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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

WIBU to remove my DCs from exH?

94 replies

Fralla · 09/08/2019 12:01

I think I know I am not BU, but am feeling horrible and guilty still for what I am considering doing.

I have name changed as a lot of details will be outing.

Split from exH 4 years ago and we decided to split custody arrangements 50/50, so we have the boys (9yp and 13yo) every other week. I am a firm believer that both parents are equally responsible in the upbringing of children, and that even after a divorce, dads should have the same rights to their children as mums do. And at the same time, it's good for children to grow up with both parents.

The problem is, exH is truly shit at looking after them. Here's a few examples:

  • He will never ever take them to any activities. Both DS's have football training twice weekly plus one match. ExH never takes them, he's not taken them ONCE over the past 4 years. It'll either be me picking them up and taking them even though it's not my week, or they'll have to miss it. Although DS13 is now able to take himself to sessions.
  • ExH is on a lower wage so I agreed to him receiving the child benefit for both boys. However despite this, he never ever pays for anything essential. No uniform bits, no activities, no hair cuts.
  • The boys told me they hadn't had much food the week before the summer holidays. DS13 did not get any breakfast or packed lunches (as exH thinks he should be able to sort himself out), and the dinners in the evenings were small. When I brought this up with exH he said he didn't have much money that month.
  • It was DS9's birthday last week which he spent with me. However, DS9 was expecting a present from his dad when he got back to his house, but his dad hadn't bought him one! Not one single present for his sons birthday! Again, he claimed poverty. However this weekend he has gone on a city break in Europe with his girlfriend.
  • DS9 had difficulties breathing one night a couple of months back so exH called for an ambulance. The paramedics wanted to take DS9 to hospital for treatment but exH refused to let them take him, he wanted DS9 treated at home by the paramedics. It got to the point where the paramedics threatened to call the police unless exH let them take DS9 to hospital. (I only found out about this last week from the boys, they are very good at protecting their dad.)
  • One evening when DS9 was at his dads and DS13 was at mine, exH left DS9 alone for hours without giving DS9 any means of contacting anyone in an emergency. I received a message from a school mum saying my son was alone and crying to her son on the PS4. I went around to pick him up, but it was another 30 minutes at least until exH came back and realised what had happened. Despite me trying to call him numerous times!

There are a lot of other incidents as well, but my main worries are that he does not make them shower or brush their teeth, he never takes them anywhere, and even on the hottest summer days all they do is sit indoors on their computers ALL day.

Despite all of the above, I am feeling incredibly guilty for considering removing the boys from his care. Maybe he can still have them every other weekend. But his selfishness will do the boys so much harm in the long run.

Am I being unreasonable for taking sole custody of my own children? They will be sad as despite how shit their dad is, they love him and they love sitting there playing computer games 24/7 when they're there...

I am also wondering as to how I do this in practice? Do I just tell him that I am removing the children from him and that they will be living full time with me from now on? Have I got the right to do that?

He will mainly kick off because it means he will lose the child benefits he is currently receiving, and with that also tax credits and housing benefits. But that's not really my problem, is it? He will not worry too much about seeing the boys less.

OP posts:
IAskTooManyQuestions · 09/08/2019 12:07

How will you enforce this ? Will you go to court? will the children (or the older one) agree?

They will be sad as despite how shit their dad is, they love him and they love sitting there playing computer games 24/7 when they're there...

^ This is the way for many children (and adults) do they want to be doing activites at their age, or do they want^ to be gaming ?

A lot of what you've written is niggly - 9 and 13yo should not need nagging about personal hygiene and teeth cleaning.

I would have issue with

  • the ambulance/hospital thing
  • leaving the 9yo alone for anything longer than about 20 mins
Summerwellunderway · 09/08/2019 12:11

Dig out receipts, shopping bills, clothes, photo copy evidence of their dentist /Dr appointments and that your took them, contact CB and activate a counter claim ASAP. See a solicitor ASAP. A week of neglect every other week is disgusting.

