AIBU to think this is absolute rubbish - bullying at work

[artichokehearts]

I am sorry but I am really gobsmacked at this article in the Daily Fail today. I have only ever been bullied at work once - and that was by a man. I can't be that untypical surely? The women I've worked with have all been perfectly normal and generally nice.
www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-7108281/Woman-reveals-shocking-toxic-femininity-shes-experienced-work.html

I’ve been bullied by women , so badly that I had a slow , painful breakdown and had to leave. At BT as well who promote themselves as being leading edge with structure and employee relations. Thankfully I went on to have a fantastic role elsewhere.

Definitely women for me, although at times I didn’t even realise it was bullying until afterwards. I certainly wouldn’t tolerate some of the behaviours I experienced in the past now. Some people are just so full of their own self - importance & get off on the power.

I have experienced bullying in all except two of my teaching posts. More women than men, but then teaching is a predominantly female job.

I was very badly bullied for 18 months in my last job by 2 senior women. They belittled me and knocked my confidence so hard that I would talk to my Line Manager about things that had happened, and almost make excuses for them; i.e. "X happened and Janet said Y, but perhaps I'm just feeling vulnerable; maybe I just took it the wrong way..." When in fact, I was being targeted by a sustained hate campaign.

I started to suffer from panic attacks on my walk to work and in the final week I spent there, I vomited in the toilets as soon as I arrived on 3 out of 4 days, through sheer stress and fear. I had become so unwell with the stress that I was hospitalised for 10 days last summer as I was unable to eat or drink after developing a stress-related stomach ulcer.

I left that job a week before Christmas last year - without a new job to go to, knowing that financially, we couldn't afford for me not to be earning, but physically and psychologically, I couldn't cope with any more.

Despite the worry of having to find temping work very quickly (which I did) and the subsequent search and recruitment process for a suitable new full time role (which I found and started 6 weeks ago), when I woke up the day after I'd left, I realised I had started to feel better already. Just a week later, I was able to sit down and eat Christmas dinner with my family - the first full meal I had eaten in nearly a year.

I am a qualified HR Adviser (although the role I was bullied in was a relatively Junior Admin role I had taken as the hours fitted in with school for our DDs), so I have worked in high pressure environments and have had plenty of other employees dislike me before (due to my role) and I had always coped with it without it affecting me. But this was different.

It wasn't until about 2-3 months after I left that I was able to clearly see it for what it was and felt able to admit that; at the age of 38 - I had been bullied. The experience was horrific and I truly wouldn't wish it on anyone.

I'm not shocked by this reporting, but I do understand why, unless it's happened to you or someone close to you, you might not be aware of it. It's because it's humiliating to admit to having been a victim of what we perceive to be a childhood issue.

@BetsyBigNose it isn't a childhood issue. I learnt at the time that most discrimination claims were in fact due to issues around bullying. Unfortunately if your bully or bullies are the same social group as you or for some reason your discrimination isn't covered by the law then you cannot claim discrimination so the only way you can describe it is as bullying.

@ScreamScreamIceCream - I totally agree with you that it's not a childhood issue, but I do feel that bullying is perceived by many to be so. I know I certainly didn't expect to be the victim of bullying as an adult. Maybe I'm in the minority - to be honest, I haven't really talked to many people about it IRL as I find admitting to it quite humiliating and I'd honestly prefer just to forget it ever happened.

I do find it bizarre that it can't be cited as discrimination - what about if the bully is very senior to the victim in terms of the structure of the organisation? Could that be discrimination based on seniority? Ah well, I never intend to take it any further anyway, I'm SO much happier and healthier now I've left and I'm really enjoying my new job - particularly having kind, considerate, helpful colleagues!

I did however, approach the Recruitment Agency the Organisation I had been working for uses to find new employees (I was also temping through them and they had helped me find that job in the first place, so I had an existing relationship with them), and had a quiet word with the Recruitment Consultant once I was clearer about what had actually happened to me. I didn't give them the 'warts and all' tale, but just said that the atmosphere could be difficult, that the role needed someone 'sturdy', and that I had personally found it a very stressful place to work due to some tricky relationships within the relatively small team. I just felt that I had to say something, but was equally aware it might just have been me that they had taken exception to - and just about anyone else might have had a far easier time of it!

I was bullied at work by my female manager, to the point where I attempted suicide. Her actions destroyed my career and severely damaged my health. It’s more than a decade ago but I still feel the repercussions today.

@BetsyBigNose your discrimination must fall within the equality laws.

When I was bullied I got help from random strangers I met through the internet. Two of these ended up having important well-known cases in that sphere because one of their cases at the time wasn't covered by the discrimination laws. (The other person didn't realise she was covered until I pointed it out and then it was too late.) I also ended up getting help from a union, who I later found where helping a few people like me as they were looking for a case to make a legal precedent to help clamp down on employers who bullied staff.

