AIBU to question if Brexiteers have any facts to back up their arguments?

[FarawayTreeFolk]

All I get from Brexiteers who believe in No Deal is that they think that "It will be alright!" Is they think everything will miraculously work out for the best.

No facts to offer, nothing. Nothing other than a religious style conviction that it will all be alright in the end.

Is that all they've got at their disposal to convince me that No Deal is a good idea?

pinkstripe what planet are you living on?

Supermarkets for instance in the Uk are a lot cheaper than many European countries

I think sadly, many people are conflating suffering due to Tory austerity policy with restrictions from the EU. This suited the Tory government to deflect blame somewhere else.

I can't think of a single problem or issue that people have complained about that has genuinely been due to EU policy or trade rules. The UK government has chosen to take us down the path that they have - people have suffered as a result. They're looking for someone to blame, and Boris et al just pointed at the scapegoat to deflect blame from themselves.

We spend a lot of time time in France, Spain and Italy and all the people in those countries that we have spoke to want their countries to leave the EU.

How is the UK poor? There are poorer people about to get poorer outside the EU and food prices are relatively low but about to rise.
How do you think food prices will go down and poverty reduce outside the EU and with the hardline Tories who hate the poor in charge? Such an irony that it is often the poor who vote for them.

@LauraKsWhiteCoat

As Remainders aren't trying to change the Status Quo, it is up to the Brexiteers to provide cast iron evidence that we are going to be better off outside the EU

I think this is quite demanding? Cast iron evidence. Not really questioning I don’t think.

@pinkstripeycat . And if they chose to they can. But they don't have the same issue as NI to address. So it will be relatively easy for them.

Jusaboutdone

pinkstripe what planet are you living on?

We have been travelling across Europe for many years and petrol and food is all so much cheaper in France and Spain. In the UK we have struggled to survive since the late 90s.

Can’t wait to leave so morons like you will shut your mouth when you realise you were wrong. What do you think will happen when we leave the EU? The UK won’t implode you know 😂. You really are funny

The UK won’t implode you know 😂. You really are funny

And why Uk will that be? And you call me a moron................

*what

I'm waiting for the blonde beast to tell us 'we are on a war footing', Churchill, beaches, blitz spirit and 'all pull together and we will WIN!' As we queue for bread and corned beef. Brexiters are going to have a lot to answer for so I expect they're all quite busy thinking up reasons why it will all be the fault of the EU and remainers

ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/Comparative_price_levels_for_food,_beverages_and_tobacco#Price_levels_for_food.2C_beverages_and_tobacco

I did not mention fuel!

UK will implode. There is already a Tory minister or candidate on record saying that england is better off without Scotland. Was in the paper today. It’s like the Tories are run by people on work experience week.

“Don’t start spouting about what the ‘experts’ are saying either. Unless they have a time machine, it’s not facts with them either.”
Am passionate about defending facts and expertise still exist (not least because I don’t fancy telling our children facts don’t exist)
Many things can’t be known pre leaving but here are some actual facts:

• we all lose our rights to work visa free in 27 countries
• the pound has lost significant value already directly affecting holiday spending money and in time affecting cost of imports (economic fact)
• following the law in France on EU and wto rules means traffic through ports will slow. You can argue with all the logistics experts

And say won’t make a difference (just as you might argue with your surgeon and tell him you don’t believe what he tells you about after effects of surgery but he is more likely to be right). For my organisation this means significant risk to a time sensitive project being imported. (Also a fact)

And expertise - but to be fair not fact:
deep experts all say good Friday agreement puts NI peace at Risk

I think the quote is “ you have a right to your own views but not your own facts”
Those who voted brexit - May be private but above is factual reality

voted remain but would now support no deal”

Hmm. Do you really think that's real?

@pinkstripeycat we can leave without messing with GFA . It's just that Ultras don't want to. And unless you are a reasonable person who wishes to Brexit in a way that doesn't mess with GFA, you are a No Deal Ultra. And all that follows is on you. If it's great, that's on you. If it's shit, that's on you too.

I think this is quite demanding? Cast iron evidence. Not really questioning I don’t think.

True, but the original OP didn't demand evidence. I agree with OP that it is up to Brexiteers to provide evidence that their decision is a good one. The government should be leading this. They have repeatedly failed to do so. Lies on a bus don't count.

I didn’t realise we were only allowed to respond to the OPs original statement and not subsequent comments

And brexiteers don’t owe anyone an explanation, facts, or otherwise.

The population were given a vote. We have the result. We’re leaving. End of.

Let’s focus on what we’re actually going to do. Not rehash why people voted in the first place. They’re not redoing the vote.

But that’s what people are asking. WHAT is the PLAN?

It is up to the Brexiteers to provide cast iron evidence that we are going to be better off outside the EU.

Hate to break this to you OP but that ship has sailed, in case you hadn't copped on, we're leaving the EU, one way or another......

FFS Antibrexit thread no. 4838374727383.4

The facts the people who voted leave went by is the fact that zero is getting better for them and all they see and experience is things getting worse...Real life experience...perhaps many in a more privileged position struggle to comprehend anything but a nice comfortable life but it's not all like that. This was a vote against decades of establishment arrogance and ignorance.

Yes I agree. What’s the plan to ensure leaving is a smooth transition?

VikVal things are about to get a lot worse for the poor. Way to go to leave the EU and put the right wingers in charge!

constantly I thought like you just after the vote in 2016.

I voted for Remain but thought ok we just need to make the best out of this.

I placed a bit of faith in the Government, Brexiteers etc thinking surely they know why they are doing. They must know where we need to go and how we get there.

I was naive and stupid. Over time it has become clear that there never has been a plan.

I never though TM’s Deal was that good but it was far proferable to this shit show.

I am not necessarily against us leaving the EU now but the way we are doing it is completely and utterly undemocratic. There is absolutely no mandate for no deal as that was never mentioned in 2016 - and that has been fact checked.

What I want (and I know it is never going to happen) is to revoke, take stock get a proper plan together that has a consensus amongst leavers and then take it from there.

If it’s a good enough plan and would be agreed by the EU then i would support it.

Maybe if more if more of our MP’s had been doing their jobs better and been aware how desperate people were for change this wouldn’t have happened

But yes why not blame those who are desperate and poor who have been let down by consecutive governments time and time again

Mmm a proud liberal lefty are you LatteLove ?

FarawayTreeFolk
As Remainders aren't trying to change the Status Quo

You do know that the "status quo" is changing and continues to change as we sign up to more treaties etc?