Rumblejungle · 09/08/2019 12:11

YANBU I would absolutely tell him he isn’t having them - clearly his focus is no longer on them but is on his own life with new girlfriend etc. However, how you go about doing it I don’t really know? Just stop sending them? Is he likely to take you to court to fight it? Can he afford to?

I think if they were mine, I’d just message him and say this isn’t working, you aren’t able to support them sufficiently, the kids are hungry when they are will you, unsupervised and not being looked after as they need to be at their age. Therefore they can come to see you for a day at the weekend. Please ensure you have enough food to feed them for these days.

I wouldn’t even mention the child benefit at this point.

Pinkout · 09/08/2019 12:11

Is the contact court ordered or did you agree about it together? I think your eldest in particular is old enough to decide where they wish to stay.

He does sound like a crappy and slightly neglectful Father so I would be inclined to do the same but I would also expect him to take you to court.

Thehop · 09/08/2019 12:16

Keep them. Let him go to court. He’s neglecting them.

VeThings · 09/08/2019 12:16

Isn’t whoever has the CB seem as primary carer? I think you have to get the sorted first, you need proper advice on how to manage this all properly so that you don’t get stung by the perception of who is main carer (he gets the CB and tax credits etc for them)

Original poster
Fralla · 09/08/2019 12:17

How will you enforce this ? Will you go to court? will the children (or the older one) agree? I have no idea how to enforce this. I tried to get social services involved a couple of years ago but their advice then was that I have the right to just tell him that I'd be having them.
They did not want to get involved. (This was after a referral to social services from school.)

A lot of what you've written is niggly - 9 and 13yo should not need nagging about personal hygiene and teeth cleaning.
Maybe they should, but surely a parent should be there to remind them if they forget / are to lazy to do it? It is also the food aspect, I think a parent should ensure children eat. And DS9 still needs to be taken to activites. It is not good for children to spend all of their time just playing computer games, surely?

OP posts:
Original poster
Fralla · 09/08/2019 12:18

Is he likely to take you to court to fight it? Can he afford to? Maybe, if he's on a low income / in receipt of benefits I think he can get legal aid?

OP posts:
Original poster
Fralla · 09/08/2019 12:19

Is the contact court ordered or did you agree about it together? I think your eldest in particular is old enough to decide where they wish to stay.

It's not court ordered, we agreed it together. Eldest would chose to live with me full time, he's old enough to realise how shit it is.

OP posts:
Original poster
Fralla · 09/08/2019 12:21

Isn’t whoever has the CB seem as primary carer?

No, I discussed this with CAB and a solicitor prior to agreeing to it. Receiving CB does not mean you're the primary carer at all.

OP posts:
Nautiloid · 09/08/2019 12:23

If it is so bad school contacted social services something needs to change asap.
Does he have any idea this could be coming or will it be a bolt from the blue?
I don't have any idea how you could approach it. I think in your position I'd find a family lawyer and take some advice.

BlueSkiesLies · 09/08/2019 12:24

Seek advice from a good family court solicitor.

Probably you want to do something like having them with you and just at dads EOW for a period of time to establish the new norm - then go in for the CB

Mageton · 09/08/2019 12:24

I'd definitely involve your older child in this decision - you say he'd want to live with you full time anyhow. How about your younger son?

If it were me I'd try to go for a more 'usual' contact schedule - every other weekend and a night in the week. Then build it back up if your ex can sort his shit out.

I don't know how this works in terms of formal contact and changing it based on your decision alone - how open do you think your ex would be to this sort of thing?

Tonnerre · 09/08/2019 12:28

He can't get legal aid, it's only available for cases involving domestic violence. My understanding is that, if there is no court order, essentially you can simply tell him that you are changing the arrangements as it is not working in the boys' best interests and tell him what you are prepared to agree to in future - one day a week sounds sensible. If he kicks off you'll have to play it by ear but it doesn't sound like he'd get his act together to do much about it.

You will need to sort out the child benefit but that can come a bit later.

18YearsAMummy · 09/08/2019 12:28

YANBU

The only place you should let him see them is in a supervised contact centre!!

