To find mumsnet so hostile to vegans?

[RebornFlame]

No based solely on but inspired by a couple of threads in the last few days. I’m not quite vegan yet but plan to be fully by the next few months and none of my friends, about quarter of whom at vegan are not sanctimonious or preachy at all.

Also please stop bashing vegan cakes! They’re yummy!!

My doctor told me that everyone in the UK should be taking a vitamin D supplement because whilst you can get vitamin D from food such as oily fish it isn't enough and most vitamin D comes from sunlight.

Vitamin D deficiency was a big problem for me in my pre-vegan days. Now I just take a multivitamin.

I always wonder how all these anti-supplement people feel about vitamin D supplements though and whether they turn their noses up at them...

@QualCheckBot
Thanks for that. There was also an episode of the Minimalists podcast recently talking about diet and they had a vegan, a guy who eats a nose to tail carnivorous diet and another who eats an omnivorous diet and they looked at how any diet can be great for one person and not for the next.

Obviously where you are from would be a factor as your ancestors would have eaten the local flora and fauna for generations.

If a diet is perfect, it wouldn't need supplements. Hence a vegan diet isn't perfect.

No diet is perfect.

And everybody needs supplements.

Do you also turn your nose up at vitamin D supplements? Vitamin D deficiency is no fun and can lead to long term problems such as weakened bones and teeth as you need it for calcium absorption. Given how many anti-vegans are obsessed with vegans, calcium and our bones I would have thought they would be all over those vit D pills .

HugsAreMyDrugs

You seem really fixated on supplements.

Once again, I'm not against them. If you take one because you can't get what you need from available food, then fine. But why take them, when you have access to foods...why take all these supplements when you could just as easily eat an egg? Our ancestors would think we were bloody mad.

@formerbabe will you be happy if everyone makes the statement their food and diet isn't perfect?

'I supplement my diet and my child's diet (no need to state which diet we follow because this applies to everyone) because no way of eating is inherently perfect and modern science allows us to supplement for best effect'

It's surprised me that you have come into this forum so passionately about how my child's diet isn't perfect when yours only eats ham sandwiches. I suggest you spend all your time researching my diet of choice / arguing on mumsnet about vegan diets and put that time on your own child's intake.

I really hope your child's diet is supplemented if ham makes up a huge proportion of what she eats

@formerbabe maybe swap the ham for an egg which seems to be highly favoured by you

But why take them, when you have access to foods...why take all these supplements when you could just as easily eat an egg?

I'm not entirely sure what you mean when you say 'all these supplements'. The only thing vegans need to supplement is B12 and of course vitamin D (but that last one applies to everybody). I just take a multivitamin that contains both and the job's done. It's not exactly hard work.

Incidentally, vitamin D and vitamin B12 would be the only vitamins I would get from an egg that I can't get anywhere else. But it still wouldn't be enough so I would still need supplement. And eggs don't naturally contain vitamin B12, they're fortified with it. So I would still be taking a supplement, just indirectly.

Our ancestors would think we were bloody mad.

Our ancestors ate dirt. I really don't think we're the mad ones here .

I find Mumsnet quite hostile in general. There seems to be a "correct" view or behaviour in any situation. Just look at the threads about Brexit, marriage, step children, abortion etc. There is clearly a strong zeitgeist and anyone who dares to have a different opinion is strawmanned, barked down and reported to admin.

I use quite a few internet forums and Mumsnet definitely comes across as the most narrow minded.

Sorry when I said it still wouldn't be enough and I would need to supplement, I was talking about vitamin D. Eggs don't contain enough, no food does. That's why do many people are deficient.

@Chillisauceboss

I really hope your child's diet is supplemented if ham makes up a huge proportion of what she eats

What supplement would I require? And its not a huge proportion of her diet!

@formerbabe maybe swap the ham for an egg which seems to be highly favoured by you

Difference is that i agree an egg would be nutritionally superior. You refuse to acknowledge your dcs diet could be improved.

