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Original poster

Parents keep baby’s sex a secret to avoid gender bias

260 replies

Doyoumind · 17/09/2019 10:45

This story has been covered pretty widely but I don't think it's been mentioned on here.

A couple have a 17 month old who they refer to as 'they' and the couple didn't even tell family what sex the child is.

Fine, keep things gender neutral and avoid stereotypes but referring to your child only as 'they' is totally othering. They will soon hear other children being referred to differently.

Pretty soon that child will be talking. Unless it lives in a bubble and never has stories read to it that child will understand there are boys and girls and wonder which they are. They will start to realise the difference between when mummy and daddy go to the toilet, unless they are never to be seen naked. At that point they will know whether they are a boy or a girl if their parents are honest and explain the physical differences between male and female.

Their parents might be able to shield them from gender stereotypes to some extent bit they can't deny the obvious biology.

Or are they going to say only some men have penises and some women do too?

OP posts:
PortiaCastis · 17/09/2019 12:58

what are they going to do when it starts getting periods/signs of male puberty
Tell the world via twatter no doubt

codenameduchess · 17/09/2019 12:59

I saw this and was immediately annoyed. The main issue I have is the parents and media are using gender when they mean sex, this is the root of the problem- sex and gender are different things and using them in this interchangeable way is damaging.

As a baby not telling a child is SEX isn't going to do any harm, other than everyone thinking the parents are attention seeking morons. But when that child is old enough to understand there are 2 SEXES and they are one of them is pretty basic. As they get older there are situations where they will need to understand that everyone is male or female.

Gender is another subject entirely and while I agree with not labelling every one or forcing perceptions of what a male or female should be the argument is often so detailed by people lacking the basic understanding of the difference between sex and gender or the pointless 'well I'm not a girly girl' comments it's not getting anywhere.

TheRipening · 17/09/2019 13:00

It's not that confusing really, is it?

Yes, you are a female if you have a vagina.

No, you should not discourage a girl from playing with dolls or dressing up like a princess.

But at the same time, you should not be actively encouraging OR discouraging them from playing with certain toys, wearing certain clothes, and ultimately behaving in certain ways.

If you as a parent never do that, then great, but if you think nobody else is doing it, you're blind.

Nearlyalmost50 · 17/09/2019 13:00

I expect the child will be a corporate lawyer in the future This is exactly what happened to friends of mine, I know two friends brought up in communities/communes (which actually sounded very nice) but one is a lawyer and one is an academic. Not very revolutionary at all.

TheRipening · 17/09/2019 13:03

sex and gender are different things and using them in this interchangeable way is damaging

I don't think they're being used interchangeably here. The parents are not telling people the sex because people would then stereotype her gender based on that.

I haven't read anything in the articles about them hiding the child from the concept of sex or gender, and they seem to say they're not telling other people "for now", so I'd imagine they're just trying to avoid bias in the child's early years, until it becomes no longer possible. So I doubt bullying or puberty, etc. will ever be a major problem.

IsobelRae23 · 17/09/2019 13:04

It’s screams ‘LOOK AT ME, LOOK AT US!!’

And everyone else just sniggers. Is it going to benefit their child? Like f**k is it! It will cause more harm than good. Let me guess, true child won’t go to school, and will be homeschooled.

hsegfiugseskufh · 17/09/2019 13:10

i'd love to live in a society where kids all have gender neutral haircuts and names and clothes and toys, etc. Where people who don't know the child wouldn't immediately know whether they have a penis or a vagina

when would it end though? i think it sounds like a disaster waiting to happen and a haven for sexual predators tbh!

SunshineCake · 17/09/2019 13:11

God help us. WHSmith is now selling two identical calculators, one pink and one blue Hmm.

codenameduchess · 17/09/2019 13:11

Sex and gender are being used interchangeably in the article (at least on metro where I read it). They hid the gender, not telling anyone the gender... they mean sex. Both words are used in the (badly written) article but in all cases it means sex.

Hugsgalore · 17/09/2019 13:13

I'm really getting sick of this shit now. Crawl back into your hole hobbit

yulet · 17/09/2019 13:14

@sunshinecake have you seen Reddit's pointlessly gendered section? It's ubiquitous!

www.reddit.com/r/pointlesslygendered/

JemSynergy · 17/09/2019 13:15

World gone mad and they are the sort of attention seeking people I would avoid being around.

