to find Labour unelectable?

[NovemberRose90]

I was just listening to Angela Rayner at the conference. And it all sounds great, but where on earth is the funding for this education programme supposed to come from? It sounds unachievable.

And the whole Tom Watson thing was such a mess-up. Who will vote for a party which is so blatantly so divided? (And I personally think that TW has been pretty restrained, considering that he obviously disagrees with the Labour leadership on pretty much everything and simultaneously as at least 50% of the PLP on his side...)

How come Eton, Harrow and other private schools have managed to get and keep charity status. As Jim Royle would say "charity my arse"

As for Angela Rayner Iheart she is my MP and a bloody good one at that.

Of course they are, even more so than usual.

@TheWernethWife because they got charitable status when they were first founded - education has been one of the types of charity for hundreds of years - most universities are educational charities,

I genuinely think we’ve lost sight of what left is in this country. Yes. If we hadn't already got an NHS we certainly wouldn't be getting one now.

As for Angela Rayner Iheart she is my MP and a bloody good one at that. In an environment when people saying "MPs should have more experience in the Real World" usually mean "MPs should have spent time managing a big corporation" it is good to have an MP who understands what life is like for the majority of us in the real world, working for an employer, and what it's like for the majority of us, who have never been to university, let alone a RG uni.

All those people who say JC is "not Prime Minister material"... are you really saying that Boris Johnson is?

I'd take Labour over the Torries but neither will get my vote (would hold my nose and vote Labour if the math was different in my constituency).

But Labour will almost certainly do terribly.

I find them highly electable, not to say delectable. The Tories however are a poisonous mushroom and the Lib Dems are a two-faced twatty plant pot.

his failure to deal with antisemitism in the Labour Party
Well, you can say it is t a smear, but ‘following it’ doesn’t mean you aren’t just following smears.
When Jews tell me that they are experiencing antisemitism, I tend to accept that they are the experts.
''Antisemitic' material at Labour conference makes Jews feel 'sick and unwelcome'' (Jewish Chronicle, today, here
'Labour's John Mann quits as MP in protest at Jeremy Corbyn giving 'open licence' to antisemites', Jewish Chronicle, 7 Sept 2019, here
One year after the Enough is Enough demonstration, Labour's antisemitism crisis has grown even worse, Jewish Leadership Council, March 2019, here
I could go on (here) and on (here) and on (here) but it's getting repetitive.

Or are you saying that British Jews don't know what they're looking at?

I personally find them very un-electable now. One quick search and you find a lot you probably wish to not find! Corbyn and his support for various terrorist groups (IRA and Hamas and PLO for primary concern). He has switched his stance on Brexit, from honouring the result to being pro second referendum. I find them an embarrassment to the political system now and will be voting a third party. Get rid of Corbyn and his poundshop Communist ways!

Down with the two party system!

I'm not a Corbyn fan at all but I do like the policy of axing private schools. They are one of my pet peeves.

However I will vote whichever party is the most anti brexit, so at the moment that's the lib dems.

He’s an anti-semite! That’s enough for me.

Look at the manifesto. None of the policies would look out of place in centre left European country.
It's not so much the manifesto that worries me. It's the people at the top of the party like John McDonnell, and policies that have just gone through, like abolishing private schools and redistributing their assets. Or McDonnell himself saying that tenants could be allowed to buy their privately rented homes at a price NOT set by the market, but a 'reasonable' one set by the government. That's an interference with property rights worthy of, yes, the hard Left.

Down with the two party system!

I think it's already been and gone. I think LibDems will be the official opposition (in a hung parliament) after the GE as they will pick up all the centre votes and I think many many people just want centre politics.

Also, we know 16 million voted to remain in the EU and 6 million signed the petition to revoke article 50. This huge section of the population have been ignored but have probably increased in numbers when you think of young voters coming in.

So that's three parties, plus the Brexit party. Okay, if Brexit happens they'll become obsolete in theory but who can see big gob Farage just fading into the background? I reckon he'll just start campaigning on other issues and start a new party. And amazingly he seems popular and gets votes. So there will be those four, plus the SNP who'll do really well, and the greens.

TheWernethWife I can imagine she is a decent local MP. I’m sure her heart is in the right place.

But really, please consider this, you really think someone with no qualifications, who left education at 15 and never went back has the capacity to advise education specialists on policy going forward? Or that she would be able to form educational policy based on hardly any experience of education herself? Please. We are desperately in need of all departments having ministers with a least a passing understanding of the sector which they are to make major decisions for.

She’s not good enough. She can barely string a coherent sentence together. Unless we are now using her as an example of why state schooling desperately needs help.
It’s just embarrassing.