Anyway if you aren't clearly covered by other discrimination laws if your mental health is effected for more than a year and you have medical proof of it then you fall under the Equality Act. Unfortunately if your mental health is effected you are unlikely to be able to fight back so it relies on having a decent employer who will get rid of the one/two individuals who are bullying if it isn't an organisation wide issue. Since there was a legal precedent I've seen it bullies removed a few times in private companies. Smaller companies tend to sack the individual while larger ones tend to restructure them out of the company.

The two times I have felt bullied at work were by other women. Both, funnily enough, trying to assert some sort of power and intimidation.

One I was very young, 17 and on an apprenticeship. The woman I worked with tried to intimidate me on a daily basis. She was about two years older than me and revelled in telling me stories about what fights she had gotten into at the weekend and how thuggish her brothers were. I walked out and nearly lost my apprenticeship because of it even after raising it with my college whilst still placed there.

The second time is in recent years, an older woman this time and I can't even see what the issue was there really. All I can think is we were two different classes doing the same job and due to her superiority she just found it difficult. I am very much working class and got my qualifications on the job. This lady is middle class, did Uni and travelled a lot then got dealt a bad set of cards and so we both ended up doing the same job on the same wage. Over time things have levelled out and we can now appreciate each other but for a period she made my life hell at work.

I also had another experience in the workplace as an apprentice working for a young married man in a family business. His wife took a dislike to me, I can't think of anything I did to warrant it but who knows. I worked very hard there and enjoyed it. I was dragged into college for wearing in appropriate clothes. I covered up following that. The next week I was dragged in and told it wasn't working. I was sacked basically with that being the reason. Unfortunately I think it was the case of me being a young woman working alongside a young married man.

The worst boss- bully- I ever had was a woman. I don't doubt there are horrible bullying male bosses too even though I've never personally encountered one. Bullies take every form.

Well, the article is by someone selling a book. It doesnt sound so great to say, I have worked with lots of women, one or two of whom were a bit much.
She conducted her survey, whilst researching her novel, so it is fair to think that just maybe the questions were slanted in a particular direction, or perhaps used an unrepreantative sample.
I have worked with and for women and men. A few have been arseholes but I see no real correlation with their sex.
My last job had 4 senior managers, 3 of whom were women. They were extremely supportive and fair and gave credit were it was due, and sometimes even where it wasn't. The male SM was also supportive, though perhaps not quite so empathetic.
There was one male manager who was a bit of an arse, but I dont think that was due to his toxic masculinity. And even he was professional.
All my colleagues were genuinely supportive too.
Wht can you extrapolate from that?
Nothing.
I don't believe that this writer can extrapolate any general behaviour from her personal experience.
Bu then, it was in the Mail

@Namechangeishard I totally identify with that feeling of panic if you make a simple error.

My boss is so lovely but the one before him was a narcissist bully. She did a lot of damage before we finally saw her off via a whistleblowing route. I still find it hard to relax at work after years of conditioning.

Anyone who doesn't believe this exists has been very fortunate. Denying it because you haven't personally experienced it is very naive.

I experienced bullying in the workplace and it was soul destroying. I had worked at Director level for over 20 years, I was good at my job and a strong, confident woman. I started a job at a senior level with a new company and the CEO seemingly took a dislike to me for no apparent reason.

He systematically tore me to pieces in every meeting. The other people in these meetings (including my line manager) kept their heads down and studied their feet when this was going on as they were so intimidated by this person. In one meeting I couldn’t stop the tears (i’d never cried in the workplace in my entire career before) but he continued to berate me for 20 minutes in front of everyone even while tears were streaming down my face.

He had a reputation of picking on a person in every meeting in this way and the HR Director even employed a professional coach to provide those of us who suffered with support (this is a listed company in the UK so not an insignificant business).

I eventually had enough and asked my line manager to support me following a particularly bad meeting. 2 days after this I was signed off sick (having never had a day off sick in nearly 25 years) with stress. 2 weeks after that I was called in off sick leave and told I was being made redundant. It was clear that this was because I had brought the CEO’s behaviour to the attention of my line manager and the HR Director.

My final day at this company was last week and i’m now looking for a new job. But, the fact that I don’t have to deal with this person any more is a huge relief.

I don’t think gender comes into it. He happened to be a man but I don’t think that means anything. He was just a person who felt he needed to belittle a person to make him feel good about himself.

The comment about allowing yourself to be bullied is stupid and ignorant. I never thought I would be in that position but when it happens to you then you question everything. Am I imagining it? Am I being overly sensitive? That’s what a bully wants you to think.

There are just some horrible people in the workplace and sometimes you have to just walk away for your own sanity knowing that it’s crap and unfair. I couldn’t control his behaviour but I can control how I deal with it. I may be out of a job for now but i’ve learnt that I will never allow anyone (male or female) to treat me that way again.