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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Very difficult situation DP v DBro. AIBU for DBro to charge DP rent?

321 replies

Jetsetterf · 08/07/2019 21:09

I'm buying a flat in joint names with DBro. DBro is putting money into the flat as an investment but the flat is being bought for me to live in.

The flat is in a different city to where DP currently lives. I've previously said to DP if he moves in I wouldn't charge him rent. DP has applied for a job in the city where the flat is.

I wouldn't charge DP rent on my share but would DBro be unreasonable to charge DP a reduced rate of rent on his share?

DP is now angry at me because I didn't tell him he may have to pay rent on DBro's share and he said he wouldn't have applied for the job in the city the flat is in if he had known. I said I wouldn't charge him rent, but I have no control over DBro's share and surely he is being unreasonable to expect DBro to let him live there rent free?

OP posts:
Soontobe60 · 08/07/2019 22:23

I think you need to speak to an accountant.
I assume you're both paying half of the loan to your parents for their share of the deposit? (Unless they have gifted you that money). If it's being paid back, you and your brother owe £25.5k to them, plus an £83k mortgage. How you pay back this is between yourself and whoever gave you the deposit. It's nothing to do with the house.
Your DH paid an additional £1k, so pay him rent to the value of £500 and you will have paid equal amounts. The stop paying him rent!
Then split the cost of the mortgage which by your reckoning is £260, so £130 each. Charge boyfriend £200 and split this equally between you and Db.
If in 3 years you sell, you then need to split any equity equally, pay back your share of the deposit loan from this amount and whatever is left is profit to go towards another property.

saraclara · 08/07/2019 22:24

If you're paying all of the mortgage, how come your brother feels entitled to collect rent from your bf?

Hahaha88 · 08/07/2019 22:25

What @Soontobe60 said

HollowTalk · 08/07/2019 22:25

This is a repeat thread, isn't it? I remember the previous one went the same way.

Atalune · 08/07/2019 22:25

Who is repaying the loans?? Are they separate from the mortgage??

From your sums-

£130 each! Maybe you £150 and him £110. Given you’ll be paying all the bills and living in and caring for the house.

Your brother is behaving abominably and I would NOT BUY A HOUSE WITH HIM.

Derbee · 08/07/2019 22:26

NRTFT but the situation with your brother and the flat isn’t clear to me

If he has invested money to make a gain on the capital appreciation when you sell, your DP moving in should have no affect on anything. Presumably you would pay the mortgage, and decide what DP pays towards bills etc

If he has invested and is expecting monthly rent, was the rent coming from you, or would you be expected to have a housemate to meet the rent that you DB is expecting? Surely you would then decide on your living arrangements, pay whatever rent your brother expects, and decide what you charge your DP towards bills etc

I don’t understand why your DP would ever be expected to pay anything towards your brother?

I would never expect a partner to pay towards my mortgage. Bills etc are different.

almostn9ne · 08/07/2019 22:26

I will let someone else do your maths since I am shit at maths. BUT. With those numbers, your other option (if such houses exist in your area) is to half those loans from family members and add to your savings...

Loan: £30,000 = £15,000
Another loan: £21,000 = £10,500
Jetsetterf: £4,000

And get a house on your own with a £29,500 deposit.

Original poster
Jetsetterf · 08/07/2019 22:27

@Atalune I'm a very poor solicitor so it actually works out I only make a tiny bit more than DP

OP posts:
Burpsandrustles · 08/07/2019 22:27

Only read to page one.

Your db is making money he wouldn't have got out of your bf. However we don't know what he was expecting to pay ie bills, fun stuff... Save for yiu both to buy some where..

Troels · 08/07/2019 22:28

60k deposit. 5k from bro, 4k from me, rest is a loan from parents/grandparents.

Why don't you just make a payment plan to pay him back his 5k?
Or have the parents loaned both of you the money for the down payment?
How is that being paid back?

DP is a total CF to think he can live for free in a house you co own. It's also a big red flag him actually wanting to live for free.

Atalune · 08/07/2019 22:28

jet but you’re earning potential is only going to rise, and quite substantially too.

You need to get proper financial advice as this is a hot mes.

NotStayingIn · 08/07/2019 22:28

Not sure this is completely adding up. I think you need to take a step back and really look at the sums again. But as for this:

He doesn't want to pay rent anywhere because he doesn't want to pay towards anyone's mortgage

Tell him to grow the fuck up. I wouldn’t let him live with me rent free in a million years; you are so being had here.

