Why do so many people distrust socialism?

[malificent7]

Is it due to the legacy of Marx, the notion that it's a race to the bottom, the feeling that those who work harder should get paid more or a mistrust of human nature?
I do understand these concerns but what is more worrying if the vast inequality that seems to prevail nowadays. Thoughts please.

A: "I'm a bit distrustful of socialism, as it always seems to go badly when it's tried"

B: "What are you talking about? Socialism just means having things like child labour laws and public funded services like schools and roads"

A: "Oh, that doesn't seem so bad then"

B: "Glad I could clear it up for you. Now, let me tell you about my plans for 100% inheritance task and abolishing private healthcare..."

One person suggested 100 percent tax.

Shall we talk about the capitalists who talked about sterilizing the poor like Keith Joseph?

That is a very big leap of faith to ask people to make, especially people who have already experienced the lack of understanding, care and compassion often found within state services.
I wonder if you would have the nerve to say to someone’s face give all your money and trust your child will be cared for after your death. I’d hope not. It would make you a pretty awful person, wouldn’t it?

The one person who suggested 100 percent inheritence tax also sais that it would mean all would be taken care of.

My God, how gullible can socialists be! What happens once the government has confiscated all your money and then fails to ensure that “all is taken care of”, eh? Dictators live for people so blindly trusting of authority.

I want to see everyone have access to education, health care and support if they become sick, disabled or unemployed. Is that socialism? I don’t care, I think it is the hallmark of a decent modern society. Most benefits are being paid to people in work, not out of work. We’re paying to subsidise stingy employers who won’t pay a living wage.

It’s an appalling suggestion to make, cendrillin, and demonstrates the nastiness at the heart of socialism.

sionnachbeag

Karl Marx wrote ‘The Communist Manifesto’ which was adopted by Lennin and is the blueprint for global communism. What you’re saying is garbage.

You feel comfortable with a self declared Marxist who celebrated the gfc as he thought it ended the capitalism that has improved the lives of billions, as our shadow chancelor of the exchequer, as you feel protected by the Labour Party machine that is infested by the hard left Momentum group who he is the figurehead of. Good luck with that.

Read up on The proposed land value tax that would see ordinary people taxed out of existence

Incredible ignorance in your attempt at a patronising post.

I wonder if OP is working for the new PM.....just dropped this in to start a discussion that would make even the more socialist among us start to panic about Labour getting in

Read up on life in communist Russia and if you don’t like it vote Conservative is my advice.

This is without question the stupidest thing I have ever read in many years on Mumsnet - and that's saying something.

The communist manifesto was written by Marx and Engels. If we are talking abkut Marxism it tends to be based on Das Kapital which was mostly about capitalism. No communist state has ever really been Maxist.

The land value tax? Almost every other country has one. It would be considered by the Labour party as a replacement for council tax. It wouldn't tax people out of existence.

You talk utter rubbish.

Capitalism that has improve the lives of billions? Hahahah name me one fully capitalist coubtry? Come on.

As the parent of a child who will probably not be fully independent in adulthood, the idea of 100% inheritance tax makes me very unhappy.

I'm in the same boat and I know extreme capitalism will leave our children screwed. Think about inflation and that inheritance will be worthless when it comes to full time care for your child for the rest of his/her life. What will take care of that child is the socialist safety net of society which means that there will be social workers assigned to fill out needed forms, an allocated place to live, and long term healthcare until he/she dies. In America, your inheritance probably wouldn't even last a year of his life if it all had to be paid out of pocket.

You haven’t answered my question, sion. Would you say to the parent of a child with SN which meant they wouldn’t be independent as an adult, accept 100% inheritance tax, make no provision for your child, and trust strangers to provide?

TheBigBallOfOil

A SN child will be far better off in Scandinavia than the US. You are overestimating your financial capabilities to take care of a SN child without any help from society.

I never suggested 100 percent inheritence tax.

And ginger is correct.

I am not saying there should be no help from society. I am saying that parents with the ability to make some provision to support their child after their death should not be deprived of the means of doing so. That is inhuman.

I do not agree that ginger is correct, at least not in my sons circumstances, of which she knows nothing. And I should not have the right to make my own decisions and provision taken from me.
What’s the answer to my question, sion?

And Labour have plans to excessively tax property and make inheritance impossible. Sounds very much like an attack on private ownership.

This was off the bbc website it doesnt seem to be in there

Key policies

Scrap student tuition fees

Nationalisation of England's nine water companies.

Re-introduce the 50p rate of tax on the highest earners (above £123,000)

Income tax rate 45p on £80,000 and above

More free childcare, expanding free provisions for two, three and four year olds

Guarantee triple lock for pensioner incomes

End to zero hours contracts

Hire 10,000 new police officers, 3,000 new firefighters

Moves to charge companies a levy on salaries above £330,000

Deliver rail electrification "including in Wales and the South West".

That’s my business. And your question is inappropriately aggressive. Again, the lack of humanity is striking. You are proving all my points admirably.
The point is, it should remain my business. The state should not have the right to take control of my assets and child’s future after my death.

I am not saying there should be no help from society. I am saying that parents with the ability to make some provision to support their child after their death should not be deprived of the means of doing so. That is inhuman.

Arguing against socialism in all forms is saying there should be no help from society. I may not know you but I know even the most basic assistance for SN has a cost that you are seriously underestimating if there is no help from society for it. The inheritance you want to leave behind wouldn't accomplish pretty much anything without society there to help you. When you argue against socialism, you rob those services that will be responsible for your child's care.

I'm no communist but capitalism is based on a model of growth. More consumers spending more on ever more products and services.
We have ruined our own planet for this. There must be a better way.

I have not said that, ginger. You are attacking arguments I haven’t made.

My question is aggressive? No its accurate.If you are going to rely on the state fir some care or support its only right that you pay some tax. It should remain your business when you want it to but the state provides a saftey net too?

The lack of humanity?I support all peiple being taken care of when in need,

This is without question the stupidest thing I have ever read in many years on Mumsnet - and that's saying something

Sorry but when you have a self declared Marxist appearing under posters of Stalin and Mao, I think your comment is the stupid one

Cendrillion

Do you pay for your own police force? Fire service? Roads? The people who you come into contact with who use/have used the state education system, NHS did you pay for them to be educated and kept healthy?

If the answer is no then you currently benefit from socialism

It always suprises me that those who detest socialism (and lets be honest if you cant distinquish between democratic socialism and communisn you're very a bit thick) seem to be fine for socialismfor the wealthy, bank bail outs, charitable status of private school fees, tax credits which allow corparations to pay poverty wages knowing the government will top it up

Nothing worse than right wing ignorance and disinformation blanketed in a veneer of hysteria and faux concern