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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Do I change my ds schools?

123 replies

Namechangewho · 27/09/2019 21:59

Name change as on previous post I didn’t reveal age or gender as was quite an unusual situation which could’ve been outed.
Ds (year 9) has been in school just under 4 weeks and has somehow managed to accumulate 20! (Yes, you read that correctly) detentions which is just unacceptable and has left me wondering whether his school is right for him and if a fresh start may be necessary.

OP posts:
Italiangreyhound · 28/09/2019 18:23

Namechangewho
"Sorry , what’s the stick carrot"

I think it alludes to trying to move a donkey, the carrot will move them forward as they want to eat it, the stick will move them forward as they don't want to get beaten!

No one literally wants you to use a stick on you child, sorry I used that phrase and thought it was well known.

Namechangewho · 28/09/2019 18:26

It probably is well known but I’m new to mumsnet

OP posts:
Italiangreyhound · 28/09/2019 18:30

BiBiBirdie if the other students at high school have only to worry about the OP's son being a bit rude and missing the odd detention, I would imagine they are dancing a jig!!

itsgettingweird · 28/09/2019 18:30

I totally agree with not trying equate intelligence with Sen.

My ds has asd and a neurogenic disorder.
He has poor muscle strength in his hands so his writing is poor and mostly has a scribe.
He has communication problems and severe problems with executive function.
His spelling age is about 6 and his reading age about 12 (he's 15).

Yet he already has a 7 at gcse and is predicted more 7/8 and also some 4/5 (in more written and analytical subjects)

He's highly intelligent but there comes a point that knowledge and intelligence can't be communicated because other areas of learning are too delayed.

My ds also sits and stares and doddles before he can start work. He's just processing what to do. It takes him longer.

All the punishment in the world wouldn't make these things disappear. Big having an understanding and supportive school have helped him to slowly learn some coping techniques.

Namechangewho · 28/09/2019 18:50

As he isn’t diagnosed with anything, his school haven’t supported him. I think they just think what everyone else thinks. That he is just a pain in the backside and that may well be his only problem

OP posts:
BlankTimes · 28/09/2019 19:24

As he isn’t diagnosed with anything, his school haven’t supported him. I think they just think what everyone else thinks

Kids aren't miraculously diagnosed with conditions, they have to present in a very identifiable way before school will even notice. Your son could present in a more subtle way and to be frank everybody he deals with cannot see he may have a problem because all they see is his behaviour, not its cause.

Why do you think this isn't your responsibility to sort out?

Plenty people on here have already explained that your son COULD have undiagnosed SN and that would explain ALL of the behavioural difficulties he's having.

Wake up, do something about that.

Make an appointment to see the school SENCO and ask them to test him at school or ask for an Ed Psych to evaluate him. Some schools are much better than others at this. Keep pushing, don't be fobbed off.
If they don't comply, or you get nowhere, go to your GP and ask for a referral for an assessment for your son. He is displaying many characteristics of undiagnosed SN which COULD explain his behaviour.

You NEED to have him assessed to either rule that in so he can be helped and supported or rule it out so you know he's only a lazy arse and you can wash your hands of him.

You are his Mother, you NEED to support him, you NEED to push for assessments and evaluations, they don't just miraculously fall into your lap, you NEED to be proactive and set systems in motion for your son now, because if you just shrug and say 'that's the way he is' he's not going to achieve his full potential, he's going to grow up thinking he's no good at anything and that's simply not true.

He can't do any of this for himself, you have to do it for him.

TeenPlusTwenties · 28/09/2019 19:36

Blank That's a bit harsh. I don't think that until now the OP had even considered that there could be something else at play here other than poor attitude (which it still could be). She/he only posted about it last night, and is I am sure taking it all in and pondering. It's not at all unreasonable to think that the school should pick up on things. They see 100s of teenagers after all.

Unfortunately as we found out, unless flagged up, there isn't anyone piecing together the info in secondary. Only the parent really has the overview of what is happening across the board.

BlankTimes · 28/09/2019 20:29

Harsh, not intended, just horrified that any parent could think their son was deliberately choosing to "be like that" and not considering or looking to rule out any other causes or possibilities.

Maybe he is just a badly behaved kid, but I'd doubt it, even googling some of the things the OP has described would have flagged up the need for further investigation as well as some helpful techniques.

Google 'behaviour and organisational difficulties' and these are on the first page
childdevelopment.com.au/areas-of-concern/organisation/organisation-skills/
www.understood.org/en/learning-attention-issues/child-learning-disabilities/organization-issues/understanding-your-childs-trouble-with-organization-and-time-management

Namechangewho · 28/09/2019 20:52

Never ever in his whole 13 years of life , have I had an inkling that he has sn so I’m trying my best to help him and am going to handle what to do next. I never once said it wasn’t my responsibility thanks.

OP posts:
itsgettingweird · 28/09/2019 20:57

FWIW I think you are tackling this the right way. Considering possible SN but also being open to him just being a PITA!

The worst parents are the ones who can't see their child may just be a pain!

Italiangreyhound · 29/09/2019 00:10

Namechangewho I am sure you will get to the bottom of this. Please do let us know how it does. Thanks

GreenTulips · 29/09/2019 00:20

Sorry he’s screaming dyslexia!!

They have a limit or ceiling of what they can manage and he’s hot his ceiling

Get him tested

Check the 37 signs of dyslexia

thecatinthetwat · 29/09/2019 01:02

'He was usually in trouble in year 8 , not so much in year 7, but i feel he’s getting worse'

But what more can the school do? I'm sorry op, but I think it's you who needs to do something. I very much doubt a different school will manage his poor behaviour and organisational skills any better. That's really something for parents.

