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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Should I admire this teacher for searing honesty or AIBU to be peeved?

92 replies

minisnowballs · 02/10/2019 15:55

DD1 is in Y8. Loved her first tutor at her big girls' school. She left halfway through last year. Got a new one. He left too. The class has a few interesting characters in it who have constantly made it hard to learn. Incessant detentions seem to make little difference.

Roll on to this year and we're invited to an evening to meet new tutors. DD1 has said is unimpressed with new one as she doesn't do anything with them (literally just leaves them to read or chat). She's had a few typical Y8 girls issues but doesn't want to say anything as doesn't think teacher can cope with it.

I walk up to meet new tutor. I say Hi 'I'm snowballs' Mum'.She replies "I'm sorry, I don't really know who your daughter is. The class is very boisterous and I don't have time to get to know the quiet ones who hang around the radiators'.

Now that's honest, and I get that she's got a difficult tutor group. But surely the school should have dealt with this by now, or given her some help when she's struggling? Also, I really wouldn't have described my DD as quiet - she's not rude, but she's pretty tenacious when she wants something and a keen debater. If she's not talking, it's because she's being given no opportunity to do so (and has also been sandwiched between the worst of the girls who are so 'boisterous').

AIBU to be pissed off? It's a large girls' comprehensive, if that's helpful to know. Oversubscribed. Good reputation. School prides itself on behaviour management.

OP posts:
hormonesorDHbeingadick · 02/10/2019 15:57

How long has she had this form class?

seaweedandmarchingbands · 02/10/2019 15:58

They’re only a month in and they’ve had three teachers? Confused

Spudlet · 02/10/2019 16:01

Wow, that’s not great, is it? Hard to know how to react as you say, but I think something needs to be said as she’s clearly struggling with the ‘boisterous’ kids. It’s not ideal for that to have an impact of your dd or the other ‘quiet’ ones.

I think I’d consider taking this up with the head of year or whoever - not all guns blazing but in a spirit of concern. If detentions aren’t working, maybe they need to split these girls up into separate tutor groups, or something?

Slowchirp · 02/10/2019 16:01

It doesn't sound great but I would give her another chance as we are only a few weeks in to the new academic year. I think in those circumstances I would have said something like "well can we please catch up before Christmas as we have some concerns" and then follow through in November or thereabouts.

Awwlookatmybabyspider · 02/10/2019 16:18

Well there’s no truer words than.
The good don’t get attention.

hushnowthanks · 02/10/2019 16:55

Your daughter will literally have 10-20 minutes TOPS with her form tutor each day. In this day and age most schools have a head of year and a behaviour manager assigned to each year group; It is their responsibility to manage behaviour and deal with any underlying barriers to learning. Give the form tutor time to settle in - it takes a while to get to know a class.

TheJoxter · 02/10/2019 16:58

@seaweedandmarchingbands I understood it as they had one tutor for the first half of y7, one for the second half of y7, and now a new one of y8

I think a month in it’s not so much of a problem OP, if she was still saying that after 6 months I’d be annoyed though.

hormonesorDHbeingadick · 02/10/2019 17:01

4 weeks, 20 x 20 minutes session minus an inset day, with probably at least one whole school assemble a week means 15x20 min sessions with lots of things which need to be done and 30 kids to get to know. I’m not surprised she doesn’t know them all.

LolaSmiles · 02/10/2019 17:02

I'd accept the honesty.
They're a few week into year 8 and the form teacher will see them for 15 minutes a day max and even then some of those mornings will probably be assemblies.

Students push their luck with new teachers. It's part of the routine:
New teacher
Students know what they should do but push boundaries
Teacher sets and maintains boundaries
Things generally settle

If they're doing what they like on a morning then that's not a brilliant approach to being a form tutor, but equally I know some mornings I have a 5/10 minute battle to get the register open, go through a list of year group messages and emails for specific students, do the detention reminders, pull the room changes up and that leaves me with 3 minutes or so to actually talk to students.

For bigger issues I would speak to the head of year.

whatsleep · 02/10/2019 17:10

Children who are quiet and blend into the background are categorised as ‘radiator children’ Meaning they are often overlooked due to never making a fuss. Strange that the tutor actually used this term to your face to describe the children who aren’t misbehaving! What a very odd thing for her to say 😳

Beautiful3 · 02/10/2019 17:11

Wow she sounds honest but I would be a but hurt by that to be honest. Like she cannot be bothered to get to know them all.

