To think that lots of people don't understand just how many jobs pay minimum wage.

[TravellingSpoon]

And how many jobs they would consider worthy of higher wages do not get them.

I am a support worker, and we were talking about this in our staff room this morning. Many of us have had similar experiences, people who cannot believe how little we get paid, or that we would do it for such a small amount of money. And we get 19p above the current minimum wage. Similarly with a couple of my colleagues who have backgrounds in nursery.

Women can become plumbers too you know, and all of these other manual jobs that pay more than minimum wage I think it's outrageous that carers get paid so little, I agree with others that in retail it is absolutely possible to progress with no formal qualifications, and many do. To be fair many don't want the extra work and responsibility for the small rise in salary; but a few years of solid experience in retail and you can apply for other stuff. It's the jobs like carers which require passionate people and not just I need a job people which suffer from poor pay. If you raise the min wage for everyone then everything will rise in cost, I guess the emphasis should be on how to progress, and increase packages for carers etc.

Yes I agree about plumbers. If there were more then salaries would fall and I saw this in action when there was a temporary inflow of eastern european tradesmen.

My point was more that I don't see how this can apply to nursery staff given the other constraints I mentioned.

You can see it with the lower paid professions of nursing and teaching too. There are massive shortages of these skilled workers but the pay doesn't rise because it is effectively fixed by the government.

Biggyobyboo please let me enlighten you and correct you twice where you have things that you have quoted me on wrong.
Firstly i didn't swear care to highlight where i did .
Secondly i dont have a chip on my shoulder .I went into care because i wanted to and still do i don't have a chip on my shoulder .But what does give me a chip on my shoulder is you and when other posts post up talking utter tripe .Care workers do the job because we care .Now please feel free to quote me there because then you would have it right .Have a nice day .

I agree. My husband has a very physically demanding job which is also very skilled and quite dangerous. In other parts of the country people doing this job get just over the minimum wage. He’s a supervisor in a big company so his wage is slightly better but for what he does and the responsibility with it I think people would be shocked he doesn’t earn more. I earn nearly double as a senior teacher and whilst my job isn’t easy it doesn’t seem right that it pays so much more.

Unfortunately the likes of retail shops, bars and other low payers will not run out of workers.

No qualification demands, minimum skills required. It's sad but there are little other options for the people who fit these descriptors.

And it's BS about the companies not being able to afford to pay more.

Most companies report millions in bottom line profits while slashing labour budgets, demanding an increase in profits and appalling standards.

They will continue to raise minimum wage while the business continue to raise prices to ensure they never lose out.

I have no idea what the solution is but it's pretty screwed up

I think it's also what the company can get away with and what's the average salary in the region. Mid range jobs with some qualifications here pay around £18k.

Some people in London called me mediocre because they couldn't believe I had an MA and worked in my field still my salary was £18k!

Once I get back from ML I'll push for either £25k or WFH two days a week, ideally both.

I earn 16.5k a year full time, not much over min wage.
I deal with complex tax code questions, queries, detailed spreadsheets, I also oversee several junior members of staff and handle complaints.
Nothing I say or do seems to get me a pay rise.

And it's BS about the companies not being able to afford to pay more.

Do you really need a reminder of the very long list of High Street stores that've have done under?

Do you need a list of the millions that their owners and CEOs left with after the stores collapse.

I deal with complex tax code questions, queries, detailed spreadsheets,

Unfortunately book-keeping/accountancy is suffering a race to the bottom at the moment with ever-more automation, low barriers to entry, offshoring etc.

I have a very small accountancy practice. I'm charging the same fees today as I did 15 years ago, simply due to competition from the hoards of unqualified accountants who have set themselves up as "accountants" often working from home with low overheads. The only way I survive is ever-more efficiency and keeping costs down.

I regularly see jobs adverts looking for experienced chartered accountants at manager level with salaries of £40-£50k, not even higher rate taxpayers. I got a mailshot from a recruitment firm and one of the applicants was a middle aged chartered accountant seeking looking for f/t work with a salary expectation of only £28k.

