AIBU not to let my Mum hold my baby?

[DanaScully83]

My DS is 6 weeks old and my Mum has travelled a long way to stay with us for 1 week. This was a lovely surprise and I am very grateful that she made the long journey. However, she is a heavy smoker. Although she goes outside to smoke her and clothes smell very strongly of smoke - so I have not let her hold my DS. Whenever she goes to pick him up I intervene and say he needs a feed or a nappy change. AIBU and does anyone have advice on how to handle this without unnecessarily upsetting her?

There are probably equally as much, if not more, pollutants on clothes from just going outside.

I grew up in a house where people smoked and both me and my brother have asthma, mine serious. My mother quit after the doctor told her in his opinion she directly contributed to it and this was back in the 90s. Anecdotal evidence doesn't match up to the scientific evidence that says people should be changing tops, washing hands and waiting for an hour to hold babies.

My grandcha died a long horrible death from lung cancer, my uncle has COPD. I have no tolerance for people smoking around children. I would just explain the health visitor comments to your mum and then she can put advice into practice. I am sure she would rather do that and have a cuddle

Ask her wear clean clothes, then she can hold the baby. Some people stink more than others from smoking, I don't know why, maybe quantity. I didn't mind DBIL holding DS even when he was small and he's a smoker, but he washed his hands and doesn't smell. Thankfully he vapes now so it's not an issue any more.

I do understand it is hard to stand up to older family members, especially ones that may have been used to being the matriarch/patriarch...

I do sometimes have the slight suspicion, though, that all this “brush your teeth and put your smoking out outside” stuff is a manifestation of the desire to be the “new” mum, the person in charge - to some extent, with some people, it can be a bit of a power trip to have the parent-child dynamic reversed.

*coat

@DanaScully83

It is disgusting. That person, in my opinion, should be made to feel disgusted with themselves for having a smoking habit.

My Dp smokes it vile. He’s made to wash before he goes near our children, to carry hand gel everywhere, only smoke outside and wear a jacket.
If I had it my way he’d shower every time and change clothes.

'mere exposure doesn't guarantee harm'

Driving with children not in a car seat doesn't guarantee injury, even if there were an accident. It makes a bad outcome a lot more likely.

Exposure to smoke makes SIDS a lot more likely. The increase in risk/odds varies with the type and quantity of exposure, but given that the mechanisms of SIDS are largely unknown and it affects babies who have none of the risk factors, it makes perfect sense to eliminate as much exposure to a known risk factor as possible. Or, put differently, that child's right to be exposed to as few risk factors as possible outweighs relatives' desire to have their noxious, anachronistic habit pandered to. IMO.

'all this “brush your teeth and put your smoking out outside” stuff is a manifestation of the desire to be the “new” mum, the person in charge'

I wish I hadn't had to make stipulations to protect my children from relatives' smoke. But even if this were so, the numbers of threads on here about mothers and MILs who seem to need to still be top dog suggests that may not be such a bad thing in all cases.

Quite apart from the immediate health risks of exposing the baby to toxic chemicals, there is the psychological risk. Children of smokers are more likely to become smokers themselves as adults - because they associate the stink of cigarettes with being cuddled and loved, it smells familiar and has comforting associations with childhood. They also reason that it can’t be such a bad habit “because Granny does it”, which normalises addiction.
50% of smokers will die as a direct result of their habit - we should be doing everything possible to dissuade the next generation from ever starting it.

'there are no recorded instances, case studies, research showing any human has ever suffered harm from "third hand smoke"'

Historically it has been hard, because of the prevalence of smoking and where it was done, to separate exposure to second-hand smoke from exposure to third-hand smoke. As the number of years elapsing since the smoking ban in indoor public spaces/since the general change to people who smoke doing it outside and not in their homes increases, it will be easier to measure this effect and it wouldn't surprise me for a second if third-hand smoke proved harmful.

'Public health wonks' need to pass on public health messages, not all of which are palatable to the recipients. Tbh i don't believe smoking and being a parent are compatible, at all.

When I trained as a maternity nurse we we told that smokers should avoid holding the baby for an hour (even after a shower/change of clothes) because they're still breathing out carbon monoxide.

