WIBU or was she a CF?

[sailorcherries]

We live in a new build estate, with no pavements and a road designed to stop cars from speeding (the road is made up of straight lines constantly changing angle, like a zig-zag).
Every house has a minimum space for 2 cars in their drive, some have room for 3, and the flats have 2 spaces for each.

There are other bays dotted along the estate for visitors and so on. They are not residents only. They are not private.

Every household in the street pays a factors fee for the upkeep.

My family member asked me if they could park in one of the spaces as the train station nearby was full. I said yes. Family member returned to their car which had a 'this is private parking' handwritten note attached and the author of the note came out and verbally harassed them. They are over 20 years my family members senior and were incredibly aggressive. My family member explained that I had said okay and drove off.

The same thing happened today but the note had vague threats of 'reporting to the relevant authorities'. There are no authorities. It's not private property or residents only.

I decided to speak to the neighbour and let them know I had said my family member could park there. Neighbour went tits up and claimed that as she pays council tax and factors fees she can decide who parks there. I explained that I pay those things too and as a resident I can say yes to someone parking there, even though I don't have to. She went off on one a out her not inviting all her family to park there and it being ridiculous. I told her that we don't kick up a fuss when her husband's work can is constantly parked there, ruining the space we also pay for, instead of their drive. Or have we complained when her family have parked all over the road and not the bays. Or when their dog kept running in to our house and out on to the road in front of cars because she can't be bothered getting it. This caused her to look a bit ashen.
I also told her that my family member will be contacting the police if this woman continues to verbally abuse her and if her car gets damaged.
Neighbour called me a "boot" and slammed the door.

Now, I don't normally get involved but I'm not having a middle aged woman become verbally abusive and threatening towards my teenage cousin.
We've also had incident's where residents cars have been vandalised by people passing through the estate to the train station and I don't want her notes causing that grief and damage. You have no idea who she might annoy next.

Husband has said I was daft for discussing, or attempting to discuss, it.

This is the same neighbour who put her bins down the middle of our driveways (joined) because sometimes we used to step on her drive to put the baby in his car seat. Even though she would also step on ours. She also didn't believe that if her bins damaged our cars (a particularly windy few weeks) that she would be liable, given her placement.

WIBU in trying to speak to her or was she just a CF who thinks she can get away with this nonsense because no one tells her she's being ridiculous?

The ages aren't relevant. If your niece is old enough to drive by herself, she's old enough to be in a discussion with another adult.

@ArcheryAnnie this isn't true. If she's 17 she remains legally a child in the eyes of the law, however strange that may seem. I don't think I would be happy if angry middle aged anyone were aggressively shouting at any child of 17 in my life. In fairness there is no need to speak that way to anyone that has parked in a way you are displeased with. It's just not acceptable

Francis they are additional parking bays covered by the factors fees and were, on the plans, marked down as 'off road parking' as we do not have pavements.

In the estate in total there is space for around 40-50 additional car tops.
They were never ear marked as residents only, as visitors only and no house has a dedicated bay. No one particular house owns them.
No one pays any more in factors fees for an additional parking space. When the houses were bought the only parking we were entitled to were those in our driveway.

No one has any more or less say over who can use them.
It is not different to the people who park their car to take a dog a walk in the local green area.
It's no different to parents who come from around and park to let their children play in the park as it's a 'newer' one and therefore not run down.

We have a few street lights and the council has bin men do our road but we still pay factors fees as the council have not adopted the upkeep of the road or communal areas.
The whole factors issues has been a disaster but we're based in Scotland and I'm not too sure if land registry/planning is different.

My own parents live near a particularly popular pub. Their road design means that there are some spaces on the road, next to the pavement, where people can legally park without causing obstruction and they've done it.
People park on residential streets when attending events such as gigs at local stadiums.
People park on residential streets at football games.

As long as it's legal and no one is parking in something ear marked as residents/permit holders/visitors only then no one has any more say over it than another. They certainly don't have the right to start sticking notes to cars, screaming abuse at people and so on.

The irony is that they are the type of people who, when speaking in the past, have parked their own bloody cars on a residential street when attending events at stadiums.

YABU parking spaces in an estate are well known as visitor parking for that estate.. I'd be really annoyed as well.

YANBU

I doubt you could prevent a member of the public parking there. Let alone a family member. Why look at an empty spot all day when it could be useful to your family.

I had a similar issue parking near a train station. Someone left a handmade parking fine. I did my research, the road was public. I continued to park there and displayed my number for them to discuss.

And for all the "visitors only" what if I had told her to ignore the bay and park, legally, on the road. Would that be better? As no one is the using these non "visitors only" bays?

What difference does it make it someone came to visit me and parked there for 3-4 hours without their car moving or someone asking if it's okay to park there for an hour or two max to run a quick errand?
The spot is still used by someone who has spoke to someone who lives in the estate.

My cousin never 'took' a space from anyone desperately needing it. The ones closest to my house have space for 6 cars. They are, for the most part, empty almost every day apart from when the neighbour parks their work van there because they don't want it on their driveway. Very occasionally there is one or two cars there for people visiting.
Most visitors park right outside the house.