But really, please consider this, you really think someone with no qualifications, who left education at 15 and never went back She did go back, didn't she? Stockport College?

We are desperately in need of all departments having ministers with a least a passing understanding of the sector which they are to make major decisions for. We don't usually worry too much about it.

I lost my workplace pension pot (13.5yrs contribution) when the scheme failed. My husband lost his (15yrs) to the Equitable Life debacle. He is self-employed. No 'final salary pension' for either of us.

So we picked ourselves up, tried to plan, and we saved instead, long and hard. No new cars, no holidays. And we put our nest egg in a rental property to give us a pension, instead of trusting (and losing) again. It's a lovely little house, beautifully maintained, with happy long-term tenants. It gives us a modest income to supplement state pensions.

And now Labour would force us to sell it at below market rates. This is our money we have earned, paid taxes on. They will asset strip us and demonise us as 'evil grasping landlords'. For what sin, exactly?

With HS2 going straight through our village, and bombing our own house price, too, I'm really wondering what god we have angered.

So no: they won't be getting my vote. This latest proposal is mean-spirited, bonkers and fundamentally criminal. It runs against everything that the UK once stood for: tolerance, freedom from land seizure/tinpot dictatorial asset-stripping, and the right to work hard and own the rewards of your sweat.

What have we come to?

Or that she would be able to form educational policy based on hardly any experience of education herself? Please. We are desperately in need of all departments having ministers with a least a passing understanding of the sector which they are to make major decisions for

What a disgraceful view.

She has advisors to research based on evidence so is more likely to go with what might work as opposed to the likes of Michael Gove who goes with some bullshit rose tinted view.

As for Labour “asset stripping”, at the end of the day, there aren’t enough affordable houses. You either have to tax individuals income tax more or tax those with a lot more than most 🤷🏻‍♀️

She can string a sentence together but she is probably doing so in an accent some people find acceptable. I can't see why public schools should have charitable status or why there should be tax advantages associated with private education. Public money should be spent on making the state system as good as possible. Prescriptions are free in Scotland and Wales so it's unfair that it is different in England. Anecdotally I knew someone with bipolar disorder working hard to get off benefits and back in work who had to pay for anti psychotics. Anti semitism I am not closely involved enough to know about. It wouldn't surprise me if some labour activists are anti semitic but I don't think the Labour party is riddled with racism. It does need to be seen to deal with anti semitism decisively where it exists. There is a lot of racism of different kinds in the Tory party, so it can't be claimed that they are superior in that respect. I don't think Labour are any more unelectable than anyone else, although things are poor all round.

Actually, I'll add to Katvic's post from the other side. I'm a private tenant, I've lived in my house for 7 years. My landlord is ok, I am happy with our arrangement and want to carry on living here. I have no desire to buy this property.
I worry that this policy will work against tenants like me. Maybe landlords will become reluctant to offer long term flexible rents like I have, and I don't blame them.
What if you are happy just renting, long term??

People who attended major public schools tend not to have a great understanding of the education system overall. There afe some snobs with prejudiced attitudes on here.

If people are happy renting long term, why not have more government owned property that everyone can access?

It’s profitable so the idea that it’s wasting taxpayers money is no excuse.

It could make returns for the public purse which could be used to invest in the state.

To be fair, I don't feel that Gavin Williamson has any better understanding of the education system than Angela Rayner.

But it's a bit depressing to be having to choose a least worst option.

To be fair, I don't feel that Gavin Williamson has any better understanding of the education system than Angela Rayner.

He understands enough not to behave like a dictator, so that's a pretty big head start regardless of anything else.

I watched Angela Rayner earlier through my hands. It was awful.
I sometimes think that the main players of Labour are getting backhanders from the Tories to keep them in power and now we have another one to add to Corbyn, Abbott and so on.
Seriously - I feel sorry for Labour voters. I haven't voted Labour for a long, long time and certainly won't be for the forseeable future and it is such a shame that these clowns are making a mockery of one of our supposed main parties.

Government property is usually not that great. I grew up on a council estate, it was, frankly, shit.
I am renting in the private sector. I'm happy with it for now. Some of us "renters" are actually ok with this and our landlords. I worry Labour will screw this up for me, maybe by saying if you've lived there 5 plus years you can buy etc. I don't want to buy this house,
but wouldn't blame my landlord for getting shut of me if he thought I could.

Social housing was left to rot because of right to buy.

Personally I think that right to buy should be ditched and it shouldn’t be allowed in the private sector. If you want to buy, then you raise the funds, no government handouts.

But I believe there needs to be a decent, affordable rental sector with tenant protections which really is lacking at the moment.