Very large lady next to me at theatre

[redbedheadd]

Went to theatre today and the lady next to me was so large I was left with no space at all. My legs were aching by the end as they were pushed together and I couldn't move at all. She kept repeatedly elbowing and jostling me without an apology.

AIBU to be irritated?

Zonkin as a society we are all subsidising others and vice versa. The rich pay more taxes and NI but may use private healthcare. The taxes of the childfree are going on schools and playgrounds. Some people are living to 100 and needing 20 years of complex care and healthcare. Some people are profoundly intellectually disabled and need others taxes.

And the tall person blocks my view.

It is give and take, with kindness.

Difference is though that you can tap on a shoulder of the tall person and tell them you can't see and if they would mind leaning towards one side while you lean towards the other side.
You will not be called a tallist, heartless etc.
I did it once and few times different tall people actually asked if I see ok so we sorted it if not🤷‍♀️
There was 1 prick, but he would be a prick even if short.... Pricks are everywhere.

No one got upset (exce0t the prick). No one was called a bully or mean or selfish.

I'm not quite clear on what taxes and the concept of society has do with being overweight?

You can call being overweight a condition and say it's not a choice. Most conditions/illnesses are treatable. You are choosing not to treat it. If you want to eat drink etc and get pleasure from that, I don't have a problem with it. But at least be honest about it.

zonkin How are people who are obese choosing not to receive treatment? I really don't see that to be the case at all. Most people in the morbidly obese category are begging to be treated surgically - it isn't them that is dodging treatment, its the NHS. Which, given the cost of the surgery versus the cost of the lifelong treatment of obesity is bonkers.

Maybe that is what zonkin meant...but that isn't treating the problem is it? The problem is typically that people feel hungry when they don't need calories. Eating less makes this problem worse (obviously) which is why telling people who are morbidly obese to eat less has a 1 in 1000 success rate as a 'treatment' or 0.1% success to put it another way.

Bariatric surgery on the other hand has a very high success rate, with around 93% losing 50% of their weight or more. This isn't surprising because it has been shown to rewire the hormone system of the gut and actually profoundly affect the hunger response in patients, hence leading to a long term cure for the actual problem driving excess consumption of food.

Or in other words, bariatric surgery actually IS a treatment, while nagging people while ignoring their actual issue IS NOT a treatment.

I'm not talking about bariatric surgery. Bariatric surgery doesn't address whatever condition is causing you to overeat. The longer term figures for the outcome of bariatric surgery are not actually very impressive. The surgery is a tool not a miracle cure and you have to change your mind set for it to be successful in the long term. It's not very difficult to cheat the surgical procedure.

The criteria for having the surgery is very strict. The NHS won't fund most cases. It will always be the case given the state that the NHS is in. Unless the funding model is changed the end of the NHS as we know it is inevitable. But that's a whole other conversation.

I don't agree that seriously overweight people are always hungry. They are deluding themselves. If you are hungry have a banana, whatever. Is that packet of crisps really going to fill you up? Of course not. Are those sweets going to fuel your body properly and make it stop being hungry? No. And hunger in itself isn't a reason to eat. It is okay to be hungry.

If your heart could talk it would thank you for making some sensible choices. The human body is an amazing thing. Don't abuse it.

Zonkin, are you really saying that the cure for obesity is to have a banana instead of a bag of crisps? I don't even know where to start with that statement, but surely the problem goes deeper than merely 'choosing' a banana over a bag of crisps, or sweets. Most overweight people know, at an intellectual level, that they are consuming too many calories, but it isn't as simple as just 'choosing' a banana, otherwise, I'm sure they'd all do it.

For all the people convinced that being fat is just a matter of poor self control and that it really is just calories in-calories out - as I once did, became it’s just logical, isn’t it? - i’d really recommend Why we get fat and what to do about it by Gary Taubes. Complete eye opener.

I am not sure if having gastric surgery available easily would be a good thing long term.
I would worry it would make some people think there is an "easy" cure and so there would be people who just wouldn't care because they can have a surgery. IYKWIM.

The reason why it's not easy to get it is because there needs to be lifestyle change. I had a friend when younger who got it and she put weight back within 5 years. She did eat much less obviously, at the beginning, but her old habbits resurfaced pretty quickly.

I do think that development of a GOOD lifestyle change programme with ongoing support could be a better option for majority of people. As well because they then take it home with them and if the adult in a house has healthy lifestyle, so do the children hence it would also be a prevention for future.
They do try though. You can get funded gym (costs you like a pound or so) with a trainer support through the gp, dietitian etc.

Imagine a year long programme combining bits of therapy, group sessions, gym and advice of dietitian could do so much more good IMHO than a surgery can. Like meeting once a forthnight or smth. Utilise SM and have the group on private SM share their food and tips. Being in it together thing helps.
But I guess surgeries would be cheaper?

Nin I think that's an excellent idea, a year long holistic programme. When someone has reached the morbidly obsessed stage they need support, counselling, retraining. I'm sure it must be a sad and lonely condition to have.

Personally I think it is the flip side of anorexia nervosa. It defies logic.

Where is the give and take here?

The give and take is that although the fat lady took up your seat, she is a lawyer ( hypothetically) and her taxes pay for your long term care when you ( hypothetically) get run over on your way home from the theatre

@DogHairEverywhere - I didn't say it was a cure for obesity. But eating the crisps and sweets and not stopping eating when you are full will make it worse. Your choice but you know that there are consequences.

