To be deeply disappointed in John Cleese

[drspouse]

I have no idea if this is typical but he just tweeted that London isn't an English city any more
What is it then pray tell? What's not English about it??

Oh, right. We’re in “all Muslims are terrorists territory” again, are we?

It’s really quite pathetic that we’re still in this territory. No, no one said anything along those lines. It’s so easy for you to trot out tired out tropes and ask faux-innocent questions rather than engaging with what people actually say. It’s incredibly boring and you’re the problem.

Terrorism should not make us change our behaviour.

You see that as virtue. I see that as weakness.

Well you said that immigration will bring in people who believe that terrorism is a justifiable response to a cartoon, and a list of other behaviours and beliefs which some Muslims hold- so I don’t see how I am not responding to your point.

“Terrorism should not make us change our behaviour.

You see that as virtue. I see that as weakness.”

I don’t understand.

It’s undeniable that some immigrants to the West hold those values, which are incomplete with our own. And it’s a serious problem. I never said they were all terrorists, that most were terrorists, half were terrorists...

It’s undeniable that some immigrants to the West hold those values, which are incomplete with our own.

Two centuries ago, that could have been written in reverse ... it was British emigrants that held values that were incompatible with those of the colonial outpost. Which Britain then proceeded to piss all over and impose "decent British values". Whilst relieving the population of any burdensome wealth they may have accrued.

Now two wrongs don't make a right, but you can see why an immigrant to the UK might think what's sauce for the goose, etc etc ....

Yes I have been to burnt oak, not for about a year after the last of my family moved from there.

Maybe this is the root of some of our ideological differences, then. We approach things from different angles.

You don’t want to change our behaviour in response to a terrorist threat. You see kindness and charity as the highest virtues. I see justice and fairness as the highest virtues. So what do you do when those two compete?

Endless tolerance of intolerance behaviour is not the answer. It’s weakness. It’s profoundly silly and childish. If we do not stand firm behind our Western values, the best values, we’re doomed.

@LaminateAnecdotes

That argument is endlessly trotted out, and I don’t agree with it. They weren’t our sins and we cannot now atone for the past. The people and times have gone.

That argument is endlessly trotted out, and I don’t agree with it.

If only I had said "two wrongs don't make a right" then it would be clear I wasn't advancing it as reasonable.

Bloody MN and it's uneditable posts.

Of course those cartoons were racist, don't be so disingenuous.

Endless tolerance of intolerance behaviour is not the answer.

Good job no-one suggests that then, isn't it.

Of course those cartoons were racist, don't be so disingenuous.

But again you've forgotten to show how. I tried looking in a dictionary, but it doesn't define "racist" as Coz I said so. Twice..

Well my dictionary doesn't.

It's an interesting poster that understands "disingenuous" but not "racist"

This is not racist. It depicts Mohammed pissed off that some of his followers are arseholes.

Karl Marx or Jesus could easily have been substituted with the same line.

Catching back up a little, and I want to defend the rose! - it was Henry VII who invented the Tudor rose, never understood all the fascination with number 8. His spirit was continued with Elizabeth. This was the time of the founding and a golden age of English culture. It was the time of Union after Civil War. I would like to see the Civil War cut out this time.

Why would Yorkshire not like it? Why is Welsh involvement a bad thing? The whole point is that it involves the regions. BertrandRussell's questions are entirely apt. England is variable. It strikes me that only one side is trying to compromise here.

And yes I know Wales is not a region of England, bad phraseology. We need Wales and Scotland as partners. And NI.

It's an interesting poster

Aw thanks

I've no intention of explaining how obviously racist stuff is racist to you. Ta.

It strikes me that only one side is trying to compromise here

On some things, there can be no compromise.

Would you rather have war? Do you even know what that means?

@DarkAtEndOfTunnel

War?

I don’t want us to surrender Western values, because they are good values, and compromise will prove very hard if not impossible.

“It’s undeniable that some immigrants to the West hold those values, which are incomplete with our own”
They are subject to the rule of law. So even if they hold incompatible values, they can’t act on any that conflict with the law.

So which values are you thinking of that you don't want to see compromised? For me it's equality for women for starters.

“Why would Yorkshire not like it?“

Because it’s red!

but how do we deal with situations where the law contradicts itself? Sex, sexuality and religious belief are all protected characteristics, yet clearly in some situations are in direct conflict.

Can you come up with an example? Then i’ll put my Judge Judy head on........