He's still quite young, do you help him to get his stuff ready, help him develop systems or strategies to remember the stuff he needs. Have you asked him whats going wrong? or what he needs?

I don't think taking someones phone away will help. Sometimes I'm badly organised myself, it doesn't help if my DH takes my i-pad away. I have to come up with a strategy or a system to improve.

Reversiblesequinsforadults · 29/09/2019 01:29

Whether or not he has specific needs, you need to get more involved with his organisation. Do not assume that he can do it for himself, but don't do it for him. Teach him explicitly what needs doing to be on time, bring the correct equipment, organise homework etc. He is not managing and it doesn't matter what incentives or punishments are put in place- he needs teaching what to do. Have a meeting with school and explain that you're concerned about the number of detentions. Find out exactly what they are for and categorise them. How many are for poor organisation and how many for actual cheekiness or bad behaviour?
Maybe he needs babying a bit.

Namechangewho · 29/09/2019 10:15

I can check online what they’re for but it’s not a detailed report. There is 13 for behaviour in class, 4 for organisation and 3 for missed detentions.

OP posts:
Namechangewho · 29/09/2019 10:20

Behaviour in class categorises the behaviour system (warning,caution then detention). When school rang me , I asked what he gets these for and they said talking , not focusing, messing with something around him (his highlighters on this certain day) , forgetting books. It would be handy if it said what he got the warning, caution for ect but it doesn’t.

OP posts:
boringisasboringdoes · 29/09/2019 13:16

Its the same Q really which is is he
a) disorganised and lacking in strategies to be focused/on task
b) demotivated, cba and lacking respect
Or c) b because of a and so it's all feeling a bit difficult

What was his behaviour/general attitude like over the summer? Does he behave better out of school eg for his football coach?

CripsSandwiches · 29/09/2019 13:40

Like others say you do need to get to the bottom of why this is all happening and help solve the problem. I would definitely approach him from a collaborative view point with rewards when he does well.

I was always super disorganised at school although I've never been diagnosed I wonder whether I have mild adhd (runs in my family). I know people thought I was lazy but it wasn't the case. I'd stay up at night panicking about the latest thing I'd lost but just couldn't seem to get on top of things. I would have benefited from some help in organising myself rather than just punishments woch made me even more stressed and didn't help.

Namechangewho · 29/09/2019 13:42

He sometimes loses focus mid match but it’s somethjnh he enjoys and participates well in. I have witnessed him play with the ball whilst the coach is talking and things like that. Over the summer he was rather lazy, got out a bit , argumentative at times and sometimes didn’t follo my instructions. Nothing to major though

OP posts:
Namechangewho · 29/09/2019 13:42

*too

OP posts:
KUGA · 29/09/2019 13:49

He will be the same whatever school he attends.
He needs sorting out.
He is also disrupting the children who actually want to learn.
Sounds like a fkn nightmare to me tbh.

IWillWearTheGreenWillow · 29/09/2019 13:51

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for personal reasons.

TriDreigiau · 29/09/2019 14:26

Have you had an contact with the school's SENCO (Special Educational Needs Coordinator) or has any been suggested?

If not asking for a meeting with them - see if they think there's anything amiss with him that might need investigating or if there is anything they can do for him.

They vary in how helpful they are - but it would be a good first step if you do thing there's an underlying issue.

Do not assume that he can do it for himself, but don't do it for him. Teach him explicitly what needs doing to be on time, bring the correct equipment, organise homework etc.

^^This.

I still ask mine what they have that day or next day - not becuase I'm really bothered but as a way of getting them to check right week - two week timetable - and what they need - it's not fall proof but it helps them think about it and check before they leave.

Also asking about homework - what they have when it's due - have bought them a weekly board to help them get used to organising it themselves but still asking so they work though when stuff is needed by.

Also trying to keep school stuff in one place - spent years searching for random items last minute so it's taken time to learn. Place to work quietly at home as well.

X-box and other things he gets after homework is done to a good standard - might mean checking it if he's got in habit of rushing it on buses.

talking , not focusing, messing with something around him

I think that's harder to deal with at home - is it paricular subjects or teachers or all of them? if some is it who he's sat by, the interest level in the subject? Does he have short term memory issues - can he follow multi step instructions - are sight tests up to date do you have any conerns about hearing?

You can focus on long term goals -see if he has some see you can use them to motivate him now - see if he needs to reach a certian level and lay down the basic expecation that you expect him to pay attention but as you are not in the room it does come down to him.

Madcatperon · 29/09/2019 14:59

@Namechangewho Have you considers that your DS may be ADD (inattentive)? Form the descriptions of the issues you are facing this could well be a possibility. This would affect his concentration and focus which would then obviously have an affect on his behaviour. Below are some of the symptoms which may be displayed:

•	missing details and becoming distracted easily
•	trouble focusing on the task at hand
•	becoming bored quickly
•	difficulty learning or organizing new information
•	trouble completing homework or losing items needed to stay on task
•	becoming confused easily or daydreaming frequently
•	seeming not to listen when spoken to directly
•	difficulty following instructions
•	processing information more slowly and with more mistakes than peers
Moominmammacat · 29/09/2019 15:33

My DS (a teacher) says some children at his school are delighted to get detentions because their home lives are so grim, they don't want to go home ...

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