To have hated ‘This is going to hurt’ by Adam Kay?

[SweetMelodies]

Just that really. So many recommendations to read it from others, it seems to have so much praise and is a number 1 seller.

I like to think I have a good sense of humour and sometimes a pretty dark one at that but I just found the book absolutely dripping in misogyny. Sure it IS well-written and he is obviously a very talented writer and some bits were indeed funny... but a lot of it really turned my stomach, the language, the way he speaks about women, his really narrow-minded attitude towards birth that isn’t evidence-based at all, just based the very limited picture of birth he has. He clearly puts the women in a category of ‘other’ and ‘less than’.

I did feel terrible for him having experienced the dreadful situation at the end and it did highlight how overworked drs can be... but at the same time I think the language and attitudes displayed in it really summarised the paternal and disrespectful attitudes in the maternity system that lead to so many women traumatised by childbirth.

Despite this I appear to be completely alone in this way of thinking, did anyone else not get a great feel from this (or parts of this) book?

HCP here and loved it. I didn't see what you see OP.

My female GP loved it and suggested I read it. I’ll give it a swerve if it’s full of misogyny and ageism though...interested to hear examples.

I enjoyed reading it and I’m looking forward to reading his next book although I’m glad I hadn’t read it before giving birth as it’s likely to make you much more rather than less anxious.

You obviously read a very different book to me! It’s brilliant and not misogynistic at all

Adam Kay is the main guy from Amateur Transplants. Very, very questionable humour. I'd say you found exactly what should be expected and WBU not to expect it!

I loved it. I'm a doctor, a female, and a feminist, and I didn't consider it to be misogynistic in the slightest.
YABU

I really enjoyed it and didn’t get any misogyny from it. Mind you, I don’t really notice it much at all and am sometimes open mouthed at some of the things MN thinks are misogynistic.

“I agree, there was v little empathy in it IMO.”

But isn’t that partly the point he’s making? Doctors aren’t selected for or trained in sympathy/empathy for their patients, each other or themselves.....

Hmm seems I am in the minority... I may have to give my head a wobble, I think it doesn’t help that I read it through the lens of someone traumatised by a bad birth experience which probably clouds my judgement when it comes to books like these.

I just did not get a sense of him seeing the women as equal, intelligent human beings, some of the situations that jokes were played out from made me think ‘that could easily have been my experience that has left me with ptsd’, it didn’t really center the woman at all or stop to wonder what it actually feels like for them in that situation, in the system and whether the ‘successful’ birth that resulted in a live baby and mother has left the woman traumatised or not.

I felt there was a bit of ignorance towards the fact women have to consent to all treatments and that some do want a say in birth option (eg all birth plans were mocked with the obviously made-up caricature of a woman with a laminated birth plan and whale music, my birth plan second time round was invaluable even when things didn’t go smoothly, I feel he sees any women who wants a say as unrealistic and problematic as only the drs should be in charge).

Also the fact that working in o&g he only sees a particular type of birth, he does not see the many other women who were on labour ward for his shift that only needed a midwife and didn’t even have to look in his direction. His views on home birth etc just seemed to be based on his limited experience rather than actual facts.

Thank you for all the input though I think it’s very interesting how reading through a different ‘lens’ can make us see different things.

The one thing I took away from it was that if I was a man I would never slide down a lamp post
I enjoyed it but did think his attitude to midwives was patronising at times.
"When breath becomes air" by Paul Kalanithi (spelling) was far more touching and human. Loved it.

Didn't the birth plan comment reference Mumsnet, or was that something else?

I'm feminist as fuck and liked the book.

I loved it and thought it was very funny in places

I agree OP. It left me feeling the same. I appreciated bits of it were funny and informative but there was an undercurrent of God-complex and an othering, infantalizing attitude towards women.

I read it and thought it was awful. I gave it to DS2, who is a nurse, and he gave up half way through.

I think he might agree with you, OP and say that’s part of the problem with the way doctors are trained. I heard a very good interview with him that went into all this stuff a bit more. I’ll see if I can find it.

Here
I won’t say who the interviewer is. He’s a favourite of mine but universally hated on Mumsnet, and I don’t want to put people off!

Not surprised birth plans are mocked. I’m not a doctor, but have worked with the general public and had a baby.

I had an idea of what I wanted before my first birth. As soon as the birth had started, my plans were abandoned and I suspect that unless things go incredibly smoothly, it must be the same for the vast majority as nothing really prepares you for the reality. It’s a running joke even amongst women that they intended to do without pain relief, then were screaming for diamorphine.

And from working with the public, any client who comes in with a massively detailed, all bells and whistles expectation of how things will be is probably going to be a massive PITA. Their sex is irrelevant.

Doctor here and also didn't like the book, definitely got a whiff of misogyny. From memory in particular in relation to continence and older women.

@AnyOldPrion my second birth wasn’t straightforward but a birth plan massively helped. I saw a quote from a human rights lawyer in an article about birth plans recently that said it’s the ‘closest written expression of informed consent’ a woman can give. It’s also important to remember that hospitals will also have a birth plan already for you depending on what happens, and that may differ between hospitals (one of the reasons I realised it was so important to think for myself what preferences and choices I wanted to make were) My body belongs to me, why should I be seen as difficult or demanding for wanting a say in what happens to it at such a crucial point in my life? I just feel the OTT caricature of a ‘hippy’ mother completely ignorant of how birth can go and why interventions are needed to completely mock women and birth preferences overall wasn’t needed.

Also the part where a woman is mocked for having pelvic pain and screaming ‘I know my own body!’ and prescribed anti-depressants for being deluded in what was supposed to be hilarious was the only way the book touched upon the issue so so many woman have with not being listened to or heard in that sense.

I didn't like it either - e.g. obstetrics referred to in the hospital he worked in as 'brats and twats'. If that doesn't display a mysoginisic attitude in that hospital, what does? He may not think like that but he saw fit to repeat it.

My friend who’s a midwife felt the same. I didn’t though so wonder if maybe it rubs up those in the know. He gave an excellent interview on James O’Briens podcast recently. Worth a listen. And he was very funny in The Amatuer Transplants.

“He may not think like that but he saw fit to repeat it.”

But he was writing about his experience. What’s the point of changing what actually happened?

@AllTheWhoresOfMalta I’ve linked to that podcast earlier. It was very good, I agree.

I also really disliked it. Not funny at all and a bit condescending.