Normal staffroom comment or out of order?

[PrincessHoneysuckle]

I work in a school and one of the t.a made a comment today which I thought was nasty and unnecessary tbh.She called a 10 year old girl ugly,we had been discussing the girl as she has had problems lately and she came out with that gem.Aibu to think this is not something an adult should be saying about anyone never mind a child.Am I pearl clutching or do you agree?

TimeforanotherChange
I've also never experienced a staff room like that.

In fact, I don't think I've ever worked in a workplace where people behaved like that and played degree competition.

Am I pearl clutching or do you agree?

No you are not.
She is there to support those children, not make bitchy & uncalled for remarks about them.
Did you pull her up on it, OP? What was the staffroom atmosphere like after she dropped her clanger?

*I've worked in 5 schools; staff rooms are absolutely vile places. I've honestly never been in a nice one. Yes there are some nice people, but as a collective, teachers are hierarchical, to the point of 'my degree is better than your degree' or ' my university was Russell yours was red brick' and so forth. It is worse than the play ground.

In all the schools I worked in over the years (was in and out different ones each week) I only ever came across one remotely like that and it was absolutely and entirely down to the HT and DHT. Their divide and conquer games of pitting people against each other made it a vile place to work.

It’s the only place I’ve ever made a complaint about staff. Normally the strongest I ever got too was “the teacher and I do things very differently”.

You should have turned around and said you are the ugly one. Some of these TAs are the thickest planks around.

@LolaSmiles - no, me either. In my entire career staff rooms have been a haven of support, sanity and full of a sense of humour. None of them have been vile or hierarchical.

I always suspect that people who come out with that sort of comment have NEVER actually worked in teaching - they just imagine that's what staffrooms are like.

I totally understand it's a no holds barred venting space. Its my first time working in a school so not used to children being spoken about harshly I suppose.The child had been having a hard time being bullied about her weight so I felt like the comment she made was bad as it made her no better than the children bullying her.Im not meaning to drip feed,I wasn't going to mention the weight thing as that tied with what the thread is about is outing.If anyone from work is on here then fuck it it's been said now.

A person who has good thoughts cannot ever be ugly. You can have a wonky nose and a crooked mouth and a double chin and stick-out teeth, but if you have good thoughts they will shine out of your face like sunbeams and you will always look lovely.
Roald Dahl

In big writing on the staff room door.

@messolini9 everyone was shocked tbh,I think someone said "you can't say that it's a child" she didn't apologise,she didn't say a word.

TimeforanotherChange
Hmmm. I also wonder that. Every now and then around MN there are some stories of schools and mad claims that don't even echo what I've known to happen in some horrible toxic places and feel more like caricatures.

@LolaSmiles do you mean you think this is made up??

@ThinkerThunkk - depends on the school. Ours is lovely. Big secondary school/ diverse range of people- very collegiate and warm.

I have worked in a school where comments like that were made in the staff room. Note the past tense. The staff room was a true reflection of what a vile place that school was. Glad somebody challenged it, OP!

PrincessHoneysuckle
No. I don't doubt your story.

My scepticism comes from tales such as "all staffrooms are toxic and people sit ranking each other based on where their degrees come from" and other highly charged negative caricatures.

I think most TAs are lovely and warm hearted and fabulous. I have also met some who are clueless, unqualified, underpaid and shouldn't be working with children. There is little QA in some places over TAs.

I think it perfectly possible one made a horrid comment about a child - and think she should have been pulled up over it.

Neither Lola nor I are convinced by the poster who claims all staff rooms are full of vile teachers obsessed with the uni they went to and the degree they have.

@LolaSmiles - cross posted!

@LolaSmiles ok great just checking

TA sounds nasty.
A proudly Christian teacher once said, while a class was being split for the day, ‘Don’t send me any thick kids, I’ve got enough!’
On another occasion, when a young child was found to be in a difficult and deprived home situation, ‘I can’t do anything about it, I’m not a social worker. That is D’s life.
This caring person later became head of a CofE primary school.

I did a (secondary teaching) PGCE in the 90s. First lecture on additional needs, the kindly and very experienced lecturer began with the words...
"My children are ugly."
His children, his career, his life's work, had learning difficulties and often physical challenges too. They were not usually beautiful to look at.

We learned not to be afraid. To face the fact that our charges might not fit into society's preferred image of what a young person should be.

If your TA colleague was calm and matter of fact, maybe she'd had this kind of training, too.

@PlasticPatty no I think she is just a cunt

I have been teaching for 20 plus years. It is acceptable to discuss behaviour, as it is part of our jobs to notice this and address this, but not looks, unless there are signs of neglect, such as unbrushed teeth etc. I think it’s disgusting behaviour and would impact on how I saw the TA as a person, but if she hasn’t broken the code of conduct, there is little you can do....

I think it's an inappropriate comment; however, set it in context. Is this typical of that TA, or out of character?

If it’s not in front of the kids then it’s no worse than when staff call them little shits when they misbehave. Don’t be so precious OP and get over it love.

Those who defend calling children “ugly” or “little shits”, genuine question, would you defend it coming from a nurse or social worker? If I was arranging a care home stay for your granny and you’d been rude and went back to the office to complain you were a “right twat with an ugly mug”, is ok ok? Do we moan about people who give us grief? Yup, for sure. I have never, in my many years, heard insults levelled at a person, even behind closed doors. We have labelled things as “Mrs Jones was very obstructive today, swore at me before I’d even finished saying hello” and things like “ah that’ll be yet another complaint from Mrs Smith”. We do swear, complain if we’ve had a shit day and F and blind at the computers. I’ve worked within the NHS and wouldn’t hear things like “little shit” either.

I totally get the need to vent and off load and heaven knows, teachers are under immense pressure. I am just quite surprised that some think it’s ok to be so direct about their comments and I come from a family of teachers and I married one. This isn’t teacher bashing as most I know do a great job with limited resources and I take my hat off to you. I do think it’s a bit off to be insulting children/patients/clients even behind closed doors. A healthy rant is something different but some of you are going further than that. Not saying it’s everyone who posted on her btw, I know it’s not.

Schuyler
If some of the care staff who'd cared for one of my late relatives had vented in the staffroom about a "miserable old git" then I honestly wouldnt have cared. At times their actions and words were draining and we'd often felt similar as family.

People are human and humans get exasperated and have rubbish days.

I wouldn't ever approve of personal comments about someone's physical appearance as that's nasty and unpleasant, but if someone vents about a series of behaviours then I couldn't get wound up about it.

Put it this way, if I had 2 hypothetical colleagues:
Colleague A: Has had a rubbish day and last lesson 3/4 known hobby students have gone for them, actively ruined his lesson and they've had to call behaviour support to remove so they can actually teach the rest of the class who are lovely. They come into the staff room and declare they've really had enough of dealing with entitled little shits who ruin it for the rest of the students and how annoyed they are that a certain clique seem to be untouchable.

Colleague B: Spends every day on low level moaning, oh they have that y9 and "we'll see if they actually do anything today", then they've had to follow up a pastoral issue but "what's the point because they'll be over it long before anything happens". Never says anything really untoward but has a manner and way of speaking about the students that shows they couldnt care less and views them as an inconvenience.

I'd have more sympathy with A and would be willing to bet A is the better teacher. Sure,A off loaded and swore behind close doors, but it comes from a place of wanting to educate and being fed up with dealing with bratty behaviour that ruins it for the majority. B, on the other hand, never actually says anything that bad, but they don't actually give a damn about the students, they don't seem to enjoy being with them etc

That’s just vile. YANBU.