I don't think my child's diet could be improved. It's hugely balanced and relevantly supplemented. @formerbabe

Once again I think you need to spend less time berating my choice of balanced diet and introduce more foods and vegetables to your own child's diet. Ham is a carcinogen.

All people should take at least vitamin d. Does your child take that?

Toastymash I use quite a few internet forums and Mumsnet definitely comes across as the most narrow minded.

I was originally drawn to mumsnet because it seemed to have a lot of ballsy posters who weren't afraid to speak their mind or give practical advice.

Off topic, but it seems to have been taken over by a lot of posters who are very traditional, old fashioned and prepared to put up with blatant misogyny who have very set rules of how lives should be lived!

@MaximusHeadroom read up on fractures in vegans vs non vegans and people getting sick from a non appropriate vegan diet.
I’m not talking about vegans who stay successfully healthy ok talking about those who attempt it and face long term health consequences through not for example having enough b12 in their diet and then end up ill and having to have b12 injections.

Obesity is incomparable argument because it is not being thrown out under the term ‘healthy’ at every corner although yes I do calls go against the big is beautiful campaigns as I disagree that this is a healthy route either.

Not a healthy route*

@vivaldisboots

read up on fractures in vegans vs non vegans and people getting sick from a non appropriate vegan diet.
I’m not talking about vegans who stay successfully healthy ok talking about those who attempt it and face long term health consequences through not for example having enough b12 in their diet and then end up ill and having to have b12 injections.

You are making the distinction between vegans who eat a balanced, healthy vegan diet and those who don't. It is exactly the same as the distinction between people who eat a healthy omnivorous dies and those who don't.

However, I would argue that the burden of heart disease, type 2 diabetes, obesity, and certain types of cancer, caused by a poor omnivorous diet and which are increasingly being shown to be reduced by a vegan diet is far greater than that of an increased risk of bone fractures in vegans who are not following a healthy vegan diet.

The argument here seems to be that certain posters seem to think a vegan diet is inherently unhealthy, whereas it is what you eat within your diet which matters.

World class athletes like Rich Roll, Venus Williams, Lewis Hamilton and Jermain Defoe demonstrate that you can be vegan and in peak physical shape.

If people don't want to be vegan that's totally fine. But they can't say it is because you can't be healthy on a vegan diet because you absolutely can.

I think I might have found the classic irritating example of a vegan that seems to annoy so many. The wannabee cheater vegan on my FB posted about his birthday celebrations yesterday. Apparently, he went to a vegan campout with a lot of like minded people where (a bit like the OP) he described the food as "yummy".

He appears to be single now so look out!

@MaximusHeadroom I think you just love an argument tbh. That’s where the hostility arises unfortunately

@MaximusHeadroom I agree with you. Some people despite scientific results just won't believe a Vegan diet can be healthy. Someone who just eats chips, bread and Oreos is an unhealthy vegan. Someone who eats kebab, snickers and meat pies is also unhealthy. Both would be predisposed to certain ailments - fractures / high cholesterol for example

But there are some posters on this thread that can not or will not believe you can be a healthy Vegan.

A healthy diet takes effort and thought to ensure that all nutrients are received.

Some other posters on this thread I think project and are over invested in a diet they do not want to follow and don't have to follow. I personally wouldn't invest any time on a thread about gluten free diets / paleo diets / kosher diets. Some also claim to have done extensive research into Vegan diets but aren't providing the right food for themselves or their families once again I think that level of commitment should be better placed to improve the diet of their choice

Why do people get so angry at a diet that’s full of healthy fruits, vegetables, pulses etc, is better for the planet and considerate of animal welfare? Touching a nerve perhaps...

No-one's "angry at a diet". They're bored senseless by people telling them about what they eat, as they would be by any other boring person.

You do realise that vegans aren't the only people who eat fruit, vegetables and pulses, don't you?

Em yes! I never talk about my diet at work or to my friends who are not vegan unless I have to mention it (for e.g dietry requirements for a meal out) but for some reason people seem to get very angry and say horribly mean things about vegans (on this thread very many examples, including someone saying vegans age faster !?) , I just don’t get it, being vegan is about compassion and kindness for people I know.