Prams and buses!

[bluedungareesandspottytrainers]

Hi!

First time mum but long time poster (I've nc!)

I'm getting the bus with my baby today. The journey takes about 45 mins and I'm already worrying about it 🤦🏻‍♀️ He will sleep the journey I would imagine and is not a baby that cries a lot so that is not my worry.

I have to be there for a certain time so my plan is to get the earlier bus just in case there's already a pram / wheelchair user on board.

But what if I'm on the bus and someone with a wheelchair wants to get on? My pram doesn't fold down. Do I get off? I've no idea what the etiquette is for this and don't want to be a nob!

I'm aware I'm worrying over a hypothetical situation. I'm a bit stressed about some other things so I think I've blown this out of proportion 🙈

Wheelchair users are disabled by definition and they have a priority need.

I can’t believe There are people that think people who are disabled should be having to fold their wheelchairs so a parent doesn’t have to move their baby!

It’s this sort of shit that disabled people have to face day in day out just to be able to leave the house

@RuffleCrow Yes, but those are not disabilities. It may well be that it's unreasonable for a woman in that position to move, but that doesn't mean that her status in law is the same as the wheelchair-user. Your point about whether or not a wheelchair-user is able to fold their wheelchair and sit down is irrelevant, as there is no requirement for the reasonableness of the wheelchair-user to be considered. If they are using a wheelchair, their entitlement to the space is indisputable. Other persons have to demonstrate a reasonable need to occupy it. They are fundamentally different.

I don't like that there's a reasonableness element, as I previously said, because it creates this situation where people think that because they're not legally allowed to be forced to move, and because they think they're being reasonable, that they're therefore as protected as a person with a disability. They aren't. Paulley is a really interesting judgment, as it talks about how the law isn't there to deal with inconsiderate and immoral behaviour. In many circumstances (not the ones you just mentioned but PP saying "my baby comes first LOL" etc.), the refusal of a person with a buggy to move is inconsiderate and/or immoral. That the law can't force them to stop doing it doesn't mean that it's OK, or that they have a legal entitlement to be there.

Sirzy your not wrong.
strange how a disabled wheelchair user is now supposed to fold, rather than an able bodied parent.

I dread to think what you mums would have done back in the day before buggy spaces and when there were steps into the bus.
My mum used to manage it with 7 of us and fold the buggy.
The entitlement is pathetic. People managed before so why can't you all.

Greggars whilst I'm sitting here with my mouth open at some of these comments, I can't stand this 'back in the day' bollocks.

Back in the day mums managed without plenty of things but I'll bet they were bloody glad when things changed and their lives got a bit easier. My mum always commented on how much better things are for mums nowadays.

OP you could leave baby in the carrycot/pram part and place that in a seat while you fold the wheels, put them in the leg bit in front of the pram and squish up next to the pram on the seat

Wheelchair spaces on buses were introduced to meet the needs of wheelchair users. If bus companies aren't catering for the needs of other users (in this case mothers with pushchairs and health problems) this needs to be addressed with the bus companies, rather than expecting the wheelchair users to give up their facilities.

Glad the journey went well OP!

I agree about the 'back in the day' comments. I used to get the bus for school regularly about 20 years ago and back then although mothers had to fold their prams down the driver would always wait for the short time it took while they did it and let everyone sit down before they set off driving. I then moved to a city and walked everywhere for a long time so didn't use the buses. Since having DS2 I've used buses more though as a 40 minute walk each way to somewhere for me would be about 2 hours each way for DS1s small preschooler legs. My experience last time I was on the bus was that as soon as I'd paid the bus driver pushed the button to shut the bus door and I was shoved out of the way by the door as I was still moving the push chair. I called out to DS1 who was ahead of me to sit on a seat before the bus started moving. The bus driver heard me but immediately accelerated hard and sent DS1 flying and he banged his head on a step. It feels like the world has become a less patient, less tolerant place, although I don't know if that has more to do with moving from a town to a city or whether people's attitudes in general are changing. I always feel on the bus as if my children are being barely tolerated there even though they sit quietly, and at times there's outright hostility like being shouted at when asking for a seat for DS1 where someone was taking up 2 seats. Although it shouldn't really be difficult to get the bus it's people's attitudes that seems to make it more daunting. If we were all a bit more empathic and understanding of each other, and people were more willing to be patient and helpful towards each other maybe everyone could be accommodated much more easily.
For what it's worth I've never refused to move my pushchair for a wheelchair - there's always been enough space for everyone that wants to to squeeze in when I've been on the bus. But the idea of being forced off a bus in an unknown place with a small child and baby to look after does seem very daunting to me, although obviously this is offending some people!