'When I trained as a maternity nurse we we told that smokers should avoid holding the baby for an hour (even after a shower/change of clothes) because they're still breathing out carbon monoxide.'

This is also part of why co-sleeping (as in bedsharing) is an absolute no-no if you're a smoker. Even if you don't smoke in the bedroom, go to bed showered and with clean pyjamas on, etc. I'm not sure the whole showering/clothes-changing removes the root of the problem (although obviously it is less bad than not doing it). It's not just about the smell.

I wish I hadn't had to make stipulations to protect my children from relatives' smoke. But even if this were so, the numbers of threads on here about mothers and MILs who seem to need to still be top dog suggests that may not be such a bad thing in all cases.

I don’t need to be top dog. I don’t smoke. I am not a mother in law or a grandparent. That doesn’t mean I am going to let someone talk down to me and treat me like a child. If they want to keep their child away from me for whatever reason, they can. But I will brush my teeth when I like.

'If they want to keep their child away from me for whatever reason, they can. But I will brush my teeth when I like.'

And that would be fine by me, but then you wouldn't be holding my child and I wouldn't be entertaining any suggestion of you being hard done by because of it. :)

(Obviously meaning the hypothetical smoker 'you')

And that would be fine by me, but then you wouldn't be holding my child and I wouldn't be entertaining any suggestion of you being hard done by because of it.

Which would be your call. It’s just a line I am not willing to have crossed - I don’t think adults should speak to one another in some of the ways described here.

@herculepoirot2 you are spectacularly missing the point. No one is telling you what you must do, they are telling you what you need to do if you want to spend time cuddling their baby so they can keep their baby as safe as possible. What you choose to do with that information is up to you.

It is not about being spoken 'down to' you are being asked to step up and play your part in keeping a baby safe by protecting it from harmful cigarette smoke or to stay away. What you did next would show what your own priorities are.

No one is telling you what you must do, they are telling you what you need to do if you want to spend time cuddling their baby so they can keep their baby as safe as possible.

I know that.

What you choose to do with that information is up to you.

But you can bet that if I chose to say, “Do you know what, it’s okay, I’ll see you when I see you,” people would have a problem with that. There is judgement here.

It is not about being spoken 'down to' you are being asked to step up and play your part in keeping a baby safe by protecting it from harmful cigarette smoke or to stay away.

Step up from where? My lowly position? That IS talking down.

What you did next would show what your own priorities are.

And there we are. It is the belief of many own this thread that they should be able to dictate to their relatives, not just offer them a reasonable choice.

Explain about the risk of sids and second hand smoke and that you are just looking out for your LO. Tell her that she can hold him only when she has just showered and is wearing clean clothes before she has a cigarette for the day. She should be happy to agree if she wants a cuddle with her grandson.

Tell her that she can hold him only when she has just showered and is wearing clean clothes before she has a cigarette for the day. She should be happy to agree if she wants a cuddle with her grandson

I would just say, “That’s okay, love.” Honestly, what a way to suggest speaking to a grown woman!

@Blue2309 Although not very pleasant, a top smelling of smoke isn't going to harm anyone.
WRONG. Read up on latest info please.

@herculepoirot2 well, smoking IS disgusting and dirty, especially around a new baby so meh, if she can't take that news then yes stay at home.

GreigLaidlawsbarofsoap

There is a difference between having that opinion and treating people like they are disgusting and dirty - people you not only are meant to love, but who you expect to love your baby so much that they would be happy to be spoken to like shit in order to have the very great honour of picking it up.

And frankly, I wouldn’t darken the door of someone who made it clear they thought I was disgusting and dirty. I have better things to do.

@herculepoirot2

So, you're in the OP's position.

What, if anything, would you do?

Nanny0gg

Nobody smokes in my house, so my relatives would go outside and wash hands before picking up the baby anyway. If that wasn’t happening, I would stop visiting and inviting after dropping a few hints. There would be no rules, special coats, enforced tooth brushing, times of the day they were “allowed” to do this or that. My parents and other relatives aren’t children. Nor do I assume they have a desperate desire for “cuddles” with my children. My child is lucky to have grandparents in their lives and I would and do treat them with respect.