Tackle why you overeat. Take some responsibility. Everyone knows the facts. Carrying on with the junk food isn't the answer.

As I have previously said, I don't mind that people overeat at all. It's their decision.

@nakedscientist The give and take thing about the fat person taking up half my seat because she is a lawyer and her taxes might pay for my care are ridiculous. We all pay taxes. Just because we might earn more and be a higher rate tax payer doesn't give us privilege over others. How arrogant.

Both people in the theatre paid for a ticket for their seat. They are both entitled to their seat. How much one earns is not a factor. The higher earner/tax payer doesn't get to have half your seat. Why would you even consider that sort of entitlement?

zonkin

Where is the give and take here?

We live in a liberal democracy where give and take means that in the course of our lifetimes, if we are in need, we can take from the 'pot' as it were.

We don't know which person pays more taxes than us, there will be someone, but we do have to accept that there will be give and take on balance in our lives, not tit for tat in each encounter. I was describing an entirely hypothetical situation to try to help you understand give and take.

I do think that the media has something to answer for. All these makeover programmes choose unfortunate individuals who clearly eat aberrant diets. These people are more easily fixable. .However, as has been pointed out by pp, most obesity is not so easily fixed due to the complex aetiology of the condition.

As I have said before, obesity is not one thing, it is a constellation of related conditions with a similar outcome.

Or put another way;, being fat is not a morally reprehensible expression of sinful gluttony, it is a medical condition.

I think obesity is in most cases more like alcoholism rather than anorexia. In anorexia people see themselves differently than how they really look ime.
This is different.

You know it's bad for you to eat a lot, but you still do it. You have issues and eating is your release and happy time. Same like with alcohol and alcoholics. That's why I don't think surgery is by far the best solution but programme (like rehabs) woud be better.

I also do think that it should be treated similarly by the public. We can talk about alcoholism, and feel free to say that an alcoholic slumped partiality into our seat ruined our experience. People should be able to say the same about someone obese taking part of their seat. Or someone slim slumped the way they take their seat.

And because alcoholism and even drug addiction are talked about there are more initiatives to help and more organisations to help. Can you imagine reaction to ads on bus stops which would be warning about overeating with link to gov website or local charity (if there are some, there would be if obesity was openly talked about) same way like they warn about too much drinking with the link to gov website?

Cushioning (if that's the right word) obesity so it's not talked about does no good as well as being nasty about it. And by nasty I mean nasty, not politely complaining about something.

We all pay tax and give our tacit consent to be included in society. Some of us are fortunate enough to not need to dip in the pot much, some of us need more. We all agree on that. If we don't then we can opt out of the system and go and live in a cave somewhere.

But both people entered into a private contract with the theatre vendor for their seat. They both paid the same price. It's got absolutely nothing to do with tax/society. Or give and take. One ticket = one seat.

If an overweight person doesn't want to tackle the issue, I don't mind. It is your right and your choice. I really don't care. It's your body. I also don't mind that your obesity requires more NHS costs in the long run. Lots of lifestyle choices cost the NHS more (eg dangerous sports). I agree to live in society and pay my taxes and if some people cost more than others, that's the way it goes.

But after working hard, paying my taxes, and saving up for an expensive theatre seat out of my nett earnings I really don't need to give and take my seat because it is mine and I paid for it with my private personal resources. I don't have to share those with you. I paid for a full seat. When I booked and paid for the ticket, it was on the agreement that I would have a full seat.

My choice was to save up for the seat and enjoy the show. Sure, we'd all love a bigger seat, more legroom whatever. If I want that, then I pay for the more expensive seat. Theatre tickets, airline tickets, whatever, are absolutely nothing to do with tax and society.

Nobody makes anyone go to the shop, to buy the cookies and then forces them to eat it. One chooses to do so. The cookies don't satisfy hunger.

Obesity is not a choice.

Absolutely, naked, Obesity is not a choice

If it's not about diet then why are there so many fat people in Greggs/McDonald's and so few in the gym? 🤔

I used to be obese and I chose to do something about it. It took me years but I got there and am still in good shape eight years later.

I actually had an undiagnosed hormonal problem for years which potentially slowed my metabolism but I still managed to lose most of my weight - doctor said they estimate hormonal issues to account for approx 5% of obesity cases.

Aaarrrrggggghhhhhhhhh FUCK OFF!!!!!!!!!!!!

(Not at you Bjorn)

@nakedscientist as I said, nobody is forcing anyone to spend their money on junk food. You're not being marched down to the shops and then force fed.

You are choosing to eat when not hungry. Your body isn't asking you to eat non fuel food. Quite the opposite. Food tastes good and gives pleasure. I get that. It is fine to choose that pleasure. But not at the sacrifice of my pleasure. What makes the overweight person at the theatre more important than the non overweight one?

Ha, no worries.

I didn't mean to come across so pompously but it's something I'm very passionate about. I think most people (even slim) underestimate quite how hard it is to attain a 'good' physique whilst balancing the rest of one's existence. It's a constant struggle for me to get down the gym 3x a week and track my calories but I wasted the entirety of my 20s with no self esteem and it impacted by career, love life, friendships, etc. Every aspect of my existence.