KittyVonCatsington · 17/09/2019 13:26

I cringe, and my gifts to her are almost always as not-specifically-girlie as I can, because she will get a sea of pink glittery nail stuff from everybody else, and my feminist heart dies a little every time.

To me, feminism is about being allowed to wear or do whatever you like and not being forced one way or another. It was probably the not being allowed to wear pink in the first place that highlighted an issue when in fact there wasn't one. Pink is just a colour. By avoiding wearing pink at all, the stigma just becomes bigger. Same goes for acknowledging what sex you/your children are.

lololove · 17/09/2019 13:26

i'd wonder if grandparents/family deign to the parents wishes for they/them in order that they get to keep their grandchild in their lives for fear the parents wouldn't let them see the child if they didn't.

tillytrotter1 · 17/09/2019 13:28

An Andy Warhol story, seeking their 15 minutes of fame. If they continue this nonsense as the child gets older it'll no doubt be 'mocked and 'bullied'', in their simple opinion, another 15 minutes and possibly a claim for something or other invented to draw attention to them.

Witchend · 17/09/2019 13:30

I would be interested to know of parents who are raising "gender neutral" children what proportion of them are actually boys/girls.

When I've seen them it always seems to turn out to be a boy, and they always seem to be encouraged to dress as a girl.
Now I admit I haven't seen enough to be statistically significant, but I wonder if it's sometimes parents who wanted a girl who've actually got a boy.

CaveMum · 17/09/2019 13:36

There is some research that 1 in a thousand babies are born with indeterminate genitalia and undergo corrective surgery that is kept secret to make them conform to one or the other genders.

@Jaredjadon those stats are complete rubbish. The incidence of genuine intersex/DSD births is tiny, more like 2 in 10,000.

www.leonardsax.com/how-common-is-intersex-a-response-to-anne-fausto-sterling/

Parents keep baby’s sex a secret to avoid gender bias
MartiniDry · 17/09/2019 13:37

"Most likely they'll choose their actual sex once they can understand the concept"🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Aliensprig, you do know that one cannot choose one's sex, don't you?
Sex is observed and noted at birth, not chosen, for pity's sake.

Oakmaiden · 17/09/2019 13:39

I heard a psychologist talking about this on radio 5 yesterday. If I understood her correctly, I think she was saying this is potentially damaging for the child.

In fairness, there is also overwhelming evidence that gender stereotyping harms children.

TheRipening · 17/09/2019 13:41

when would it end though? i think it sounds like a disaster waiting to happen and a haven for sexual predators tbh!

I don't understand the "when would it end" question. Like I said, if we only had neutral pronouns, names, and fashions (hairstyles and clothes) then bias and stereotypes in the early years would be far reduced. That would be a good thing!

Not sure what would be a disaster or haven for sexual predators about that either.

RushianDisney · 17/09/2019 13:47

To be honest anyone who changes their name to Hobbit is likely to have some pretty wacky parenting ideas. It's just attention seeking, there are thousands of parents trying to raise their children without damaging gender stereotypes without making a song and dance and going to the press.

checkeredredshorts · 17/09/2019 13:54

This is fucking ridiculous.

It's a fact of life. Some people have male genitalia and some have female genitalia. And that forms part of your biological identity. You are one or the the other and there is no shame in either

It shouldn't define who you are are as a person as in what your hobbies are, clothes you wear, favourite colours, toys etc. Obviously many people think there are 'boys' and 'girls' things and push that on the kids but that's entirely different to actually concealing a child's sex and acting like they are essentially nothing.

They ought to be investigated for psychological abuse if this carries on when the child is aware of what's going on and will affect how they grow up.

TheRipening · 17/09/2019 13:59

It shouldn't define who you are are as a person as in what your hobbies are, clothes you wear, favourite colours, toys etc

But it clearly does. Isn't that the whole point here?

Durgasarrow · 17/09/2019 14:00

Is he a penguin

checkeredredshorts · 17/09/2019 14:01

But it clearly does. Isn't that the whole point here?*

Then they should be proactive in encouraging their child to be open to all things rather than taking things to such an extreme that it can be psychologically damaging and very confusing.