HeadsDownThumbsUpEveryone · 08/07/2019 22:30

I'm just baffled you would get into such an arrangement without taking legal advice!

HairyDogsInUnusualPlaces · 08/07/2019 22:34

If I've understood it, the 'half the rent' amount was that the db thinks that renting his half would have a rental cost of £350 pcm. So half the mortgage (£130) plus this £350 would be £480.

So if op paid half the mortgage, db could rent his half out for £350, pay of his half of the mortgage (£130) and still make money.

underthebridgedowntown · 08/07/2019 22:37

I think your brother's being cheeky - if he wanted a BTL he should have got a BTL, and all the extra expense that goes with it. All he's done is put in £5k, will be sharing paying off (interest free?) loans to family, will have zero hassle but seems to be expecting to profit from you.

The DP issue - I'd be annoyed with you too. You said rent free, so he thought you meant rent free, and considering he's saving for his own deposit it's understandable he wants that (and has that where he's currently living). His priority right now is saving, not living with you OP - up to you how you want to handle that one... He is overreacting though - all he has to do is not go through with the interview and stay where he is.

Your main priority here is to sort out the finances with your brother, and get some impartial advice (any solicitor colleagues who could help?)

Burpsandrustles · 08/07/2019 22:37

So he's saving for his own place. When he has it, is he expecting you to pay rent or bills or what?

cstaff · 08/07/2019 22:39

Your do is a CF so tell him to stay at home with mummy.

I would be more concerned about how your brother is ripping you off. Talk to a broker and come to an agreement. He is making money off a 5k deposit and no mortgage payments and charging you extra. There is something wrong with what you have set out above.

RB68 · 08/07/2019 22:40

his reaction is a bit OTT - I mean all he has done is applied for a job - hasn't even got a job yet and who the hell can live entirely for free anywhere these days - if he is so happy to scav off you I think I would let him go to be honest

Original poster
Jetsetterf · 08/07/2019 22:40

Sorry everyone, I'm confusing myself here too. DBro and I are paying the loans back equally.

On the rental market, the flat would get £700 pcm. So DBro would make £350 pcm if it was rented out. Hence, it's been provisionally decided I shall pay the £260 mortgage in its entirety for the amount of time I live in the property and £350 as the share of the rent DBro would earn

OP posts:
Durgasarrow · 08/07/2019 22:41

This whole situation makes no sense. Why are you buying this property with your brother when you expect to marry another man? That's a mess. Also, I can understand why the boyfriend might not pay a full half of the mortgage, but everyone pays rent. As a grown-up in his parents' home he should pay rent.

HeddaGarbled · 08/07/2019 22:41

Yes, I think I remember the last one too. Weren’t you getting a first-time buyers’ loan with a view to fulfilling the minimum residency and then letting it out? And that thread was about how to divvy things up fairly between your brother and you.

Now we have a potential live-in boyfriend to further muddy the waters. Who is saving up for his own place? So no intention of the two of you getting your own place together, then?

Step back from all this muddle and have a good hard think about what you want. Not what your brother wants, not what your boyfriend wants, not what your family think you should do.

Do you want to live with your boyfriend? Do you want your finances to be entangled with your brother for a long time to come?

What happens if you and your boyfriend (or another boyfriend) want to buy somewhere together in the future but your brother won’t agree to sell or buy you out?

Atalune · 08/07/2019 22:42

But he’s not renting it out!

He’s putting in £5k!

Honestly please- give your head a wobble.

NoLeopard · 08/07/2019 22:43

I understand you paying half the market rent but why the whole mortgage?

Atalune · 08/07/2019 22:43

DO NOT BUY A HOUSE WITH YOUR BROTHER.

Burpsandrustles · 08/07/2019 22:43

Maybe he intends to let op live rent free in New home and thought this would get him ahead with it? Now he's taken back because his money is going to ops brother instead of into pot for 'them'.

He took or applied for the job to be near her?

I wouldn't barge in yet with the cheeky fucker comments.

Op... Sound all this out, be cynical... Test waters and get to the bottom of it.

I'm not sure id want to pay dh sister mortgage if I was intending to save all my salary bar bills for 'us' for our future....

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