CripsSandwiches · 02/10/2019 17:16

I'd be a bit disappointed that by she didn't even know who my DD is by now. I don't think I'd ding or say anything about it but I'd keep an eye on it and maybe mention it if the situation continues. It's probably not the teacher's fault but she might need more support if it's a difficult class.

kathryn19801 · 02/10/2019 17:17

I think its the way she phrased it is an issue. I see my form group for 15 minutes a morning, with one morning being assembly. So not a lot and by end of September last year I didn't really know all my new first year group. However I would have phrased it as ' Your daughter seems a lovely child and there have been no issues with her so unfortunately I haven't gotten to really know her on a 121 basis yet. Has she spoken of any issues to you?' She sounds like shes quite new and hasnt gotten much parent-teacher interaction experience.

Rachelover60 · 02/10/2019 17:28

That's two 'gottens' in one paragraph from a teacher :-).

I would have been a bit hurt, op. I've not come across anything like that before but, as others have said, it's early days.

LolaSmiles · 02/10/2019 17:30

crips

It takes longer than a couple of mornings a week to get to know people individually, even for a strong tutor who is engaged.

I'd say it takes me a half term to feel like I know my form and then a term to get that strong pastoral relationship (which is more personal and based on personality, quirks, humour, wider interests beyond school etc).
By week 3 with a new form, I'm generally on names, those who are keen and volunteer for things, those who are in bother, and no news is good news as a principle, which is standard in secondary. Unfortunately with 150-200 students I teach 3/4 hours a week, I don't have enough brain space to keep track on what every student in my form is doing in every subject by week 3 (I probably won't have even spoken to all teachers!). A good form tutor relationship takes time.

CapturedFairy · 02/10/2019 17:30

The teacher can't just have a tutor group and no other teaching responsibilities, how many other names does she have to commit to her brain?

Primary school is 30 children usually, secondary you can be teaching hundreds of different children every week. I think it is good she was honest.

You call them "interesting characters" I would call them pain in the arse disruptive arseholes. So yes, she probably knows their names

CapturedFairy · 02/10/2019 17:31

cross post with Lola on numbers of students' names to learn.

Witchinaditch · 02/10/2019 17:35

Depends what role of form tutor is? In secondary school kids are generally left to sort the problems themselves. What exactly do you want the teacher to do?

PhysaliaPhysalis · 02/10/2019 17:37

'Big girls' school?' [confused'

I agree that the way she phrased it was probably a bit too blunt, but as PP have said, it's still early in the term to really know all pupils very well, especially if they only see them in tutor time.

Butterfly84 · 02/10/2019 17:38

The teacher can't just have a tutor group and no other teaching responsibilities, how many other names does she have to commit to her brain?

A secondary school child's tutor should be a person who they would go to first with any problems and be there to help them with anything I think it's embarassing for the OP's DD's personal tutor not to know who she is. 'Boisterous characters' or not, this teacher needs to do her job and make her sure her own personal tutor group are okay and happy.

I would ask to speak to the head of year OP.

BoneyBackJefferson · 02/10/2019 17:39

Just imagine the response on here if teachers where aloud to be honest about the pupils.

And Rachelover60

Gotten is an old English word so perfectly fine to use in context.

PassMeAnotherCoffee · 02/10/2019 17:43

I'm surprised the tutor didn't have photos to help him!

ChloeDecker · 02/10/2019 17:52

I think it's embarassing for the OP's DD's personal tutor not to know who she is.

It’s been about 4 weeks with what the OP calls a difficult form group. Give her a chance! I can guarantee you yourself would not being able to put names to faces to all 30plus pupils out of the class seating plan, after 4 weeks at about 15mins at a time, especially when you’d also have another 250 odd pupils’ names to also learn!

Definitely a very blunt responses and I too would be momentarily taken aback, if I didn’t already understand the context with which she has had to take over this form. She absolutely would not have been given much support from her colleagues over this, that’s for sure!

lazylinguist · 02/10/2019 17:56

I'm a teacher and have just been invited to a parents' evening for my year 7 ds. Personally I think these 'settling in' parents' evenings are a silly idea. Of course the teachers don't know the kids properly yet. But I sure as hell wouldn't have said what that teacher did! There's honest and there's shooting yourself in the foot...

LolaSmiles · 02/10/2019 17:56

Butterfly84
A couple of weeks in when you get 15 minutes a few times a week isn't that unreasonable not to know everyone well.

Would you know 250 names, faces and enough for personal comments in 3 weeks?

I always keep photos with me for the settling in tutor evenings because I can recall what students have done etc from the photos if I'm still learning names.

I'm not saying the tutor here is off the hook (especially if they are making no attempt to be a good form tutor), I just question the outrage over someone not having names, faces and personal comments for everyone a couple of weeks in.