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AIBU?

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Original poster

WIBU to call this out?

440 replies

harriethoyle · 12/08/2019 07:39

On a disgustingly early train to a work thing. Suited and booted as is everyone in my compartment. Everyone in my vicinity is a man.

The chap on the trolley called me love the first time he served me and darling the second time. He has called all of the men around me Sir, both times.

So, the second time, I said "are you aware that you have called me love and darling on the two occasions we've spoken but you are calling all of the men Sir?" At which point he stuttered a bit and apologised.

WIBU in calling out what I felt was total sexism - he didn't call any of the men love! Or am I just a grumpy moo because I've been up for hours and have a long and difficult day ahead and the poor man was just trying to be friendly?!

OP posts:
Alcoholtolerancegonetopot · 12/08/2019 08:10

I honestly wish that I had the guts to call this kind of thing out more often. There's a guy who works in my local shop who started calling me "princess" a couple of years ago. I didn't say anything because you're conditioned to think that it's bad to be "uptight" and "humourless" about these things. Since then, he's got worse and worse: referring to me in front of other people as his "little princess" (I'm nearly 40), laughing at me if he catches me hurrying for the bus, jeering "I caught you!" if he sees me eating breakfast on the go. His behaviour just felt designed to be subtly humiliating and creepy, and I started to dread bumping into him to the point where I was avoiding my own local shop in the mornings because I knew he worked early shifts. So, just like that, I'd given up a tiny chunk of my own freedom. If I'd only laughed and said "I'm not your princess" the first time he did it, I think he'd have known I wasn't to be bullied.

The guy on the trolley could be a lovely chap who just speaks without thinking, but it's naive to think that women-specific terms of endearment aren't sometimes about putting women in "their place".

Passionaria · 12/08/2019 08:10

There's friendly and there's infantilising, with what happened approaching the latter. If you had been in a meeting with five men and were never asked your opinion by one of them because he thought you were 'just' the admin person would that be acceptable?

fromthefloorboardsup · 12/08/2019 08:11

I agree with you - it's the difference between the men and women. If it was just friendly he'd have called everyone love or love and pal or something. Love and Sir are not the same and it's small level sexism like this that we need to fight to fix the bigger problems.

SoundsAboutRight · 12/08/2019 08:13

Wouldn't bother me in the slightest, I quite like being a "pet", "love" or "darling", it's warm and friendly rather than a cold and formal "Madam" or "ma'am". And I am quite the opposite of an accepting "little woman". Maybe it's because where I'm from in the North it's quite normal and not condescending at all.

KUGA · 12/08/2019 08:13

He could have called you grumpy drawers.
I dont think he was being anything but pleasant. Also where you come from has a lot to do with what people refer to you as Example,If you come from Derby ,they call you Duck,from Birmingham its Bab ,Babie,sweety,and lots more.some not printable too.haha.
I call most males younger than me,Son.
And iv`e never been pulled upon it,in fact most people smile probably because were all being friendly for a change.

Happyspud · 12/08/2019 08:13

Think about the women who call men ‘love’ and ‘darling’. It’s ALWAYS a certain type of woman who does that, a dominant one. I don’t think they realise they are doing it but it’s not an excuse for it being ok to speak to a woman like that.

Seriously if you are a woman calling men that, think about the underlying feeling/reason if doing it. It’s not to be sweet and friendly. It’s a show of strength.

DerelictWreck · 12/08/2019 08:14

YANBU OP

Can everyone stop using the North as justification? I'm northern and yes it's a term of endearment applied to ALL sexes, not an excuse to be an asshat.

Also We should only call out actual sexism (words and actions that have contempt behind them) Not what sexism is, but nice try?

InTheHeatofLisbon · 12/08/2019 08:16

I think you should not have called it out. We should only call out actual sexism (words and actions that have contempt behind them).

Treating a woman with less respect because she's a woman is the actual definition of sexism.

What you seem to think is sexism is actually misogyny.

WIBU to call this out?
mollpop · 12/08/2019 08:17

You’re being a grumpy moo.

jesuschristwtf · 12/08/2019 08:20

Jesus Christ get over yourself - you sound like you need someone to make you feel important - have you no self confidence that you are - you need someone to call you a special name to let you know you are??! it’s fairly normal here to be called that, right? He meant it in a nice way, no?
We’re not in America.

BogglesGoggles · 12/08/2019 08:20

YAB a bit U to still care. It’s so petty. It’s not worth getting work up about after the fact.

Boysey45 · 12/08/2019 08:21

Here a lot of men call other men love as well. Its really, really common, every other word is love.

Sparkletastic · 12/08/2019 08:22

It's low level sexism and you pointed it out politely. Good on you.

BogglesGoggles · 12/08/2019 08:23

@Intheheatoflisbon but we can’t be sure that he meant to be disrespectful- maybe he just didn’t want to offend her by calling her miss/ma’am if she is of intermediate age.

diddl · 12/08/2019 08:23

I think that you're right.

He's being deferential to the men, but not you Op.

If he's OK with using "sir", can't think why he'd balk at using "madam" tbh.

Coffeeandcherrypie · 12/08/2019 08:24

YANBU. Challenging sexism means having to call out even those that may not intend to be sexist.

@Alcoholtolerancegonetopot’s post shows these things can escalate if not nipped in the bud.

Depressing how many women (or are they men?) are anxious to shout down those saying this is unacceptable (does this really call for ‘FFS’?!’

GabriellaMontez · 12/08/2019 08:24

Yanbu. Good that you politely challenged his treatment of you compared to the men.

'Madam' isn't cold or formal. John Lewis colleague sometimes use it in a perfectly pleasant and polite manner.

CherryPavlova · 12/08/2019 08:24

Really?

suckerforbrowneyes · 12/08/2019 08:26

@InTheHeatofLisbon do we have a hoops fan in the house? 😍

Pumpkintopf · 12/08/2019 08:28

Good for you on raising it!

WowThatsSoCool · 12/08/2019 08:29

YABU

I don’t understand why you have made a thread about this? The man was clearly just being friendly.

InTheHeatofLisbon · 12/08/2019 08:29

suckerforbrowneyes aye!!!! Not often anyone clicks my username Grin fancied a name change the week Caesar died and it felt fitting!

InTheHeatofLisbon · 12/08/2019 08:31

but we can’t be sure that he meant to be disrespectful- maybe he just didn’t want to offend her by calling her miss/ma’am if she is of intermediate age.

I don't think he meant to be disrespectful, I think it's habit for many people to defer to men and be overly familiar with women.

But I do think it needs to be gently pointed out every time, because it's still not on.

I think that OP pointing it out was perfectly reasonable, if she'd screamed abuse at him then I wouldn't.

fraxion · 12/08/2019 08:32

It wouldn't have bothered me in the least, I'd just be grateful there was coffee on the go. I hate being referred to as madam.

bouncingraindrops · 12/08/2019 08:35

Meh, I couldn't wound up over something like this. So long as I got a cup of tea from his trolley.