Accountancy is a good career if you're in a big firm or in a bit city, but it's pretty low paid out in the regions unless you have some special skills, such as tax investigations, insolvencies, etc.

It's the jobs like carers which require passionate people and not just I need a job people which suffer from poor pay.

This is so true, carers, nurses, childcare workers, teachers, police Officers.

Teachers and nurses are not as poorly paid as care workers, not by a long shot. Yet what's the difference, really, between nurses and care workers? Certainly not worth the huge wage disparity.

Whichever pp pointed out that wages have levelled out in the lowest ranks is absolutely correct, and also that wages for any given job depend not on skills or job description, but on some social status elsewhere. Degrees and other qualifications are created to increase status, not because they're needed compared to old methods of training. We gain those skills and qualifications, gain life experience, but still wages fall ever faster. My working life has felt like jumping just ahead of collapsing stairs. Any excuse is used to lower wages now. I don't doubt any real comparison between the jobs of nurses and care workers would be used to nurse's wages being dropped, when what should happen is lower wages need to rise.

The greater portion of the profits from human endeavours is hoovered up by billionaires and other predatory overlords

Yet what's the difference, really, between nurses and care workers? Certainly not worth the huge wage disparity.

Several years of study and sacrifice whilst having no or little income and being saddled with student debt... I left uni with £31k of fees, not to mention the four years I could have only work PT.

The pay received by careers etc might be too low, but don’t diminish the sacrifice of their qualified counter parts.

Also just to add I wasn’t comparing those professions, I was using them as examples for the hypothesis. They’re not well paid vs their equally qualified and skilled (in respect of qualifications etc) counterparts.

Also just to add I wasn’t comparing those professions, I was using them as examples for the hypothesis. They’re not well paid vs their equally qualified and skilled (in respect of qualifications etc) counterparts.

A bog standard qualified accountant probably earns £40-£50k in the regions. Not that far different from a similarly aged police officer or teacher in the regions, who'll almost certainly have a better pension provision and probably retire earlier.

And how many people work for less then the minimum wage? For example, those people in 'gig' economy work where assignments take so much longer to complete than the company stipulates, so the rate per hour may be £4.00 or less; those people on minimum wage who travel significant distances to see clients, but get no reimbursement for travel expenses or those on zero-hours contract, whose working hours are not guaranteed, nor are they considered 'employees' of the company.

I am not referring only to 'traditional' low paid roles, but also to roles which require a significant amount of experience and qualifications.

@user1497207191

It was established upthread that accountants salary isn’t reflective of their skill. So that’s a poor example.

The UK does however have one of the highest minimum wage rates in the world. Someone up-thread mentioned we were at the bottom, and that is just not true. It is one of the reasons young Italians, Spaniards, Greeks, Portugese and Eastern Europeans still want to come here to work despite all our Brexit shit.

Where are we in regards to cost of living on the scale? It would be interesting to see how much we get for our money

But doesn't that keep the wages down because there is too much competition for the jobs?

Care workers are now required to complete set training, register, and face a Fitness to Practice panel (with the power to strike them off the Register) if necessary, similar to social workers, nurses, doctors, etc. More training is required for progression. Very different from admin work (and I'm a former admin worker who picked most of it up on the job without formal training).

Yet the majority are on minimum wage. At least my authority pays the Scottish National Living Wage, higher than the Tories' derisory offering.

Care workers are now required to complete set training, register, and face a Fitness to Practice panel
who's going to put up with jumping through those hoops just so they can do a demanding job for a pittance?
we have rising numbers of elderly and there will be no one willing to do elder care work

"Do you really need a reminder of the very long list of High Street stores that've have done under"

Because people havent got any money to spend in those stores.

@HelenaDove

Is it not a change in people’s spending habits and the “death of the highstreet” as opposed to people not having the money to spend.

As I understand the economy is strong. So it cannot be a lack of disposable income. Other retailers are still seeing growth.