Driving without licence - WWYD

[Washingyourcurtains]

I've recently found out my father in law has never had a driving licence. He's in his 60s and has owned and driven cars all his adult life, just never took his test. I'm shocked about this so would be interested to know what others think and if this is more widespread. Obviously it's a big secret so I can't discuss it with people in real life.

He drives my 2 young children around, sometimes long distances and on motorways as we live the other end of the country and sometimes meet half way to hand over the children and they go to theirs by themselves (which in itself is great for all of us). But I feel really uncomfortable about them being in his car now as he doesn't have insurance (presumably). It will cause a massive issue with my partner if I stop them from being driven by him as he will think I'm overreacting. But what if he has an accident and they are seriously injured and there is no insurance? Should I just overlook it? What would you do.

BentlyandPalmers

thanks for the headsup

MNHQ I see you've removed a post admitting a criminal offence here - keeping dangerous drivers on the road? Lovely.

@janj2301 Perverting the course of justice there. Off to the crown court for you! Foolish thing to do, and even more foolish telling the world and his dog about it.

OP, if he was caught speeding they will check licence details of the person who admits driving at the time. If he admitted driving they would know that he has no licence. He would then be prosecuted for speeding, driving without a licence and no insurance and anything else they could find.
If he had a provisional licence the authorities should investigate whether he was driving within the conditions of that licence, I.e. with supervision and L plates.
There is something lacking in his story!

Do not let your children in that car.

He got a speeding ticket recently which is why he told us
I don't understand how he got a speeding ticket? Also don't understand why he told you because of this when he's never mentioned it before
You have to send off your license don't you ? You don't just pay a fine
I think you may have half a story

OP, did he tell you because he wanted someone to take his points?

Thee must be a very tangled web behind this. In order for him to not go through the very minor hassle of passing his test, someone must have conspired with him to manage insurance arrangements, speeding fines, etc. It suggests a very cavalier view that rules are for other people and a willingness to bring other people into illegality. No way would my son be anywhere near that car.

And from personal experience, an incident with a driver who has invalid insurance is a total and utter headfuck. One of my brothers was hit by a driver who was driving while banned so his insurance was invalid. Open and shut case with obvious fault on the other driver’s side (he jumped a red light) and 4 independent witnesses. It’s been 2 years and the claim still isn’t resolved.

The lack of knowledge and assumptions on this thread is startling, thank god for the voice of reason @BoomBoomsCousin !

I'm going to go out on a limb and say he has a provisional licence but has never sat the test to get a full licence.

With a provisional licence you can buy insurance (no lying needed) and get a speeding fine - points just go on your provisional. Unless the camera that caught him also got a good enough photo of the car with no L plates and no one else in the passenger seat why would anyone investigate? and that's assuming there wasn't anyone in the passenger seat, there could have been!

In regards insurance, it's only invalid FOR HIM if he's is driving "unsupervised" - the policy still covers third parties as a couple of posters have explained.

Yes he's breaking the law and that's wrong but blimey they histeria

Totally agree with mypuddin.
But I wouldn`t do it just yet as your dh will catch on also you can make excuses for your children to not get into that car.

@Cuppie36 presumably the third part liability insurance you got without a licence was not for you to ‘drive’ your car, it was for your car causing damage to someone else’s property, like the handbrake cable snapping and it rolling down a hill and hitting someone or suchlike, which could happen when you were not driving?

unless he was born around 1930 (so is now nearly 90) he doesn't have any kind of licence exemption. You say he is in his 60s. He is not the Queen and so needs a licence (and I think even she has passed a test)

your kids have equal rights to everyone else on the road. If you aren't willing to have your kids in the car with this crook, grow a pair and report him to get him off the road for all the other husbands, wives, breadwinners, children out there.

This is absolute rubbish

Considering this driver managed to get to 25 points without being banned due to "human error and process issues" it wouldn't surprise me if things like this slipped through the net.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-49769107

t will cause a massive issue with my partner if I stop them from being driven by him as he will think I'm overreacting

The apple didn't fall far from FiL's tree, did it?

Do not EVER let FiL drive your children again. If your partner decides to make an issue of it, he's a nob.

Oh this is a coincidence, an acquaintance in their 70s is currently being prosecuted for never having had a license.

A 'friend' told the police. I don't think I could have brought myself to do that as now they will never drive again and will lose their independence. I wouldn't want to be responsible for that. However there's no way I would have let them drive my offspring if I had of known, and I do think crikey what if they had killed someone driving with no test and no insurance. It's easy to say it doesn't matter but it does.

@ToPlanZ , the person responsible for the loss of independence is the idiot driving without a license.

Bellinisurge

Ultimately yes, however it's never really so black and white in real life to actively bring trouble to someone's door. Probably why so many people on here know of people who cheat the benefits system but don't do anything about it.

Just so glad I didn't know in advance so didn't have to wrestle with that particular moral dilemma!

Just thought I would ad i am a driver for 10 yrs now btw I'm 29 now and i have never taken a DMV test or possessed a DL and I have been insured multiple times through different insurance agencies without my DL a bit pricey but definitely possible to have insurance without a DL

Then you are committing a crime.

You do t get prosecuted for not having a license unless you are involved in an accident or are caught drink driving, my ex husband (who didn’t have a license) got caught driving( the police were looking for him after he hit me) and he got a 2 points on his non existent license and a £100 fine!

@Elieza

Litecraft how do you know? Why’s your source of info? Happy to be educated

Google is your friend and I did a bit of googling after my earlier post at 08:19.

S151 of the RTA is the relevant provision that I presume Litecraft referred to re the insurers being still liable for 3rd party costs even if the policy was obtained without full disclosure of all the relevant facts. The language is quite dense but you can find it here:

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/52/section/151.

I also found this which explains things in plain(er) English rather than legalese:

www.adduce-services.co.uk/tl_files/Adduce/Uninsured%20Driving%20Article.pdf

HTH

You don't have to give your licence number to get insurance. But usually there is a drop down box section for either the month or year you passed your test, or something like ticking the box saying "over 10 years" or something similar.

I have lost the thread of this thread! Does it really matter whether insurance companies still have to pay for third party wrecks and injuries? The guy is driving illegally and needs to be reported 🤷🏻‍♀️

Totally report him - sorry but he should have the book thrown at him for placing others - including your children - at risk with no insurance if something did happen.

My father in law is the same age as your father in law and while he never did a civilian test, he did it in the army and it counts as being a fully qualified driver. Maybe it's that, that he has?

"I wouldn’t be worried about safety as he’s obviously an experienced driver"

Agree, he is probably safer than quite a few people on the road, I wouldn’t have a issue with my kids being in the car as essentially it’s just a admin error.