Smacking children "oh everyone does it"

[cantbelieveimhearingthis]

NC for this

So I was on the bus the other day with DD (19 months). Another lady gets on with a pushchair and a little boy, the boy is probably about 2 and a half. Two older ladies then get on and start chatting to the other lady with the pushchair. DD is waving and smiling and the older ladies were commenting on how lovely she was, I said thank you but frankly I'd had a shitty day so just kept my self to myself. They keep talking about children and are clearly trying to get me involved. The other lady with the pushchair and the older ladies get into behaviour and how "naughty" her little boy is. The conversation then turns to the topic of smacking. Older ladies start to agree that nowadays children are too soft and that smacking them does them no harm, but teaches them a lesson. Lady with a pushchair then piped up saying "oh yes when he's naughty I smack him on the bottom, he's got a nappy on so it does him no harm" She then says she threatens her TWO year old with smacking if he doesn't do as he's told. They're now trying to get me involved in the smacking conversation and I'm trying my hardest to be polite. Lady with the pushchair then says "trust me when they start throwing tantrums, smacking is the only thing that works" "everyone does it, they're just too afraid to admit to it". AIBU to be a little bit taken aback by this? I can understand to an extent the older ladies as they were from a different generation. But the other lady blatantly admitting to hitting a two year old?? I thought we had moved past this?

And some of the parents think nothing of being aggressive and insulting towards teachers or other adults.

The threat of punishment is ultimately what forces them to behave themselves.

So many things wrong with this statement I hardly know where to begin...

I don't rob banks, kill people or use violence - not because I am afraid of going to jail, but because I know it is wrong. And this was instilled in me not by violence, but by education and by people leading by example.

Parents who are aggressive and insulting to teachers and other adults have not learned these lessons - and are not likely to teach them to their children. They don't know how.

Lord of the Flies notwithstanding, society does not run on the fear of punishment - it runs on the immediately obvious benefits of collaboration and compromise.

My children behave well in school because they have been taught respect, not because they are afraid of getting a detention. They do not shoplift, because they understand that it is wrong, that it causes losses for shop owners and that it causes price rises for everyone else to cover the loss.

Your world view is utterly dystopian. Fear is not required to instill morals. Religious faith is not required to instill morals.

Mine are still young we use reflection time or timeout on the step for DS when he is on a wild one.
DD would lose privileges, sending her to her room is usual enough punishment, she is the softer child.
OTOH DS is stubborn, tough, he doesn't care about consequences yet.

I don't rob banks, kill people or use violence - not because I am afraid of going to jail, but because I know it is wrong. And this was instilled in me not by violence, but by education and by people leading by example.

Indeed, but if we had a world where there was no consequence for misbehaviour, no job losses, prison, divorce etc I suspect that a huge proportion of people would indeed go around robbing banks and jewellers, stabbing their ememies etc.
All social groups of all species have rules and those rules are enforced with discipline where necessary..

Fucks you accept that hitting your kids causes them pain, fear and humiliation. You also (presumably, as you seem intelligent and articulate) are aware of the many, many studies that have found that hitting is damaging, counterproductive and less effective than other parenting techniques. If not, just Google 'studies on smacking' and look at the summary of every single link on the first page of results.

Presumably, when you hit your kids, you aren't forcing yourself to do it even though there are other parenting techniques you would prefer to use instead? You're doing it because you know that it inflicts pain, fear and humiliation, and you have decided that you want your child to feel those things in the hope that it will cause them to modify their behavior.

That discipline does not have to come in the form of hitting children though... You seem to be implying that hitting children breeds better citizens than not hitting them.

Once again - there is a middle ground between hitting children and wishy-washy permissive parenting - which last I am absolutely not advocating for!

No-one is suggesting that not having laws is a good idea. Just that hitting children isn't a good idea.

Incidentally, Fucks, my DS went through a phase of bad behaviour (including hitting, ironically) when he was around 5. It got to the point where the teacher was raising it regularly, and it was bloody horrible, stressful and frustrating. We tried everything (except hitting him) but nothing seemed to work.

I now realise it was working, just not as quickly as I would have liked. I now have a very gentle, kind DS who behaves well at school because he wants to, not because he's afraid I'll hurt him if he doesn't.

I've never hit. Dd is 17y and no matter what she's done growing up I've never resorted to hitting my child. It's abhorrent to me and I can think of no situation where it would have ever been justified. I'm not overly shouty either. I have reprimanded but never by hitting, screaming or shouting.

I wasn't hit as a child either. But that was more unusual then. Many of my friends were hit. It just didn't sit right with my parents so they didn't.

Almost all friends who are parents I know don't hit. One did when her child was younger but stopped doing so quite quickly when she realised there were other methods of sanctions than the one she was given as a child. One family member hit his child in front of our parents and his parents, and my Dd. Almost everyone in the room was shocked into silence. He and his wife did speak to me after (as my parents Were there and were visibly shocked) and asked me about it and I told them how I felt. They did take this in account and afaik have never hit their second child not the elder since.

Sadly some of the children (infant school) I teach are hit. They tell us. They talk about these things. We've also had other parents report incidents to us that they are aware of. . Any time a child says such we do add a safeguarding note - just in case we need to build a bigger picture. We have some children who we never report wrong doings at school to home as we know how their parents will react.

those rules are enforced with discipline where necessary..

No one is advocating no discipline, just no hitting. It's an easy thing to do - to not hit a child.

Lazy parenting. I certainly feel like smacking him. Walked away plenty of times to stop myself. It just releases the temper of the offender and scare the child.

I also wanted to say the kids that I know who are smacked are really naughty so the "little taps" are not deterring bad behaviour. I don't smack and my little boy is really well behaved at home and school. Parents that smack seem to have lost control of the situation and themselves when they hit, which is pretty scary because the anger is driving the punishment. We were never hit and grew up in the 70's, we were pretty normal kids from a working class northern home and we are decent moral adults.

I was physically beaten as a small child and can even remember my first slap across the face at 4. Sometimes things items like shoes were also used. I didn't understand it and often it was for no reason.

Maybe that explains why I've spent hours crying in my therapists office.

Have never smacked and never will, and I definitely think less of grown adults who hit a child, however they justify it. There is never a good reason for violence, regardless of whether it’s a one-off, a last resort blah blah blah.

@Teacher22

Still, as in the fifteenth century, there is no telling folks that a glass of wine with magic words spoken over it is not actually Jesus’ blood.

Actually, all Catholics believe (and certainly before the 15th c) that we eat and drink Christ's body and blood at each and every single mass. It's called transubstantiation.

Or was this a sly criticism at the 'ridiculousness' of Christian beliefs in an unrelated thread?

Random criticism of Christianity is a knee jerk reflex, regardless of context for some @WhatisFreddoingnow 🤦🏻‍♀️
A vocal tick if you will.

I’m in my 40’s and grew up when snacking is acceptable. I was slapped across the face, hit with slippers, basically bullied into submission.

It’s bullying behaviour and wrong. I still resent my mother for her shit parenting. She still justifies it. Apparently I was lucky as when she went to school she got the belt. It breeds bullying behaviour that fear is acceptable. It’s not. It’s child abuse.