CassianAndor yes we loved it when we could wheel our buggies on to the bus without lifting the baby out, however I don't think anyone expected to take on a carrycot or pram.
I think common sense should dictate that you buy a small foldaway for use on public transport, given that it's a restricted space.
And same for older people and their shopping trollies, buy a small one if you want to take it on the bus, one that will fit in your own leg space, not take up extra space.

@feelingverylazytoday my point exactly. Why on earth buy a big pram that folds in several parts when you know you will be using public transport regularly. It's stupidity at its highest. Common sense would say an easy folding one piece.
My sister lives in London so she bought a Maclaren stroller and a decent sling.

Could you get the car seat attachment and use the car seat on the pram base? Then you just lift him off and the base can fold?

Hello @mnhq i am at a loss as to why a perfectly true statement like 'some wheelchair users can fold their wheelchairs' (witnessed this myself as a professional working for a disability charity many times!) has been deleted? I think unfortunately MNHQ is continuing to promote the 'some are more equal than others' line both on this issue and on transgender issues.

It is not the case that some groups of people are beyond reasonable scrutiny. I speak as someone who fights for the rights of her disabled child daily but knows his rights do not put him beyond reasonable questioning and accountability.

I never had a foldaway buggy and I used London buses a lot. I did have a very narrow pram, however. And I didn’t mind walking if I had to.

MN won’t have it but it is perfectly possible to use public transport without a foldaway buggy or a sling. For many people ‘just pop the baby in a sling’ (a phrase I would love to ban) Isn’t possible. That doesn’t mean I’m not happy to get off the bus for a wheelchair. Like I said, in 3 years it never came up. So I’m glad I didn’t waste my money or put my back out. Or put the fear into anyone concerned that it wasn’t an option for them either.

Can I just say slings and tiny umbrella folds for newborns are only really useful if you either have the folding buggy as a second (another expensive thing to buy) or don’t have much walking to do or are in good health personally.

A folding buggy as a main for me would’ve been a nightmare, I walk on average 3miles per trip per day ( if you forget the nappies it’s 6miles going back n home again) and I’m not counting dog walks, detours, relative visits.. there’s parts the terrain is terrible.. gravelly car parks that make a folding buggy feel like it’s going to vibrate apart.. muddy grassy places with dog walks and bloody big steep hills that I couldn’t load a decent “shop” onto the handles of a folding buggy because it’d tip. Slings also aren’t safe for me personally hyper mobile with a seizure disorder (absence seizures before anyone tells me I’m unfit to care for a child again) so I don’t feel comfortable using one and when I’ve tried I’m in agony after 15minutes.. I wouldn’t have got near the bus stop in that time.

Again i don’t expect a wheelchair user to fold their chair but I’d hope the bus driver would allow a mum to get organised before pulling off. And like i said earlier reimburse the mum who had to get off so they aren’t stranded either. Sometimes it’s a little give n take though, locally I know the one wheelchair user on the route I use has offered before to get the next bus if there’s no space to stow a buggy and it’s peak times/the mum has said she has an appointment.. obviously in those situations she’s in no rush personally and does live across the road from the stop so can go back in to wait comfortably. Unfortunately they made the issue worse when they changed the “type” of bus we have it used to be a large coach with two wheelchair spaces and a special lift thing to get them in but the whole under bus bit was massive and you could wheel a pram under with the hood down and carry baby on without folding anything up (which made it 100times easier) now it’s a tiny bus with two spaces, no luggage rack or storage and half the seats on the same run, to the point people are standing like sardines in the wheelchair space at peak times and obviously the drivers hardly willing to deal with the argument of throwing 10 off to put one on.. especially when he wouldn’t let 1 more able bodied person on.