To ask why you think the Tory party are nasty / evil?

[MellowBird85]

This is not a loaded question, I am genuinely interested to hear why some people are of this opinion. Fire away...

How many times are we going to sell the poor/vulnerable down the river for a "better future" that never seems to come? Some people are comfortable doing that, I am not. That is why I dislike tory voters.

Go after the rich and we would see the change in attitudes, even the they would probably say "Go after the people on benefits I've worked for mine!!" Life seems to be black and white for them.

Then**

This is not a loaded question
Actually OP, it 100% was, and your contributions did nothing to dispel the Daily Mail stereotype.

There was a brilliant tweet that went round recently along the lines of "Austerity is the idea that the reason for the 2008 economic crash was that there were too many libraries in Wolverhampton." That for me hits the nail on the head with the Tories. A few years ago I would've agreed with the PP who said it's childish and unhelpful to label any one party evil but now I'm afraid having been embittered by years of Tory cuts I fully agree. Not to do the classic MN stealth boast, but we are in a position financially where we'll be absolutely fine under any government. Not megarich, but fine. However, the complete apathy shown towards the sick and the vulnerable in society in the past 10 or so years, by both people wealthier and poorer than me, has really made me lose my faith in humanity.

However Labour is refusing to allow us an election

Not the opposition's job to support the current Tory Govt, they are in a situation entirely of their own making... a stupid referendum, followed by a GE where they lost their majority.

But of course he doesn't really want one just yet, it's an act to portray him as the people's champion.

I do think a large proportion of them are evil, the rest might just be unkind or selfish. I don't think it's just the Tories who are like this. I think there are members of the left who are also evil, but there are fewer of them.

For all the PPs talking about the 'workshy' I'm not sure how many times this has to be repeated but most benefits go to people in work. The Tories have attacked workers rights and the unions (back then with Thatcher and now). I reckon EU workers rights will be one of the first things to go after we leave. I'm also sick of people saying Corbyn is 'hard left'; he is in no way hard left and I think it just shows how far to the right the country has gone and also that people believe all the rubbish they read in The Sun etc.

We certainly have a huge gulf between us on this thread.
Let us see if Labour wins the next election and what the people think. They have not wanted Labour since the 2005 election victory.

I remember the 1970s. It was not fun - 32 day weeks, oil lamps, power cuts, 60% inflation over 3 years - nation on its knees.

I think any talk about the 'workshy' misses the change in voting demographics for the parties.

The Leave campaign did particularly well in areas with high unemployment, low incomes and low levels of education. Not your traditional Conservative voters and probably the types of people and communities that have been dismissed or even vilified by the right wing for years.

It's those disillusioned and marginalized Leave voters that the Torries are now pitching to. Anecdotally, I bet a lot of us have encountered lifelong Labour voters who now intend to vote Tory for the sake of Brexit.

I think what we'll see in the next election is a coalition of demographics on the right wing closer to that in the US - where the mega-rich and underemployed, nationalist, white communities (who have been made to fear cultural change and to blame their woes own 'immigrants' and 'elites') vote together.

Even though I'm a leftie I would not want a left-wing government in power right now. The Conservatives caused Brexshit, they need to be the ones that solve it. If Labour get in now they will be forever blamed for the mess on the horizon.

Mrs Thatcher transformed this country and was a massive force for good

Oh she certainly transformed Scotland all right. She destroyed Scotland's industries, used the country as a Guinea pig for the poll tax and is probably single handed the reason the Tories overall are still despised here and historically don't do well here.

Not the opposition's job to support the current Tory Govt

But it is the opposition’s job to seize the chance of a general election to win power, especially as they spent the last two years whining about one.

Instead they are suddenly running scared of Boris Johnson - and if you think he’s no good, just how shit does that make Labour look?

@familycourtq

No, I was curious to know people’s reasons for this opinion including presenting the other side of the argument, which is why I gave the example.

To liken me to a Daily Mail type just because I’m not far left and may have a different opinion to you is bit extreme. I just don’t think it’s beneficial to give an alcoholic £1k in disposal income nor paying people to keep having kids that they can ill afford. I DO agree that big corporations should be taxed appropriately, zero hours contracts should be banned, HS2 scrapped and the bonus culture regulated to avoid BHS type catastrophes.

I agree with many of the points made and it has enlightened me as to why some people feel this way.

I think that the nasty and evil person most of all in the Tories is their leader, who has been even worse than I thought he would be. He continues to be sexist in his behaviour and treat women badly.

Mrs Thatcher transformed this country and was a massive force for good.
You're half right Xenia she transformed the country. Because of Thatcher we don't have enough council housing.
Because of Thatcher, mental health services are up the creek.
Because of Thatcher we have limited resources for young people.
She created a selfish society in which nobody was accountable, in which the poor were demonised for not 'bettering' themselves despite opportunities to do so being removed. A society in which money was the b all and end all. She was a disgusting woman with a disgusting entourage, including Pinochet. She was the start of the current leanings toward the right.
Oh, one final point though, she wasn't stupid by any stretch of the imagination, she supported the EU.

Because of Thatcher we stopped being a bankrupt socialist basket-case, you mean!

www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/huge-delivery-champagne-arrives-tory-20379615?fbclid=IwAR1eedXtL4dBtUr0tfYGRC6h58WZ1uQrsqqYvAcTmdpRofwjJ41gl4qAL3w

Regarding any forthcoming general election, everyone can see it's a poisoned chalice. Boris et al would love nothing more than to hand over responsibility for this current shambles, and bray at a new government from the safety of the opposition benches. The MPs opposing an election aren't stupid. The tories created this Brexit mess, they need to resolve it before any election.

@CendrillonSings

Are you being deliberately dishonest or do you just uncritically digest and parrot the more partizan sections of our media?

I think most informed people know full well that, while Labour (and the other opposition parties) want a general election, the key issue is timing.

If they agree to an election now, Parliament will be dissolved, leaving Boris in a far stronger position to oversee a No Deal Brexit on October 31st.

The opposition parties are not running scared but, rather, are alive to Boris' propensity for dirty tricks.

The election will happen, and it will happen soon, but the opposition are not about to piss Parliament's power away at the time when it is most needed.

I think Corbyn is near useless, but you have to be a real moron or a propagandist to keep bleating on about Labour not wanting a general election. They are begrudgingly having to wait because Boris cannot be trusted to comply with the Benn Act.

Mellow bird, thanks for your last reasonable post. I'm interested in how you think the alcoholic should be treated, given that if he doesn't want treatment then cutting off his benefits are unlikely to help push him towards it and he'll end up homeless. What should be done?

Yes- the simplistic attitude shown to treating addiction is quite astounding.

But it is the opposition’s job to seize the chance of a general election to win power, especially as they spent the last two years whining about one.

You'll have to point the clause in the UK constitution that mandates that out to me, please. I naively thought they'd be trying to do their best for the country as a whole at all times, which is a moving target. Before it was clear Boris is desperate for a no-deal, an election would have been just the ticket. But when it was clear Boris didn't want a deal, an election at this point became a problem.

juicyjuicymangoes the posters explaining why they see the Tory party as the nasty party are giving reasons. Could you explain how Jeremy Corbyn's "evil streak" manifests itself?

@Farfarfaraway. Aint that the truth Employers dont want them.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/3699598-Should-i-be-pressured-to-accept-a-pay-off-re-stairs-not-lift?pg=1

I remember the 1970s. It was not fun - 32 day weeks, oil lamps, power cuts, 60% inflation over 3 years - nation on its knees.
32 day weeks made me smile.
All of the above was under Tory rule by the way.