I can kind of see both sides - the fear that it’ll set a precedent and if everyone let their mates do it there wouldn’t be safe parking for plumbers/postman etc. She shouldn’t be abusing people though.

Where you are wrong however is the bin! Loads of threads on MSE about it. Basically impossible to get someone to pay up if their bin damages your car.

If you feel, as a resident, you have the right to say someone can park there , then your neighbour, as a resident must also have the right to say no they can't.

It is both reasonable and unreasonable.

But he/she is not a visitor?! They're using it to commute! We lived near a train station and the number of cars parked in our road using the train station was crazy. It meant we had to park a few streets away. I personally think that its not on. Imagine if more people did it. If you want to be kind then offer a space on your drive, not limited parking on a shared road.

To the posters saying that OP is being unreasonable, I fail to see the difference in parking on an estate with no parking restrictions and on a normal street with no restrictions. If the OPs cousin was doing the latter nobody would say YABU so what’s the difference? Your neighbour sounds awful OP, but I did laugh at the word ‘boot’ as an insult, not heard that in years!

Francis I appreciate the help but I am telling you that those spaces are not owned by any one in particular and they were never, at any point, described as "residents only".

Our factors fees cover "ground maintenance, general maintenance and property owners liability insurance".
On the development plans the driveways were numbered as to which house they applied to, the parking spaces for the flats were numbered to correspond with which flat owned them and the other parking had a 'v' to indicate that would be suitable for vehicles and were not part of the grass embankment we have instead of pavements. They were never indicated as parking bays.
Our title deed also shows that those areas are not even shown as "car parking spaces" in the same way as unit or flat spaces but are actually designated as part of the access road. They are not anyone's parking area, are not designated as "car parking spaces" such as the driveways or the dedicated flat parking. Indeed if a large vehicle is passing in certain areas those bays could be argued as a bloody passing place.
No homeowner has any right to any of them.

So these bays are not on a public road, it's a private road? If that's the case then read your deeds and see exactly what they're for.
Personally, if there were say 3 bays and 20 homes I'd say your cousin using one every day isn't acceptable - if there are 10 bays and 10 homes fair enough but it's probably better to move your cars and let her drive on your driveway to park, because if every resident allowed a family member to park there every day then it would use up all the parking

beautiful the difference being that every house has it's own driveway and those spaces being full would not affect us as homeowners. It would be no different to someone parking beside a pavement that happened to be near my driveway (without double yellow lines). It wouldn't make it difficult for anyone to access their own drives or park. All driveways are beside another meaning there is no danger of an entry point being too narrow for any car to get in/out of their drive.

Poo it was when she started putting her bins over on to our drive.

custard they form part of the access road and people use them for parking. They are legally, in the title deeds, part of the access road of which is, as of yet, unadopted. The council does not maintain our road but it is not a private road/privately owned bay.

And although we are near a train station there are plenty of other, closer, parking options which means our estate has never been used as an unofficial parking place

I'm confused. Why doesn't your niece park near the station then? Why does she have to park in your road? Especially if it so obviously upsets one of your NDNs.

TBH I'd probably end up being a bit hacked off. Your NDN probably has no idea whether this is going to end up as an every day parking situation. If she was visiting you, it's different, it's not commuter parking.

Rosette because those options were full and she didn't want to park on a busy main road.

My NDN has also screamed and shouted at a person who had parked their to visit someone, she just didn't see them enter/leave the house; tried to out signs up claiming spaces are residents only and so on.

I think yabu. Visitor spaces aren't for commuters.

The more I'm reading in to it I've discovered a few things -

1. those areas were never designated as car parking spaces or parking bays in the title deeds. They are classified as part of the road.
2. as there is nothing to suggest one cannot park there, such as double yellows/loading bay signs/ zig zags etc then you can park there are part of the road.
3. there is not one sign saying residents only nor do we pay any additional money for this, there is no mention of house owners having any parking rights apart from their driveway.
4. anyone can park there car there.

"oyster" read further updates. They aren't any designated bays for visitors, indeed they aren't even classes as visitor bays in the deeds but fall under the general access road. The only bays that differ are those belonging to the flats.

So as I said before visitors park there, tradesmen, post office staff, dog walkers, those using the play park etc and they are all legally entitled to do so.

Francis I was looking at the cadastral map. Those spaces, although used for parking, are not actually parking spaces.

As I had previously said they are not even parking bays. They could look like passing places or any other area of road. It is a long rectangular stretch of brick with grass at either end. There are no parking signs, no parking markings, no indication that it is actually a parking bay (no white lines to separate from the road itself). People just use it for parking. So again, they are not parking spaces and they are not owned. They are a bit of the road.

But thank you for being patronising.

The spaces are owned by someone, most likely the residents.

When your neighbour initially challenged your cousin she didn't know who she was. It was reasonable for her to assume that this was a commuter and would be a daily occurrence. Even though that commuter would be legally parked the space is intended for visitor parking for the estate, not the station. She did the right thing to try and nip it in the bud.

You are wrong about the bins. She wouldn't be "liable" for anything should her bin fly into your car in wind. YABU to think that you going onto her drive to put your baby in the car is any different to her going onto your drive with the bins.

YABU