAHM with no family support has it harder than me working full time with family support.

@Basil90 weird you say You're not 'doing it for them' - all children care about is time devoted to them, love and consistency. because mine seem to care about having food to eat and clothes to wear (and I guess they don’t consciously care about having a house to live in but I suspect they’d object if it suddenly disappeared).