Poolrefusers · 09/08/2019 12:30

It sounds appalling and he sounds very much like my ex. I think men like this don't care too much about the kids at all. Not saying they don't love them after a fashion, but they are fundamentally selfish above all else.

If your eldest wants to live with you and ss have already been involved then it's a no-brainer. I think you should just let him know it's not working out and he will now be having them eow or whatever. think you would be UR not to.

If he is as much like my ex as he sounds he won't take you to court as a won't be arsed. He will probably whine and mention it but in the end he will be happy to have less responsibility and the scope to moan to all and sundry about how you have taken the kids from him. That won't matter a fig though if they have a better life with you.

Original poster
Fralla · 09/08/2019 12:33

Does he have any idea this could be coming or will it be a bolt from the blue?

I keep on at him about how he needs to start taking them to their football training (five minutes walk from his house), how he needs to make sure they shower and brush their teeth, about bedtimes and that he needs to feed them. But I think he thinks I'm just moaning, not that I will actually do anything about it.

OP posts:
Sleepsoon7 · 09/08/2019 12:34

If eldest would choose to live FT with you then that’s probably the way forward (if you can hopefully agree it) with both DCs visiting their Dad regularly and staying there by agreement. If you don’t need the child benefit then why not let him continue to receive that on the understanding that’s to help him finance their food etc. Personally I would be prepared to write the CB off in those circumstances if it meant I had my DCs safe and knowingly well cared for with me the majority of the time. Both DCs are at an age where the court (if involved) are likely to take their view in to account.

ohwhattodowithmylife · 09/08/2019 12:35

It's not about the parents rights it is about the child's rights.
I'm surprised that the paramedic situation did not trigger another referral to ss.
You need to see a solicitor and go to family court.
Good luck

Original poster
Fralla · 09/08/2019 12:35

Probably you want to do something like having them with you and just at dads EOW for a period of time to establish the new norm - then go in for the CB

The CB is not a big thing for me really, I can live without it. I borught it up as I think he should contribute to their uniforms, hair cuts and activities seeing as he receives it. It is also important as I think it is the only reason he wants to have the DC's, it entitles him to tax credits and housing benefits. If it wasn't for the benefits I don't think he'd want to have them at all.

OP posts:
Original poster
Fralla · 09/08/2019 12:37

I'd definitely involve your older child in this decision - you say he'd want to live with you full time anyhow. How about your younger son? The younger one loves playing PS4 and eating pizza every day. But he is starting to see that he actually gets to do things when he's with me.

OP posts:
Original poster
Fralla · 09/08/2019 12:37

I don't know how this works in terms of formal contact and changing it based on your decision alone - how open do you think your ex would be to this sort of thing?

Not very as he'd worry about losing benefits.

OP posts:
bibliomania · 09/08/2019 12:37

Yes, as there is no court order, you can just take them. However, if they choose to go back to his house anyway,, there won't be much you can do about it, especially for the 13-year old.

Personally, I'd do it, but I would check with the dcs that this is what they want.

Lonecatwithkitten · 09/08/2019 12:39

You need to focus on the big stuff:

Having to be coerced by paramedics for your DS to go to hospital.

Leaving 9 year old alone for hours and 9 year old was scared and distressed.

Lack of food.

Football training and who buys what are annoying, but could be described as parenting differences.

Separated parents social services expect one parent to step up against the other parent to protect the children. I am divorced and my ExH and his partner ( who has a DD) were not parenting well. I stepped up and prevented contact - it was horrid. The other parent of the partners DD did not and now she is in care. If you don't step up and protect the children you are seen as just as bad.

Original poster
Fralla · 09/08/2019 12:40

My understanding is that, if there is no court order, essentially you can simply tell him that you are changing the arrangements as it is not working in the boys' best interests and tell him what you are prepared to agree to in future - one day a week sounds sensible. If he kicks off you'll have to play it by ear but it doesn't sound like he'd get his act together to do much about it.

This is how I understand it to be too, pretty much what ss told me before they refused to get involved. But I might have a chat with a solicitor first.

OP posts:
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